An anime fan alleging that the anime industry has degenerated into nothing but a porn industry has provoked an interesting discussion of the post-moe-boom anime market.
2ch discusses the issue (after illustrating its point):
“It’s become expected for anime to contain ero – to be honest this is pretty weird.
You can’t even show them to children or commoners…”“Actually the anime industry just can’t survive without ero.”
“Late night anime is pretty much based on ero.”
“Even in the otaku market, anime is sinking right to the bottom.”
“Well, an anime like Bakemonogatari couldn’t have sold without the erotic component.”
“One issue is the age of producers – there seem to be a lot of older producers who really do think that normal adults don’t watch anime and that its sales will only be as big as all the bouncing breasts it contains.”
“I think Strike Witches encapsulates the current state of the industry. We don’t really need moe, animal ears and pantsu all over the place, but without it they won’t sell.”
“There were plenty of good older titles which had ero – Cat’s Eye, Lupin, Cobra, etc. What we see now is that these good ero containing anime have died out in favour of moe-anime, now the industry staple.
[…]
The ero-scenes in late night anime are now their main way of attracting audiences, and they are otherwise devoid of content – quite the opposite to how ero-anime of years past handled things.”
“Given the choice between a crap anime with ero and and a crap one without, I’d surely pick the one with.
Rather than being necessary, it’s a necessary evil.”“The people who actually spend a lot on anime are moe-otaku and fujoshi. The ones who always whine about it aren’t the ones actually buying it.”
“But K-ON! and Angel Beats! never even showed any pantsu – makers who say ero is needed to sell are just making excuses.”
“Those titles may not have any direct ero elements, but aside from Ghibli anime (and perhaps including it) they all still rely on appealing to men with romantic elements and bishoujo characters.
We can say they are indirect ero-anime.
Their sales relied on a combination of those elements and good story and composition.”“The issue here is that only moe anime sells. If they don’t build a new layer of non-moetard fans only moe anime will ever be produced.”
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So it's not just this site reporting on mostly ero anime? That's... not good. I understand as well as the next guy that sex sells but sex isn't something that can be readily aired on TV or bought in stores (much like alcohol). Even fanservice has gone too far. It seems more like wank material than anything even remotely important. I understand there are some times where it's unavoidable, like Princess Tutu for example. It has lolis in leotards doing ballet but it also has substance. It's visually and emotionally rich.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I can't remember if there were any ecchi moments in older shows like Voltes V, Kotetsu Jeeg, Mazinger Z or God Sigma... I think the first time I saw naked tits in a mecha show was in Gundam 0079.
“But K-ON! and Angel Beats! never even showed any pantsu – makers who say ero is needed to sell are just making excuses.”
QFT
I feel so isolated now a days. Being a fujoshi is tough. There's just so many anime now a days that's filled to the brim with fanservice. I don't mind some fanservice once in a while, but if feels so awkward and painfully dull (to me at least) watching 15 minutes of tits jiggling and panchira in my face. I don't even mind a whole fanservice episode as long as it's not EVERY episode. They need more balance. Like take Fairy Tail as an example. There's still a decent amount of fansevice, but it has an enjoyable, fun plot and best of all there's some fanservice for girls with Gray-sama!~ (And the other cuties in FT, unintentionally or not.) That's how you do it folks, if you feel you must include fanservice, try to cater to as wide a range you can while still making a quality work.
Just because you can't tell the difference dosent mean there isn't any. At least DBZ and Ranma½ can stand on their own even without the fanservice.
How could Sora no Otoshimono is included ? it is not a porn, but a man way to live . you should have included School days.
I get really tired of explicit anime. You get desensitized to it if there are breasts and panties in every frame. I think if its going to be done it should be more a strip tease than all out exposure. Its more exiting to imagine what isn't shown than to have all of the explicit stuff thrust in your face.
Thats what To Love Ru does well, Lol
8 man ,Vampire hunter D, Akria, Ninja Scroll, Lodoss Wars, Twilight of the Dark Master, X, Golgo 13,* Wicked City*, Crying Freeman*, and many more have euro or sex in them. (*= alright pretty damn close to hentai) But its not the "fanservice" that make these classics great. Excellent storylines, strong characters, great plots and "your not suppose to do that" violence /situation/topic is what made anime great in my opinion. Its the adult anime genera that's being destroyed. I may be showing my age a bit with my examples (which is only a small chip),but what ever happened to that genera? Even the political adult anime is being washed out. Example; what do you think the majority of the old meca anines were based on? While I do enjoy the new gundam and a couple of others, the robo/mecs have gone stupid. Or lets say less intelligent. Better yet "mainstream" to appeal to a wider audience. How do they appeal to everyone? Kids = bold bright colors. Girls= cute happy characters. Guys= jiggle some tits etc. shoot something. Everyone= simple story so you don't need to follow the series to understand it. Now these aren't bad when geared to its specific audience. I like to have a broad collection to direct everyone too. I personality just want some anime to get back into its adult intelligent genera that i feel made it great. rant done!
The thing is, I simply adore 'classics' like Akira, Project A-Ko, Demon City Shinjiku, Megazone 23, Macross DYRL, Otaku no Video etc...
But, I realize that times have changed, the audience has changed and Anime itself has changed.
Most people who complain about Anime today are usually those who have a very strong sense of nostalgia for the 'classics' and are not willing to adapt and accept the change that Anime has gone through.
I mean, I understand that people naturally hate change, but it really does get very tiresome with all the incessant complaining and lack of any constructive criticism.
Being dreadfully frank, there is little that one can do to change the current situation as an individual. If you can't adapt to the 'new' Anime climate, then why continue to comment and get involved with contemporary (mainstream) Anime?
Also, it that hard to like all (at least most) Anime, new and old?
Sorry, forgot to log in. The above comment is mine.
Yep!
Its like this with many people. Sure, we are fine with some sex and nudity. But a lame story is always a lame store.
Project A-ko is a great classic, sexual overtones - yet funny as hell. Only 1-2 nipple slips and pantie shots, which by todays standards, would be a Pokemon Episode. Or even the GAL-FORCE OVA series (Sci-fi - race of women warriors) had far more story than nudity.
Great Anime will always be great... someday, this moe-stuff will collapse and perhaps we'll get some good stuff again. People like Miyazaki will always show how to make a good Anime movie without sex.
Some must-see classics.
Macross : Do you remember love
Wings of Honniamise
Nadia: Secret of blue water
Capitan Tyler
The Last Exile
LAIN
Dominion Tank Police
Ghost in the Shell (Manga, TV series, movies)
Tweeny Witches (Its a fun series)
The list of good stuff is vast... and is what makes Anime worth watching. Too much Moe will only be... well, boring - can't tell the difference between one show and the next.
If you actually bought those "intelligent shows" maybe they would start coming back instead of watching them after the fact right now. There are plenty of good shows out right now, you would know if you actually checked the damn listings. And seriously, anime can do whatever the hell it wants, not everyone wants to watch a bunch of pretentious, depressing, bullcrap.
It's sad but it's true
You obviously have not heard of Durarara.
I kinda agree with some points by 2ch Net-tards...
I'm still disappointed how the Strike Witches franchise as a whole degraded into the usual Ecchi shit when it's not supposed to be...
I mean just look at the OVA. I'm probably one of the few who liked the OVA better.. Who cares if it won't be popular.
But hey, when the girls themselves are walking in undies, people would just slap it as a fanservice show anyway.. who am I kidding?
Anyway, I'm finding myself, watching lesser anime titles these days. They all seem to be about Girl's love pantsu and oppai fest merry go around..
Oh yeah who cares if it's popular? Just make it who cares if it bombs? At least we'll know right? Seriously that's essentially asking them to flush their money down the toilet and jeopardize the jobs of everyone at the goddamn company.
Who cares about the money making~
If you're 100% determined to make an interesting anime, you'll go for it and ignore the fanservice/money making factors.
Anything lesser than 100%, you are likely to be sucked into needing money and alas, slap in some senseless pseudo porn into Strike Witches.
Perhaps your one of those "True Fans" who only watched Strike Witches for the Pantsu Moe Yuri.
Bulk of the people who couldn't care about the anime's theme... Those who don't know jack shit
about it's military genre
But who cares, you're all after the Pantsu anyways.
Strike Witches shouldn't been out of the Illustrations books (or novels) after all.
Who cares about the money making~
Only every company ever.
I don't mind ero content, I don't mind some Anime with overwhelming ero content invading almost a whole season, as long as there are some Anime with a bit of a story, acceptable breast sizes and comedy apart from slipping and ending up in sexual positions. And there are at least some - so Anime are not lost and I'm fine.
And... is it much better with Holleywood Movies, Advertisement, Music Videos, ways celebreties try to get more intention ... [continue if you want]
I don't mind it there either, but still it feels more like a generel developement, than a Anime-thingy...
"The Anime Industry Has Become a Porn Industry, Hasn’t It?"
No. I'll agree to this once I see dicks going in those pussies and fake moanings in my weekly animu show.
Well lets everybody watch RAINBOW everytime I see this show still give me the hope to believe in anime nowdays
inb4
Masses of wannabe intellectuals posting long slandering posts about anime nowadays.
Oh wait. Already happened. :)
Cute 2D girls sell, get over it.
Go read some good books if you are searching for a "intellectual" hobby. Anime is the wrong medium.
WoW~ So Anime is stuck as being nothing more than 2D Girl shit?
It's like saying Writing is meant for Toilet comedy only.
I would like to see more anime without ero like clannad, death note, DBZ, Kaze no stigma and ect. Now as i see anime industry makes not ero anime but more like hentai. I rarely see difference between it. Why can't peaople go to ANN, Anidb, anime-planet and ect. and to look ant the top ratings, there are no ero-anime at the top!!!
Durarara and Star Driver, two recent anime that came out that are awesome, because listening to a bunch of people on the internet with Nostalgia Goggles glued to their head is the beast way to find good shows, just go watch the damn things yourself instead of letting other people do it for you.
Stupid people will always post something stupid...
For people that think anime has too many fanservice:
Then watch something that does not have IT!!!!
Idiots....
ie.
Arakawa Under the Bridge
Tegami Batchi
Bakuman
or
watch something that has a little of it:
The world God only knows
The reason why people think that anime is in such a bad state because they only watch what is popular,
they did not try to even pick an anime that are not very popular.
ie. Setokai Yakuindomo
Green Jokes to the max(since its their theme) and Nudity a little bit but compare to HSOTD it is just shit.
To all people:
Be a little more responsible when posting (specially trash-talk)
To anime fans:
Try to pick less popular series and try to check if it is like those MOE BOOMERS and PORN BOOMERS.
That's true, but more and more anime each season becomes garbage that relies solely on fanservice for ratings. And if the ratings are too low, they will often add fanservice to future episodes just to increase them. Pathetic.
Gee why's that? Because you don't watch or support those shows? Yeah probably, look in the mirror if you want the source of the problem.
They get low ratings cuz they were crap to start with, idiot.
More Hokuto no Ken!
So far, in October, 25 series have stated, excluding the kodomo ones. Out of them, 9 have absulutely no fanservice or moe, 3 more are moe with no fanservice (except Milky Homes and it's ED). So, quit bitching and watch those 9 shows.
Quote for the freaking truth.
people complain about piracy destroy which make anime decrease the anime sale
people complain about moe/ero which increase the anime sale
complain more
we need anime's like darker than black, phantom of requiem and Code Breaker(if they made one)
still anime today's are still fun to wacth, shows likle Yu-Gi-Oh! 5D's reminded me on how cool card games are. though the jump to ero,moe,loli has risen tremendously.
let's just hope in the future we can balance animes not just all ero or ecchi(which is fine for me)
“It’s become expected for anime to contain ero – to be honest this is pretty weird.
You can’t even show them to children or commoners…”
Hmm... waaaaaaaaaat? It's not like boys and girls start masturbating at 18. Nor is ero-anime a direct hentai. What he bishing about?
Hypocrite.
Woooah faggots are out in full force today i see, listen up get over yourselves you pretentious fucktards your anime isnt deep and your not an "intellectual" stop making up names for staple's in anime that have been around for a LONG time, just because there are tits and ass in an anime you wouldn't even like to begin with doesn't make it horrible, seriously you people go on like this is straight up hentai the fan service is there sure but its not nearly as bad as some of you claim it to be grow up man really.
Second, Moe so to speak has been in anime for a long time and making shit up like "the moe boom" or "hentai boom" dose't make it a trend or "boom" has there been more moe anime now than in recent years? perhaps, but to call it a boom is naive beyond all measure these titles are simply getting more attention thus a slight rise in popularity and quantity, less anime this season than you expect? and the majority of them are Harem Ecchi and Moe? recension's happen and the industry can only afford to produce what sells right now the market will broaden in a few years its ok relax the industry is in no danger of death or stagnation its proved its worth in the past.
but i didnt expect much from you guys with this being a sensationalist website and all
pro tip: stop being a faggot and enjoy whats there, moe and gratuitous fanservice have always been a part of anime and probably always will it sells well and will probably save the industry your mecha porn is on the way dont worry
Medium troll template:
1-(Optional)provoke the possible detractors with insults.
2-pretend to know what is the preference of the majority.
3-make seem arguments without base as the only acceptable truth.(insert insults between lines)
4-provoke the possible detractors with insults.
Intellectual or not, at least I can spell and punctuate.
Also, you're wrong, but I'm not interested in educating you.
Except he's actually got a point, a poorly worded point but a point none the less, not all anime has to be this huge pile of pretentious, philosophical, depressing bullcrap, if you want shows you like then support those shows instead of complaining about people who do.
I haven't noticed anyone suggesting that. It also isn't relevant to my disagreement with the 11:14 post.
Are you trying to say that all anime is either ecchi or pretentious? Nonsense.
No, it's saying that hopping to the other end of the spectrum is not the answer, and going from "moe" to "serious" could just as easily hurt the industry.
Can someone tell me what pic 003 is from :)
Sora no otoshimono Temp2
You are pervert lolicon right? the living proof of "the Anime Industry Has Become a Porn Industry" and you are a consumer of this type of pornography...
well, I am a consumer too xD . Welcome to the club.
The older titles one 2ch poster describes above were good titles that featured a little bit of erotic content. Nowadays it's all either moe or shows where all the plot is just excuses to lead up to ero content.
Instead of doing what they can to create clever interesting shows, they just create whatever they think will sell; girls getting half naked through whatever ridiculous circumstances they can think of.
It's one of the reasons I don't watch a lot of the newer "hit" anime. I just can't get into it when all anyone talks about is how much fanservice is in it.
Oh yeah, because the alternative, jeopardizing the entire company and throwing away your money is better right? Go support a non-hit show then to help shows like that come out instead of complaining about people who are actually willing to give money to a work.
>title
Yes, yes it has, Captain Obvious.
anime = Softcore porn?
At this point...
the only thing that can be said for certain about the future is that it will always be shittier than the past. before you know it, anime must contain 99% fanservice, 0,9% environment and less than 0,1% plot -__-
I'm a guy just like 85% of the rest of the posters, so i don't mind a boob here and an ass there in an anime, but when the plot revolves around people losing their clothes for unknown reasons all the time i get bored by it.
That's probably because you only watch what people tell you, go find a listing and you'll find plenty of CURRENT anime that are awesome.