Mangaka: “Anime Pirates are Nothing but Immoral Thieves”

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The mangaka responsible for Kuroshitsuji (Black Butler) has excoriated fans who persist in expressing their love for her works to her whilst blithely admitting to her face never actually paying for them, calling them “thieves” and “morally degraded” whilst exhorting fans to support the works they supposedly love.

Kuroshitsuji creator Yana Toboso is evidently irate at the stream of fan mail she receives which rubs her nose in the fact that paying for the works in question never even enters into the thoughts of the fans in question.

So irate is she that she goes on to deliver a fiery sermon to the wicked infidel who steal her works, explaining matters very simply for the hard of thinking:

I don’t want to preach about illegal copies, but lately things have been getting a bit much. Perhaps it’s because of the summer vacation.

First up, viewing Kuroshitsuji or its sequel on online movie sites other than the official ones is illegal (they are legally viewable on NicoNico Douga though).

And the manga is only legally readable in Japan as the print edition published by Square Enix – downloading it and reading it is illegal as of 2010.

I used to get them before, but lately the frequency has really increased – let me give you a sample of the kind of mail I’m talking about:

“I got it off a friend on a ROM and read it :)”

“I found them all on an overseas video sharing site and read them there :)”

“I became a fan of the second season so I watched all them on an overseas site – they were really funny!”

People often write this sort of stuff – these are undoubtedly crimes. It’s the same as shoplifting or walking out of a restaurant without paying.

If you illegally download or view them, you’re stealing the rice from the bowls of creators and seiyuu – it’s no joke, we’ll starve and die.

“:)” it isn’t.

When I think of the moral degradation of these people I shudder.

People who send me these kind of mails are basically saying: “I really love Kuroshitsuji! But I want the people responsible to work for free, starve, and die! :)”

I really do shudder. I’m really glad they like it, but people are actually working hard to create the things they find so much fun. Can they not understand that?

It’s not only Kuroshitsuji of course. All the manga and anime people are making is a “product.” Anime characters don’t just move around according to their own will.

Together, lots of people have to make a story, the animators have to make thousands of frames, the seiyuu have to add their voices, and together they are making it all exist.

Manga is the same – the writer has to create a story and together with his assistants they make the manga panel by panel.

Everyone has a right to enjoy anime and manga, but we the creators still have to eat to live. Money is necessary to eat. To create the works you so enjoy, in exchange we have to derive our income from viewing fees, DVD sales, manga sales and merchandising – the money we get from this is our wages and how we live.

[… a tale of how little children who can’t possibly afford anime DVDs should use video rental services rather than steal follows…]

So, if you have no money, is it OK to watch for free?

The answer is “No.”

In the words of a certain steely fellow, this violates the Law of Equivalent Exchange!

If you keep ignoring this, eventually the anime and manga in question really will stop being made.

[…]

Illegal movies and downloads are absolutely no good at all!

She can perhaps be forgiven for treating her readers as being intellectually stunted, given that an increasing proportion of anime fans the world over seemingly have great difficulty comprehending that anime and manga are not in fact charity works they are entitled to view for free, but instead can only exist as multi-million dollar commercial enterprises dependent upon direct financial support from fans.

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527 Comments

  • I’m always amazed that these threads go on for hundreds of comments. Only one is needed, really:
    “I don’t want to pay for anime/manga because I find it inconvenient to do so for any one of a number of reasons.”
    The rest is details.

  • Seriously, I think alot of readers would like to support the writers. Honestly I read a ton of manga however I can’t read jap lol. Learning it is totally not worth the time, money and effort. Not to mention that kinda skill really goes away if you don’t use it everyday. Plus who wants to read something and find a word they don’t understand and then read a dictionary to find it… Anyways off topic. Maybe if many of these sites we read from had a direct accesss to these writer’s websites and allow us to donate to them they might be a bit happier. I think they will find that they have alot more oversea supporters or supporters in general than they think. =)

  • This must be the STUPIDEST argument EVER.
    She doesn’t earn AT ALL everything by selling books or DVD.

    There’s TONS AND TONS AND TONS of merchandise with Kuroshitsuji. I’m SURE she could survive on just that.
    If she were to share Kuroshitsuji for free everywhere but make people pay for merchandise AND make merchandise more available for non-japanese-people…

    She’s make a fortune. HONESTLY.

    It’s time to give up on the hunt for people who are too lazy to go to their local library and just borrow the books/dvds/cds/manga.

    It’s time to earn money soley from concerts/merchandise/special editions, etc.

    STUPID ARTISTS WHO ARE STUCK IN THE OLD THINKING!!!

  • Oh’boy there they go again… sigh, well do they even realise that in some countries it is almost IMPOSSIBLE to get any legall stuff. For student who does live only with support of goverment and dosn’t have stable job it is way too pricey.

  • How about this: I enjoyed me some Sundome on Mangafox, but it got taken of from there. Well, I live in germany and there was still no Sundome over here so I was doing my Google search for other sources when amazon.de told me “Hey, you can get this book by us and can even pay in โ‚ฌuro.”
    Me: “Hey, sounds great, but Where is the rub?”
    “Well, it’s still in english…”
    Me:”That’s even better ๐Ÿ˜› *buy*”

  • i still say mangakas create their own paypal account so if pirates too ugly to get out of their homes to buy the mangas/animes want to support the author, they can just donate to the paypal.

    how come they dont try this?

    selling through publishers is bullshit anyway.

  • Also, I think you all forgot that this was DIRECTED TOWARD THE JAPANESE FANS/READERS.
    So all of you people here, that arent in japan,cant speak japanese, and/or arent japanese then you had/have no reason to have read this post. Neither did I, but I didnt know it was from her blog.

    Really, it was in her blog originally and SOMEONE translated it and posted it here?They didnt need to at all ;/ It was for the people of Japan.

    So all of you, stop bashing on this poor mangaka.You dont know what she went though.I dont either, but I acknowledged it when reading a translation of one of her posts.

    And for those who are insulting Kuroshitsuji, and/or say its a bad anime, I suggest you dont do that.Sure you all have your own opinions, but you need to have respect for even things you dont like and if you dont like it, you shouldnt have came here in the first place. And Kuroshjitsuji isnt bad either >.>” It has wonderful art, designs, and its very informative and historical(and dark which I like ;D )
    And it isnt gay ._.’ Stop calling it that, because it isnt even meant to be yaoi.Thats just some fans imagining things. Gosh, cant an evil demon butler and a 13 year old noble and cruel child have an amazing unreachable,unobtainable, sophisticated bond?-_-‘ Master and butler, prey and predator. Gosh

    I cant believe people would be rude enough to insult a show they dont like when they could be spending their time on something they do like.

  • “does she not grasp that a lot of people buy the volumes which is what she makes the money from. Or will buy the box sets if they like it? There the real fans the ones that dont are pirates.”

    You are wrong.She knows fully well that the money she gets is because of the people that buy the volumes.
    Also, I mainly think she is talking to the people of Japan because, not most of the Kuro stuff are even here yet…and she most likely already knows that. Shes not stupid.She is very intelligent.Trust me, I read her blogs enough to know what an intelligent woman she is.But of course…someone had to translate it for me and others to read ^o^’

    Of course, not all of us have money to buy the things that we want.We will buy it when we can.This should be taken directly to the ones that CAN be able to buy the items. She was trying to point out, that she and the anime staff work VERY HARD for the series.All anime staff do.But even so,the anime staff is right now working EXTREMELY hard to make this second season for Kuroshitsuji good.To make the animation at its best, and for others to enjoy so that when they can buy it, they should.
    I mean, seriously.When the first season ended, this poor mangaka got hate mail just because it wasnt exactly a happy ending(but it wasnt so bad either). Also, when the second season was announced, she also got an even LARGER amount of hate mail just because people thought two of their favorite charactes wouldn’t be in that season…they loved the characters soo much…but they didnt need to bash her for it. 1) because no one even said they wouldnt be in it.2) shes the one who made this wonderful creation Kuroshitsuji in the first place, so they shouldnt’ve been complaining if they didnt get what they want.It was was probably some people in Japan because I doubt any of the fans here where I live know her e-mail o-o”
    Anyway, my point is, she and the anime staff got SOOOO much UNNECESSARY hate and/or dislike just because the fans didnt get what they wanted to happen, and they tried to make up for all of the sadness of the fans by THINKING UP and actually creating a season 2 for all of these people that like, or rather, LOVE it sooo much that they stick up for their favorite characters and bash the creator(but seem to forget shes the one who made them in the first place).
    So I can see why she could be upset with the people who have money and dont buy the merchandise.They went through soo much…

    If you disagree with me, why dont you try switching places with the animators and try creating hundreds or thousands of frames or also worse, being in this poor mangaka’s place getting hundred and hundreds of hate mail from fans that send mail that are SOO long, that the scroll bar is less then 2 or 1 cm.Try actually being able to read all of them, and despite the fact you want to tell your fans the truth, you cant because it would reveal things that shouldnt be said before the season airs.Try being able to deal with that, and even almost cry.Its a horrible feeling for her I imagine D; But she tried to act as if it was nothing and she dealt with it!

  • does she not grasp that a lot of people buy the volumes which is what she makes the money from. Or will buy the box sets if they like it? There the real fans the ones that dont are pirates.

    • “does she not grasp that a lot of people buy the volumes which is what she makes the money from. Or will buy the box sets if they like it? There the real fans the ones that dont are pirates.”

      You are wrong.She knows fully well that the money she gets is because of the people that buy the volumes.
      Also, I mainly think she is talking to the people of Japan because, not most of the Kuro stuff are even here yet…and she most likely already knows that. Shes not stupid.She is very intelligent.Trust me, I read her blogs enough to know what an intelligent woman she is.But of course…someone had to translate it for me and others to read ^o^’

      Of course, not all of us have money to buy the things that we want.We will buy it when we can.This should be taken directly to the ones that CAN be able to buy the items. She was trying to point out, that she and the anime staff work VERY HARD for the series.All anime staff do.But even so,the anime staff is right now working EXTREMELY hard to make this second season for Kuroshitsuji good.To make the animation at its best, and for others to enjoy so that when they can buy it, they should.
      I mean, seriously.When the first season ended, this poor mangaka got hate mail just because it wasnt exactly a happy ending(but it wasnt so bad either). Also, when the second season was announced, she also got an even LARGER amount of hate mail just because people thought two of their favorite charactes would be in that season…they loved the characters soo much…but they didnt need to bash her for it. 1) because no one even said they wouldnt be in it.2) shes the one who made this wonderful creation Kuroshitsuji in the first place, so they shouldnt’ve been complaining if they didnt get what they want.It was was probably some people in Japan because I doubt any of the fans here where I live know her e-mail o-o”
      Anyway, my point is, she and the anime staff got SOOOO much UNNECESSARY hate and/or dislike just because the fans didnt get what they wanted to happen, and they tried to make up for all of the sadness of the fans by THINKING UP and actually creating a season 2 for all of these people that like, or rather, LOVE it sooo much that they stick up for their favorite characters and bash the creator(but seem to forget shes the one who made them in the first place).
      So I can see why she could be upset with the people who have money and dont buy the merchandise.They went through soo much…

      If you disagree with me, why dont you try switching places with the animators and try creating hundreds or thousands of frames or also worse, being in this poor mangaka’s place getting hundred and hundreds of hate mail from fans that send mail that are SOO long, that the scroll bar is less then 2 or 1 cm.Try actually being able to read all of them, and despite the fact you want to tell your fans the truth, you cant because it would reveal things that shouldnt be said before the season airs.Try being able to deal with that, and even almost cry.Its a horrible feeling for her I imagine D; But she tried to act as if it was nothing and she dealt with it!

  • Without online manga and anime I will not discover them and will never be enthusiastic to buy those.

    But some are so abusive. I understand that some are poor and other countries’s customs are corrupt but I hope they buy and support the creators if they have saved money because everyone even the creators are deserving to live and have a mutual benefit.

  • “We don’t sell to them, but if they get it, they steal!”

    Not really unexpected from the producer of such commercial clichรฉ crap.

    Dear mangaka, go fuck yourself.

    by: A thief who stopped watching your work in 5 minutes after starting.

  • Here’s the deal, when they stop charging an arm and a leg for their works, I’ll start buying them.

    The average anime DVD around here costs twice as much as a new release movie, and they’re USED.

    Also, there is never any stock, finding what you want is impossible.

    And let’s not forget that English releases 90% of the time are fucked up.

    Lastly if the creators are going to have that sort of attitude I’m not going to help them out.

  • I’ve read all I can of Kuroshitsuji online. I will admit to this but I also have the first two manga volumes sitting on my desk and am waiting for the rest to be released as I WILL buy it.
    Bottom line is, Kuro isnt the usual kind of manga I read and if I hadn’t read any I wouldn’t have bought it at all.
    I’m also waiting on the anime to be released here too!

  • Seems perfectly reasonable. Just let me find the latest english translated volume in the bookstore closest to me. Wait, what’s that? You haven’t released any mangas in fucking Norway? But, I though- Oh, right. You expect me to wait untill manga is popular here. That’d only take a few decades, tops! Gosh jolly, that’s way better than me getting my manga whenever I want it, at no real expense to you. Thanks.

  • kajunbowser says:

    I’m so fukken tired of hearing this “_ pirates are ______” B.S. These Japanese ppl bitching about piracy aren’t exactly fresh fallen snow when it comes to this issue. There are pirated copies of American movies and TV shows lurking their particular area of the internets as it stands (that means the 2chan moralfaegs as well).

    …It’s not like I don’t care about the ppl who make the anime, or anything, but G-damnit!

  • There’s a key point that a lot of the anti-piracy people seem to be overlooking. They shouldn’t be assuming that everyone who pirates is a lost customer. The fact of the matter is that most of those people wouldn’t pay for their manga or anime either way, even if free downloads weren’t available. In that sense, they’re not post customers, because they had to potential to be customers in the first place. The only difference is that they will watch/read the anime/manga if it’s available for free, and they won’t if it’s not.

    On the bright side, you’re also much more likely to get word of the series out to the general public with fansubs/scans. The only lost money is the (very) rare fan that would have paid for the series if it wasn’t available for free. In the long run, fansubs/scans help create MUCH more potential customers than they drive away. Fun fact: Licensors actually look at what series are popular amongst the online community to decide what they want to license.

    Living in San Francisco, a city where anime is mainstream because of fansubs/scans, I can honestly say that fansubs/scans are very beneficial to the industry. The gas/rent/taxes here are some of the highest in the U.S., yet shops that primarily sell really expensive anime figures are still thriving. These types of shops sure as hell would not have been practical if there were no fansubs/scans to let people know about the anime/manga that are out there.

  • This is going to seem a little odd…

    When I watched Shakugan no Shana at a friend’s house, I got addicted. Soon as it came out in the states, I bought it. I got into online manga viewing at one point, but the series I read and liked I bought. I bought Shana, Haruhi Suzumiya, Rosario + Vampire, Mamotte Shugogetten, etc. because I liked the series and had the money. Eventually I went so far as to buy the entirety of Hakoiri Devil Princess in Japanese and had it imported (cost about $100, but I did it all the same). While I agree that pirating is wrong even in my case, some sales never would have been made without the online libraries in the first place. What we need is for the US and Japanese companies to work together for a solution rather than bitching about the problem.

    I vote for a pay-site managed by the publishers. It looks like the whole world is trying to switch to E-books anyway.

  • Tch, I’ll buy the anime and manga when they finally stop taking 3+ years to bring it to US; and not suck in translation.

    I do buy the manga/anime after checking out the scans/subs though… The difference in translations… so different… so different…

  • โ€œI found them all on an overseas video sharing site and read them there :)โ€

    โ€œI became a fan of the second season so I watched all them on an overseas site โ€“ they were really funny!โ€

    ^^^^WAIT….WHAT???!^^^^^
    A few thoughts come to my mind:

    If the original content(manga/anime) is from japan, and said fan that wrote the comment is from japan, than why is this fan reading/watching the content on an “Overseas” site!!!???
    Because “Overseas” sites normally have said content(manga/anime) in a language other than native Japanese.

    FISH SMELLS FISHY!!!

    IMHO If I am a Japanese Pirate, i would look up said content on a native site first before venturing out to other(Overseas) methods(sites), simply because it would be ten times easier to find than looking for it on an “Overseas site, in a language other than my own!”

    FISHY

    i say:
    -the “fans” that sent her the emails are Japanese NEET trolls, trying to draw more attention to overseas piracy.
    -Or she is making it all up, trying to draw attention to overseas piracy.

  • Dear Author:

    No one forced you to be a mangaka.

    If you really are that afraid of starving and dying, although we all know you just are afraid of not being able to buy yourself another summer house this year, then get yourself another freakin’ job.

    Yours Truly, Me.

  • a thief steals, to steal is to remove someones property, we don’t actually remove something. in other words, thieves isn’t the correct term.
    immoral? sure, thieves? fuck no.
    also, if we buy the series once it’s licensed in our countries, we have done nothing wrong.

  • I’m glad they’re cracking down on this. If piracy becomes to common comic book author will just say, “forget it. I’m not putting my time and effort into something that’s just going to get ripped off.”

  • That lady sold 2,169,658 tankoubons of Kuroshitsuji in 2009 only. At 590 yen / piece that’s about 1,280 million yen profit. What is an average year salary in Japan? Like 3 million? That would be 0.25% or so, only from the profit from tankoubons. If she is starving to death then she realy should have a talk with her (frikin rich, I bet) publisher and not blame her fans. Who does she think sends her all that money if not her fans?

    • The average salary man likely makes far less than 3 million yen per year, as that comes out to about $34,500 at the current exchange rate. But yes, this really is more about the publishers paying their talent an insultingly small amount of money for every book sold than piracy.

    • me again.

      I read Kuroshitsuji online, though my country is going to release the second or third manga volume in a few weeks.
      I simply don’t want my country’s mangas, quality isn’t that good imho. This way I do more damage to my own countrys economy as to Japans. Of coure Japan is missing money for licences, but the home economy looses a bit more.

      Japanese should first deal with their own pirates since they are the once who are aimed for moonspeak manga. The chance a western kid would buy a moonspeak volume is very low. They aren’t even concidered in their market. So why do they cry so much about overseas pirates? I even bought one japanese volume of Kuroshitsuji just to do the artist justice. (I know it’s not much. hm.. does th eexpensive PVC count?)
      The overseas pirates are the ones that get cought up in a series and buy merchandise and stuff. Only because we find out about a series online. We fill in a little bit of the financial gab that their own prirates open.

      Though I still think pirating is in fact a crime. I’m a artist myself. ( a very small one) I can understand her. Illustrators get ripped of thanks to the internet. I’m with two colums, but… it’s a hard subject.

      (sorry if ther eare spelling mistakes)

  • As a manga Writer myself,I think shes right to say their thieves.If we dont allow these guys grow,we can expect Lazy and underdeveloped manga as a prize for our ignorance.

    I dont see how people still think they can call themselves fans when their not even able to pay a small price for a comic book.I never had a problem with it myself.And I dont have a large income.

    And no one on scanlations side everthink about the quality of manga going down.lesser income means lesser budget,means lazier art,means less sustenance.

    Can you live with your laziness enough to know that this will inevitably keep manga in obscurity?

    • [quote]Can you live with your laziness enough to know that this will inevitably keep manga in obscurity?[/quote]
      Dunno. Most manga titles are not available in my country. Since I can’t buy it you have lost exactly 0. Not that I read bazillion mangas anyway. I’d like to have a โ€œBastard!!โ€ one but…

  • Buy them? where? that’s the question isn’t it…. The fact that most mangas are not available outside Japan never entered her silly head….

    Maybe that’s why I never bother to read her works….
    They lack intellect.

    And if you bought them off E-Bay or Amazon you get damaged goods….

    Or never get the goods at all!

    So she should be contented that Japanese fans pay. At least she still gets to eat. There are thousands more that don’t.

    Piracy is illegal yet sometimes the only viable option…. Unless of course she sells them online herself…

  • People who wrote stuff like

    โ€œI got it off a friend on a ROM and read it :)โ€
    โ€œI found them all on an overseas video sharing site and read them there :)โ€

    TO authors are just plain stupid, For God Sake why the hell you (in list of support) tell the god damn thing where did ya get it :/ Damn they forget their brains or what?

  • ooooh the heat of the dicussion. I like it!

    You guys pretty much pointed the essential here. You usually don’t have those available worldwide, when it is available it’s for a few countries. I myself would have to buy many stuff from the US if I wanted translated stuff. And English isn’t even my primary language.

    Aside from availability there is the pricing problem. I’m not that restrained money-wise but I don’t plan to drop liking anime anytime soon but I do plan to have kids at some point when I finish my studies and have steady earnings. Now, buy a manga or give comfort to your kids? Though choice huh? It’s also a matter of priorities.

    Still, I always try to support the creators with my wallet. Maybe she should add a paypal donation button on her page (in English so we can understand). It’s fairly easy to blame file sharing on low revenues and yell how evil pirates are but can you provide the means for those people to support you?

    Note: I posted this twice and even though I tried another reply and it worked this one doesn’t seem to post. This is annoying ;(

  • Honestly, I agree with her. With Black Butler freely available in the US, if your going to pirate that stuff, at least have the decency to support the creator (as in BUY THE F***ING MANGA). I wonder how many blows to the head it took for the people who sent her the fan message equivalent of “I love your work, but not enough to pay for it!”, because honestly, that’s worse than receiving no fan messages at all. Its like if a farmer opened their grain silo, and found it empty, except for a note from the mice essentially saying “Great grain! k thanks bye!”
    People who have some moral decency (the people who say “I illegally download the manga/anime now, but if there’s ever a official release I’ll support it”) I can stand, but these people are truly Moral-less slobs, and I can see why 2chan hates them with a passion.

    PS. end of rant, I’m all out of preaching power.

  • im a mangaka. after printing cost, editors cost, marketing cost, and more. my book is being sold for about $10.00, i get only $0.30 for each book. Sites like onemanga doesn’t make me money. Yes, agree about learning the language and/or buying the product.

    Everyone can buy overseas, you got internet. there are plenty of multi-language dealers on the web.

    Stop making excuses for stealing. its not the dealers fault. Some think its not worth bringing over. Write to them expressing your interest in a product. I/We work hard for ya’ll entertainment.

    • It’s worth noting that like someone calculated earlier in the thread, the first tankubon imported from Amazon.jp would cost an average of $40.00 after shipping, with the costs of shipping averaging out to the same cost as the book only at the $200.00 mark. That’s $100.00 of shipping for $100.00 of books. In case you’re too naive to figure it out, most sane people are not willing to spend that much money on comics. And that is entirely the distributor’s fault.

    • Go digital, sell one book for $1, keep $0.60 and everyone wins. You get twice as much, everyone can buy it easily and for $1 people (or at least I) would buy it like crazy.
      And, oh please, don’t use that typical japanese excuse that it’s difficult. Because it’s very easy.
      Look ad Bandai Chanel. It works, it’s cheap, japanese companies would be making fortune from it if they would make it available from outside Japan. But it was “difficult”. Then Crunchyroll came and guess what, it was not difficult for them.

    • who is this? i approve of your speaking out.

      i buy manga, i really do, when it gets here. but it doesn’t. i even go out of my way to go overseas to buy it in bulk.

      but i would politely like to remind you that some manga becomes popular only after we see it on sites like onemanga. we buy it after.

      i know you don’t have a lot of control over the publishers, but you are the mangaka, you should have some say in all of this right?

  • ‘If you want quality manga and anime to continue, start buying it and stop stealing it. ‘

    Actually, I could live without manga so long as the local girls keep dressing up in cosplay.

    I think I should spend my money buying costumes for the local cosplayers.

  • ‘anime and manga are not in fact charity works they are entitled to view for free, but instead can only exist as multi-million dollar commercial enterprises ‘

    So wait.

    Manga requires millions of dollars?

    Funny, my friend just drew a manga with a pencil and some white paper.

    She seems broke all the time. She works for less than $10 per hour.

    She’s had millions of dollars all this time and she never told me!

  • She could make a PayPal account and the overseas fans could pay/donate her this way. The “pirate” scans exist and will exist and the fans cannot buy it overseas so why not get money from donations at least…
    There are solutions for such thinks, it’s just the Japanese marketing sense…
    If Wikipedia can exist just with donations… Theoretically mangakas could post mangas online for free (they would be free either way on other sites) and get payed from donations – who knows maybe they would get much more money from this ?? – the problem is they have to try it first

  • I pay $30NZD for each manga volume I get. ($21 USD) and they come out months after the rest of the world get them. You want me to not pirate stuff? How about make it affordable instead of costing 75% of my grocery money for a week, getting it released in other countries in the same damn year or even making an online service?

    I’d be willing to pay for it if it wasn’t so expensive or so poorly translated or so late.

  • What we need is digital distrbution of manga and anime in a way that feels like the current “free” ways ( I mean being able to download it and watch it whenever you feel like it or save a page you liked.

    I would be happy to pay monthly like for example 20 english pounds per month to have full access to any manga or anime I was interesed at with the proper subs and text translation that is done by funs and not commercial american translators that make it look and sound shit

    when crunchyroll first became a site with subscription I bougth without hesitation an one year subscription but to my huge dissapointment in order to protect the episodes from being “stolen” crunclyroll made the episodes problematidc to view for legal payers with the video loading forever or being easily interupted and having to load all over again etc…

    Seriously screw you guys responsible for the ultra slow release of japaneise merchandice out of japan, I am still waiting for KH: birth by sleep for PSP here. what sort of thing makes you needing over 9 months to translate a game to englisha nd add english voice overs (personaly I would be fine with japanese voices and english subs, the game is not meant for ages unable to read anyway)

    • I actually imported that game hoping to play through it in Japanese since it was such a long gap between the original release and the US translated one, only to discover that they made the battle system frigging crazy complicated. My kanji reading is still terrible (been lazy about studying) and so I had to shelve it until the English release comes out and I can learn how to play it. The sad thing is, Squeenix strips out the Japanese language track every time, regardless of how many fans beg for it to be dual-language or if the medium has the space for it. I really hope some more progressive people take over the company when the old farts in charge finally die out, because it’s getting pathetic at this point.

  • it’s not that i don’t want to buy it. i can’t fully understand japanese, and the american companies KILL the translation. if they actually put effort into the subs, i would buy my favourite animes/mangas without hesitation.

  • When I saw the headline, I was like “who was it that said this?”

    “The mangaka responsible for Kuroshitsuji…”

    The very same instant my eyes crossed those words, I brought DomDomSoft Manga Downloader to the foreground and queued it up.

    Suck it.

  • It’s depressing how many people lack the ability to read something in context, then go on tirades about how watching != stealing so it’s not wrong, or how the industry hurts itself and deserves what it gets.

    It’s plainly obvious that she’s addressing Japanese fans and probably 75% of these posts are off topic given the context (and have been repeated 100x anyway).

  • Are you all really that bad at reading comprehension?

    Let’s establish a few things:

    1. This essay is directed towards JAPANESE READERS in JAPAN. It is not an judgement about Foreign readers. She wouldn’t see any of that money anyway, and for the most part is commenting about how wanton Japanese thieves are.

    2. This means that, wherever the fuck you live in the world, if it isn’t Japan, this DOESN’T APPLY TO YOU. You can still support her (and any mangaka) by importing the Japanese tankobon, but even buying a translated copy in your country gives her no money. She gets zippo royalties from licensing.

    3. Stop acting like you’re oppressed and deserve things for free because you live somewhere you can’t buy it. That’s your country / region’s fault, not the author of a comic published in Japan for a Japanese audience. Mangaka rarely realize or take into account that they have American / Foreign readers. They don’t ever enter in the equation. Anyone not Japanese is a ‘secondary’ audience that never effects publication, story decisions, or anything of the like.

    4. If you want digital distribution, stop whining to Mangaka about it. It’s the publishing company that controls it, not the author.

    • 1. Shift blame for piracy overseas away from Japan

      2. Raise prices for manga and DVDs and use the excuse of overseas pirating as a scapegoat.

      3. ????????????

      4. PROFIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • 1. Most of us know this. But talking about overseas implies, well, overseas don’t you think?

      2. They don’t get much from the copies that do sell, the way I see it. Part of the problem.

      3. That is their fault then, for not opening their eyes to a large market that is obviously here. If they are too stupid to see the scan sites and all the hits they get, how is that our fault? The publisher will not change their ways, then it’s IS up to the creator to see their work pushed elsewhere.

      4. See above. If the creator actually steps up, they could get their work out there but instead, they let themsleves fall into place, not making waves.

      • Again, you (and quite a few others) are assuming that Japanese mangaka (or comic writers in the West, as well) have the freedom to do what they want with their property.

        Instead, they agree in writing to produce this item for their publisher. If the publisher is unhappy, the item is unpopular, or the writer wishes to quit, moving / taking the property elsewhere is next to impossible. There have only been maybe 1 or 2 manga that have successfully switched publisher. Once the manga is completed, the mangaka really only gets royalties from it–they don’t really get to ‘pick’ how the manga is distributed.

        Could a mangaka clamor for digital distro? Sure. But could it do any good? That depends on their parent publisher. And they do make money from Japanese copies, but it’s minor in comparison to getting paid for doing the work to begin with (although, it is still payment). But overseas / licensed sales go directly to the licensing company, meaning the Japanese end of the deal really sees no money at all past the initial purchase.

      • 1.Stop trying to figure out the audience and understand the point that the mangaka doesn’t like her works being read for free and being told they like it, when not paying a yen/penny for it.

        2. Manga DO GET paid something through royalites. Expecting mangaka to take all of it is unrealistic since there are people who working in publishing,marketing,and distribution that help get her work known and distributed out there. Do you think they do everything themselves?

        Not buying only means they will get less.

        3. Publishers are not blind, they know we live in a global economy. And there has always been an effort to get things out. But just because a lot of people like manga doesn’t translate into a lot of people buying manga.For Instance, in the US, convention attendace has increased but sales are on the decline..
        If you want a market to exist, “put your money where your mouth is” and buy what you can locally or online.

        4. Square Enix is experimenting with online distribution. If they succeed they could possibly spread this across the world. It might be awhile to really get things going since it’s fairly new, but it’s a step in the right direction, so get some patience.

  • it really kinda sux for people like me in newzealand
    where anime is not screened on tv and the only manga libraries and shops stock are
    naruto and onepiece
    YANA, IM SORRY, I WOULD BUT I CANT
    also how long would i have to wait for official english subs of kuroshitsuji 2? =__=

    if u like anime/manga whatever
    DONT COME TO NEW ZEALAND

  • This is a time of change.

    We, as the “Consumer” have by far the most power to “Vote with our Dollars” for what we want to see in the “Mass Media”. No more choosing from the sludge that some CEO upchucked from deliberately cherry picked mediocre artists while keeping the good ones out of the stores, TV, radio, etc.

    They don’t have as much money as they used to and government bailouts are stretched thin. Keep bleeding them, by not buying their products and getting others to go to “Independants” we’ll kill them off.

    I am totally for “Supporting what you like”. If you do like this particular Manga, you should support it. Now, if you’ve already downloaded the whole series, I’m not saying buy them all (and pay a second-hand market scalper that’ll not give them a penny) but rather “Donate” to them. Don’t, necessarily, admit “Stealing” the companies do have lawyers and huge beuracracies. But if you indeed like truly what they make, send $ to them, say a money order in the mail from a “Guilty Fan” not directly saying anything. (1) $5, $10, etc. as a “Tip”.

    The fans can now make and break the publishers.
    I don’t even advocate “Stealing” their work, it argues it’s value, if you don’t like it. Look up “Independants” and support them directly.

    And all publishers have to realize that no matter how they dress up their productions, they are “Busking”. The age old practice of playing a flute on a street corner hoping passerby in appreciation of your music (2) will toss you coin.

    Publishers won’t like it. That’s the idea. They think this is rough? Try “Singing for your supper” through the Dark Ages and loving every minute of it! I’m from a “Bardic” line and my family did that. Then when the “Modern” age came, we were “Kept out” of the “Mass Media”. They hated the bards, the storytellers, etc. They just wanted bland, vapid music and pointless wastes of time to keep the public nullified and make $.

    See, the real “Problem” with the “Mass Media” is that too many “Pigs that feed off the labor of others” have controlling interest in it. Remove the “Big Money” and the ones who only produce shows to get rich and want to be stars to get money will run. They will run like a bunny at a fursuit lifestyler convention!

    The ones that remain will be those with “The Muse” and they will prosper. Modern technology has expanded the game, and matured enough that most anyone can afford it, so musicians, thespians, artists have options undreamed of in the past. What is needed is to take down the “Big Players” who’ve held the Muse hostage for so long.

    1 – Does the Japanese post-office shit their pants and whine over “Cash in the Mail”?
    2 – Or pities you, wants you to shut up if only for a minute…:-)

  • When publishers stop telling me that they’re using anime/manga created by artists to make money by selling useless merchandise I’ll start feeling bad about stealing the one product of their franchise off of which they didn’t expect to make any money.

  • You know who has to come out and say it for me to actually feel something …? MASASHI KISHIMOTO when he says something I will continue to read My already earned 35 volumes of his manga but this kan a can of whatever you NO YOU! see you You can go fuck yourself. You want your shit to sell write a better story and manga You like yaoi fine then go make some hentai doujinshi till then shut the fuck up and try a better way to guilt trip me next time

    • Better idea, stop teaching Japanese. 57% of the world speaks English either as a primary or secondary language. Japan needs to catch up and the best way to do that is ditch their language composed of stolen Chinese symbols.

  • BAAAAAAAAAAAAAW! Sounds like someone doesn’t have a good view on fair exchange between japan and the outside world.. Her words make no difference to me whatsoever.. besides.. if you live in Canada you can download as much as you want and there’s not a damn thing the MPPA or RAA or any other company can do about it! Because they already get allowances in forms of taxes from the government more it!! HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA! EAT SHIT.

  • i read this in 2 ways.

    BAWWW my homoerotic art style with a shota lead that inspires legions of shotacon works is so popular in places they aren’t sold, how dare they not buy it from glorious nipon and import to there lesser country.

    but than i read it as a 5 year old who doesn’t know how there little industry works throwing a tantrum. WHY AREN’T YOU GIVING ME YOUR MONEY [feet stomping] IF YOU WANT TO READ MY WORK THAN PAY ME [tears] MY WORK COSTS (cant find the pack page of the japanese version, add its price here) GIME GIME GIME.

    until these mangaka know how much money they are fucked out of by publishers (im assumeing they tell them they would have metric fucktons more if foriners payed for it, instead of saying we only give you 10% most likely less of domestics sales value and next to if not nothing of international)

    until than these mangaka can go fuck themselves. am i stealing, probably, should i have to? no, i believe people everywhere would benifit from an online viewer that advertised set up by publishers.

    stuck in old business models and the like, i have no sympathy for them even as i pirate everything they draw.

    • Stop trying to justify your crimes. If you can’t pay for a legit copy, don’t read and watch. Simple as that. All the bullshit you spew is besides the point. You’re the one whining like a brat.

    • Stop reading manga then you asshole, stick to reading your own crap. Am Japanese and am not racist i don’t care if other people read manga but pay for it, if you want to read the manga or watch the anime, am sure in america they sell lots of anime things, stop stealing my countries stuff.

  • No it does not violate the law of equivalent exchange and the fact that we CAN watch it proves it. We spend our time to find a site that can let us view the anime. We spend our time to turn on the computer and wait for that slow thing to load. We watch lower quality anime than on TV (Unless you download it, which is gonna have to take more time). And according to Benjamin Franklin, “Time is money” so WE DID PAID AFTER ALL!!

    Everything comes at a price, but it doesn’t mean that someone will have to benefit from it or someone will have to suffer. Please refrain from using that law if you have no idea what it means. In other words. “Don’tz go all philozophy onz meh!!”

    • So don’t whine when someone steals your wi-fi/comic books/food/car/money because IT TOOK MAJOR TIME AND EFFORT TO STEAL YOUR SHIT K I DON’T CARE HOW LONG AND HARD YOU WORKED FOR IT IM ENTITLED BLARGGHHHH because everything has a price honey nobody has to benefit including you.

  • I ended up buying the DvD of Omamori Himari because I was a fan of the ecchi scenes. After seeing how badly the censorship board mutilated my copy, I’m very reluctant to buy any more anime.

    I’m all for supporting my favorite authors, but not when I can’t receive the full quality I paid for when I can get more for free.

  • It seems like only a few in this thread are bothering to actually put themselves in the shoes of the artist involved here. This is an article about a mangaka, and her point of view really should be considered.

    Instead, I’m seeing a lot of the comments trying to deal with how manga and/or anime gets distributed – but that’s usually NOT determined by the mangaka. A manga gets syndicated, meaning a publishing company buys the rights to print and release the work, and then the mangaka gets royalties based upon the sales figures of their work. The publisher decides how the work is distributed, not the mangaka. The mangaka will sometimes receive a base compensation for work, but by-and-large it is a royalties-based system that the mangaka has very little control or say over once he or she gives signs over the distribution rights to a publisher. With anime, it’s more of the same. If the show/movie is based on a manga, the mangaka receives residuals, but he/she has no control over how the anime is distributed to consumers – he/she only signs permission for the adaptation of the work (and sometimes that’s already a clause included in the manga’s original distribution contract).

    I could go on and on and explain this as it regards the people working in anime production and distribution, game production and distribution, etc. – but what it boils down to is that there are REAL human beings who are trying to earn paychecks that are creating great work and yet have very little ability to earn what their work is really worth due to (1) distributors sticking with out-dated business models, and (2) piracy.

    If you want quality manga and anime to continue, start buying it and stop stealing it. Period. It’s simple economics. There cannot be a supply if there is no monetary demand. The artists simply cannot work for free! Would you?

    • I’m all for paying for it, and I do much much more thanks to downloading. Via downloading I can preview it and see if it is worth it and run less of a risk of buying a bad quality product in terms of contend atleast.

      Before I could download I had to go by reviews or word of mouth and it led to a few poor quality buys that were not worth the money. At those times I felt cheated and robbed. It would not be so bad if I could get my money back for it but alas it don’t work like that. At any rate it made me even more hessitent to make a buy and thus spent far far less then I do now on shows and movies.

      So forgive me if I don’t feel much guilt for spending more on anime because of piracy.

    • You, and the rest of the moral brigade here fail to realize that some of us do BUY after watching the pirated copy. I also would like to understand how they are loosing money to us foreigners when they have little or no intention of selling it to us.

      • How do you know they actually have no intention of bringing them over here?

        They may have plans in the works, you never know.

        About unlicensed stuff, I never actually heard about them saying they’re losing money over that.But as the people before me said, if it does get licensed, chances are it won’tsell- since most have read it already for free- unless fans act like fans and support it.

  • Klingengeist says:

    I wont pay for something you can officially watch for free elsewhere.
    Also to record tv shows isnt forbidden as long as you dont sell them to make profit.

    DVDs/BDs are another thing but its their own problem for broadcasting a show on TV before selling the DVDs.
    Does she think many whould buy DVDs of Hollywood movies for example, if they could watch and record them from TV already?
    Also DVDs of TV shows are normally sold for extra profit, not because they need the money to cover the production costs.

  • Is she REALLY complaining about people ripping off her blatant wet dream of a manga?

    First off, those people that sent her mail obviously care enough about the mangaka to send in fanmail for her to enjoy; they clearly don’t want her to starve. Second, just because someone overseas watches her crappy anime online doesn’t mean they won’t buy it when it’s legally distributed. Besides, how many people go impulsively buying anime DVD’s without seeing it online or on TV (FOR FREE) before?

    Also, just because she doesn’t seem to know, anime animators clearly aren’t in it for the profit. Whatever money she makes has to be more than them for her to QQ about it… yet we don’t hear them complaining.

    And if you’re that dependant on manga for food, you’re clearly in the wrong line of work… or your manga just sucks… which it does.

    • Manga is an industry, just like Marvel comic books, if you work in the Marvel comic book industry that’s a professional job. Just like if you work in the manga industry. seriously some of you people don’t make sense.

  • Again, they ripped American artists off their music, you don’t see us screaming about it. They have people watching free manga online too. Just have to make it so it’s only foreigners that doing the bad deeds.

  • Wonder what company anon works for? – and why so mad bro?

    Still doesn’t understand that people (like myself) DO BUY anime / manga. Doesn’t like the fact that I base my decisions on having already watched the “pirate” copy. I get to make a balanced decision, and the distribution company gets their money. (and I don’t have to buy some shit I don’t like)

  • Funny, I watched one pirated episode of Kuroshitsuji and it was enough to persuade me to not bother watching the rest. I guess I’m the asshole for wanting to pay only for what’s worth watching.

  • Why don’t they just release anime with english subs and sell it online like they do with Naruto and that crap? I mean, with no delays between the subbed version (with good subs, ofc) and the non-subbed one.

  • The thing about most of the anime/manga I get for free online: It is not sold here/in english. As many people have already pointed out, that means that the people who produce it would not get money from me anyway. It’s another story if you live in Japan though, they don’t really have an excuse.

  • You stupid fuckers are so retarded, I can’t believe you actually manage to breathe.

    “If she wants us to buy it, she should sell it overseas!”

    Do you think she has ANY control over that? It’s the publisher who decides where to sell it, not the author. I’m sure they’d consider it if she asked, but if they didn’t think it would be profitable, she wouldn’t be able to change their minds if she begged on her knees.

    “It’s too expensive!”

    So you finally got that title you wanted overseas licensed…and now you bitch about the price? Of course it’s going to cost more. Anime and manga is a niche market in North America, so they need to charge more in order to break even. Hell, anime is actually EXTREMELY CHEAP here. You get more episodes per disc, at a lower price per disc than in Japan.

    “I don’t pay to watch it on TV, so it’s OK to download it!”

    Do you black out every six minutes when watching TV? You must, otherwise you’d know about something called COMMERCIAL ADVERTISING. That’s what pays for a show. You’re basically paying with time spent watching advertising, instead of with money. Unlicensed downloads and streams don’t have ads (that pay for the licensing, at least). Licensed streams ALWAYS have either an ad before the video starts, or ads on the webpage.

    “It doesn’t show up in stores for years, if at all!”

    If you actually go to brick and mortar stores for anime/manga then YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG. There are PLENTY of websites when you can order stuff that’s not in stores, or out of print. And almost always for LESS (unless shipping adds up, which is a bitch, but DEAL WITH IT).

    “It’s not available here, they never sell any anime/manga!”

    BECAUSE YOU NEVER BOUGHT ANY OF IT BEFORE, DUMBASS. If nobody buys the stuff that IS available, the local publisher doesn’t make any money, and can’t afford to license any new franchises…or FINISH translating ones they already have.

    “The translations are terrible!”

    Do you speak Japanese? I’m willing to bet you don’t. With that in mind, how the hell do you know if the translations are good OR bad? Because someone told you? What reason do you have to believe they know what they’re talking about? Because you read the scanlation first? How do you know the scanlators or any more or less accurate than the official translation? Honestly, whose translation are you going to rely on; a group of random people online with no credentials, or people who have actually gone to school to learn Japanese, have a diploma, and work in the field professionally?

    “They censor the artwork!”

    Yeah, because the Viz release of Ranma TOTALLY censored the near-constant toplessness right? And Dark Horse refused to publish Berserk because of the violence. And there isn’t a single manga publisher in North America that has a yaoi-centric label! WRONG. The only notable censorship I’ve seen in English manga recently (no, lengthening Misty’s shorts in Pokemon is NOT notable) was when Viz redrew the cross shaped slab that Greed was tied to in FMA. And that was YEARS ago.

    “They refuse to adapt to a modern business model!”

    Yes, they’re stubborn. Remember what else was stubborn? The music industry. And now we have several licensed digital distrubtion services like iTunes. It took longer than it should have, but it happened. Don’t expect it to happen right away with a niche product like anime/manga, but don’t fucking say NOBODY is trying it. Funimation, Manga Entertainment, and even the tattered remains of ADV Films are doing their best to bring subtitled streams to North American (or in Manga’s case, European) audiences. Have some fucking patience, and manga publishers will follow (Yen Press and Square Enix are already working on it).

    “It;s not licensed here, so downloading it isn’t stealing!”

    And do you purchase it legally when/if it does become available? No, you don’t. Maybe you pick up a few volumes you happen to see at a convention, but don’t try to tell me you meticulously hunt down every volume and every episode you’ve ever pirated and purchased them. For the one person out of a thousand who truly DO (or try to the best of their ability), hats off to you. If only the rest of the fanbase could be as decent as you.

    “Copying isn’t stealing because it makes a copy, it doesn’t remove the original!”

    Bullshit. You are acquiring a commercial product without paying for it, and without the consent of the copyright holder. That’s theft.

    • Lets go down the list here:

      -If she has no control over overseas sales, she should shut the fuck up about losing money to pirates. If the market doesn’t exist, “lost sales” are akin to unicorns.

      -Manga actually IS expensive in the U.S., while anime is the exact opposite. Books that sold for $3-6 in Japan sell for between $8-12 here. That is double the original cost. I know this because I buy both when a series I like is licensed and released. Importing is absurdly expensive, anywhere from 2-10x the cost of the book depending on how much you order at one time (it’s only 2x for an order of $200 or more).

      -You’re right about the TV line, that’s complete horseshit, but none of the companies over here has ever attempted to put subtitled anime programming on either their cable channels or video on demand, so the only comparative services are streaming video sites like Crunchyroll. Their advertising based streams are ass for quality and the translations are often full of errors that have to be reported by fans in order to be fixed. I’ve watched new series threads on an Anime discussion forum one of their translators frequent and almost every single episode had a problems of some kind. That stuff often gets QC’d by the groups that rip their subs and release in 720p.

      -If the series don’t show up in stores, it’s often not because of stock, it’s because distributors license series months or years after they finish airing. Sora wo Kakeru Shoujo was just licensed this month, and it’ll probably be another year before we see DVDs of it, despite it being long since finished. I can buy out of stock items from Amazon or Rightstuf, I can’t pull unlicensed translated DVDs out of my ass.

      -The licensing issue is one they brought on themselves by buying C and D level licenses in bulk during the anime/manga boom several years ago, and then having problems with funds when they all didn’t sell as well as Dragonball Z. The argument still stands, if the product isn’t available for purchase, a download isn’t a lost sale.

      -The translations are bad. I speak and read enough Japanese to know when things are being changed, especially cultural references. Most publishers strip out any and all honorifics from the majority of their releases, even if they may be pertinent to the story, such as a love interest changing the way they refer to someone at a key point in the relationship. It’s ridiculous, and after Rorouni Kenshin sold so well with everything intact, you’d think they’d have gotten over their cultural phobias, but sadly, it’s still there.

      -Perhaps you’ve heard of a little series from Oh Great! called Tenjou Tenge. It has some of the most egregious and blatant censorship I have ever seen in a publication to date. Someone went through and did a side by side comparison of the early volumes and the changes numbers in the dozens of pages. Admittedly, I haven’t kept up with more recent examples, but I’m sure just about every book that isn’t wrapped in plastic will have been thoroughly purged of anything remotely titillating or with religious significance. Wouldn’t want to piss off those soccer moms who stupidly bought their kid whatever he wanted without looking at the content first.

      -There is one company putting out eBook versions of manga thus far in English, and 95% of what they release are yaoi titles. I went looking on Amazon the other day after seeing the new Kindle to check since it had been a while. They need to get their asses in gear and make something better available before attacking their potential customers.

      -If I liked it enough to want to watch it again, yes, I buy it. If they want to make money off the initial viewing, they need to shape up their TV and online streaming efforts, because I’m not going to buy something as expensive as anime sight-unseen these days. My disposable income is too valuable to accidentally buy an Aki-can or any number of other garbage titles that somehow get licensed.

      -And again, nothing is physically being stolen in these scenerios. You don’t see Adobe stomping down people’s doors with cease and desist letters because some poor college student pirated Photoshop. That’s not their market, they know it’s too expensive, and they also know they’ll never keep it off the internet. While it may be an “illegal” copyright violation, it wasn’t a lost sale, because that person was never going to be able to buy it in the first place.

    • loli in a box says:

      You have way too much time on you hands. o.o

      Do you seriously think those are the reasons why people pirate and don’t buy?
      You know it yourself, don’t you? Most people just use it as an excuse when they are confronted with it.

      There is no point in trying to disprove those arguments.(Mind, I’m not saying you actually managed to really do that.)

      It’s pretty clear why we pirate and it won’t change. I secretly hope the English publishers will go bankrupt so we don’t have this dilemma anymore…it probably will happen someday.
      Nothing will change for the Japanese industry as the fans over there are still paying, so we can keep on leeching of their funding~

    • “And do you purchase it legally when/if it does become available? No, you don’t.”

      Yes, I do. Sometimes by import as well, if it looks like it’ll never get licensed. Your point? In any of this?

      And don’t go calling me a niche case because unfortunately for ANYONE on ANY side of this debate, there are no statistics.

    • Chirst, I keep on coming back to this article to read the butthurt from this fella.

      Keep on calling us thieves, keep on ignoring how times are changing and your business model sucks. All you are doing is pissing off the ones who do support the industry (and like it or not, you are not doing to kill piracy)

    • This is the best thing I’ve ever seen on this site to refute the piracy apologists.

      Unfortunately, you’re posting to audience of adolescents.

      I applaud your effort, though, and your great post!

  • If it wasn’t for me pirating manga/anime i wouldn’t even have the 10 or so manga that are on my shelf right now…

    You cannot say that pirates are immoral!

    Also releasing English versions helps…

    • Eh… also i don’t care about Black Butler so you won’t have any problem with me pirating it…. There is better stuff out there that are worth pirating… like “Inaba of the Moon and Inaba of the Earth” ๐Ÿ˜€

  • half of the world wouldnt know what kuroshitsuji is if it wasnt for those sites… like a lot of other animes and mangas

    and its not as if she’s the only one, i can understand a bit.. but jeez..

  • Ah so going back to a time before I could download where I would only buy anime if I was almost positive it was worth it and rarely risk buying anything without extensive research which would mean that my spending would go down atleast 5fold. Yup I am going to stop downloading and spend far less then I do now cause I can’t preview and make sure it is worth buying. All almost 300 shows/movies I own now (legaly) I downloaded before I bought them.

    But hey If they realy want me to stop buying so much because I also download then fine, but don’t go crying cause sales go down further :o.

  • Why should she bitch about people downloading her manga over here, when she and her publisher wasn’t marketing it here to begin with? Nobody could buy it even if they wanted to. She’s not losing any potential market gains because they didn’t create one.

    Unless she’s more upset about the fact filthy gaijins was able to enjoy her mangas, than the fact they’re reading it for free. Then she’s just another racist.

  • If you are not paying when you have the extra money to do so, you are without theiving scum.

    But who has the money? I sure don’t.
    Do you?

    Is that sheit even availible in your country?
    Hell no! Get those translators a-crackin right away.

  • I don’t understand what the fuss is all about…

    I mean, if some people who would never buy a some manga/anime because its not available in their country start reading/watching it for free, the creators not only lose nothing they gain reputation and eventually some money because people start buying the stuff from overseas.

    But I guess its easier to spout uninformed opinions and let oneself be ruled by greed than have an open mind and be prepared to give something first in order to receive something later…

    Meh, from now on I think I will think twice before I order something from Japan…and not only because of the superbad yen exchange rate…

  • without the interwebs i never would have seen death note. Now i possess the whole manga. It is so much easier to browse through the vast amount of mangas and animes online, testing them, watching the first episodes, the whole series and maybe buying the books/dvds afterwards. Although i havnt dealt with getting information about buying mangas/dvds online. How fast is the licensing/ translation time, that i can buy mangas in english (at least)
    Do japanese animes (not licensed in us yet) have english subs (at least) and will i be able to play it in my dvd drive /dvd player ? etc. etc.
    If i can afford it, i maybe will pay money for being able to see anime episodes online and downloading them afterwards.

  • While she did go over the top, I do feel her plight. :I

    I think it’s generally alright if you read manga, watch animes online as long as you pitch in with dvd/manga sales every once in a while. Winwin for both sides.

  • No point in arguing…

    It’s their stuff, they can do whatever they want with it…

    They can sell it at higher price, make it available in their language only, etc… hell they can even decide not to sell it to us…

    Now, we got it for free, and we act like its our god-deym right!

    Don’t forget, its their stuff, they made it, why should you have it for free?

  • Japan seems to be like the movie and music industry, crying about the fact that old distribution method does not work any longer….also, why cry about lost sales if you HAD ZERO intention of letting us be able to purchase your product in the first place.

    I do pirate anime / manga, and if I like it – I BUY IT if it is available. How do they think I even know about new series if it wasn’t for these pirates.

    They are going to have to face facts – yes, there is going to be a certain percentage of people who will never buy – but in allowing these pirates to operate, you will gain more sales from others who want to own (such as myself.)

    As I said, if it wasn’t for the pirate community, I wouldn’t know about many series and therefore they lost a potential customer.

  • That “steely alchemist” chose to defy Equivalent Exchange at the end of FMA. The Elrics want people to give more that what they’ve received. Fansubbers do this by gaining raws and giving fans translations!

  • Give us cheap, fast, legit ways to get your material and we will. Oh, wait, you want to hide behind the copyright excuse like every other greedy fat cat.

    You don’t care about making art. You just want money. As much of it as you can get, you greedy bitch.

    Heaven forbid new channels like the internet open up new and exiting ways to get your material to fans. No, let’s just print it on paper in Japan only, and then cry, bitch, and moan, and act completely ignorant when fans outside Japan would like to get your work, and are even willing to pay for it.

    Nah, that would make too much sense.

  • i willing to pay for the DVD’s in my country yet resort to fan subs due to bad translation in my country. There this once i bought the original copy of Ghost in the Shell with extremely bad subs, making me resort to fan subs till now rather wasting my precious $$ for something i do not understand at all, wth.

    Forget bout buying imports, the exchange rate is too high, estimated around 3 to 1, which is totally out of my budget >__<

  • KuroSHITsuji, it started off entertaining but just becomes homolust really quickly with overused jokes and not enough action scenes.

    I buy manga/anime I like and download them first, people bitching about it being theft are mindless sheep that don’t have a brain, go rent something, read it in a library, etc it’s pretty much the same as downloading it as they don’t get money from it. They just target illegal downloading because “Everyonez with a computer can do it!” etc, these “illegal downloads” have existed long before the internet in a different form.

  • They speak as if they make an actual effort to make manga and anime available to people. Some titles take a long time to even get licensed, some never do at all, and then there is the fact that most retailers don’t even carry the stuff.

    • Yeah, its funny that no Japanese manga publisher has even tried to provide international option for reading manga online.

      Its not like its all that hard to get manga translated to English, people are doing it for free/fun already so hiring few translators to provide at least English translations for the works is too much.

      With good pricing and some advertisement people could actually pay to read manga online. Do you have to be in US to provide international online services? Or are Japanese so shut in their little island that they are unable to do so?

  • meh I never really read kuroSHITsuji anyway but I understand I,m not gonna justify it and say OH OH BUT ITS SO EXPENSIVE put out or shut up I get it but If working within the system is so expensive then you’re dawn right I,m gonna lie and steal and cheat because my needs come before yours I want an anime or manga and can’t get it cause its expensive FINE I,m gonna go read and watch it online its a sad awful disgusting truth but it is the truth

  • why isn’t some “entertainment” bill added to taxes or something instead? would make it so much easier.
    I mainly pirate because the stuff I want isn’t available, or I’d have to search like crazy to find it…
    the way they handle copyright fits for people living in the 80s, but is extremely outdated for 2000+…
    hopefully they will realize how incompetent their system is, and improve it, for the victims of piracy.

  • Let’s be honest here, how many stuff sold here in translated goods are actually the real thing from a lisenced publisher? Same with imports, how do you know it was a real imported thing and not a bootleg? Heres my story:

    When I went to my local anime convention, I saw close to nothing that was legitimate. Everything that claimed to be imported directly from Japan and legit were actually bootlegs (because the back cover had the malaysian currency RM on the back, and after going home and doing some googling, even the cover art is different, but the title was the same for artbooks). Wallscrolls? All bootlegs unless you find the odd one that is actually the real thing because most retailers dont know that wallscrolls sold in north america were not licensed. Manga? Most are legit, but I found some that were fake copies of the legit licensed published one. Figures? 50% are bootlegs that found their way mixed with the legitimate imports.

    *disclaimer: numbers I have used are based on my visual eyesight and telling apart legitimate goods from bootlegs because some were so damn obvious*

    Point being: It’s impossible to support the creator if you want stuff in your own language or products based on it, because most of the time, its fake.

  • I’m getting a bit tired of the constant ignorant complaints by creators and publishers that people who, as she very clearly pointed out, can not legally buy her product in their countries are somehow making her poor by…not buying her product. You can’t lose sales you were never going to make in the first place, nor can you expect foreigners to pay a sometimes 2-300% premium to import something in a language very few can actually read, even if they are actively learning it like I am. I’m willing to bet the mangaka, for the most part, acknowledge that the smarter thing would be to have an online global delivery service. However, their publisher overlords are making them keep quiet about the real problems and point at the evil foreigners in hopes that the fans are stupid enough to just blame us for all the problems in the industry instead of who’s really at fault.

    If the 2ch posts are in any way representative, then unfortunately it’s working.

    • In France to! The last one to come out was the fourth tome in the 2nd of July this year!!!
      If she does even know that, I wonder what else she doesn’t knox and what the publisher is not telling her!!!

  • I call Bullshit! Who actually watches or reads Kuroshitsuji? This is just a sad attempt to get his name out there. Something he could of done much better by giving away his manga in the first place.

  • well it mostly depends on the money if i actually purchase something
    e.g.: Code Geass first season 3 DVD boxes each 27,99โ‚ฌ
    totall: 83,97- โ‚ฌ
    107,57- $
    68,76- GBP
    112,31- CAD
    9179,57- JPY
    but that is where the other problem sets in cause my example is one of the few that is actually availiable in my country (and it just took 3 years to be purchaseable)i wouldn`t mind buying for otheres if they were availiable

  • “And the manga is only legally readable in Japan as the print edition published by Square Enix โ€“ downloading it and reading it is illegal as of 2010.”
    I dont think so. Its illegal to put it online, not to download it and read. Also, in countries where its not licenced it technically doesnt exists, so it cant be illegal.

  • Making a hobby expensive is a good way to narrow the field. Keeping the hobby in a different language is apparently not a problem at all, though.

    Either way, they really just need to take over internet manga distribution on a wider language base and localize more anime. Maybe it’s not as widely popular in America, but that doesn’t mean that the rest of the countries don’t deserve a chance. Yes, it’s another gamble and could end up wasting money, but that doesn’t mean you have to accuse the rest of the world of being stingy. We could be paying costumers if they would provide a way for us to buy all of that stuff…or I suppose an easier way would be nice. More websites like Shopping Mall Japan, (specified to particular merchandise,) would be nice.

  • Hey, I’ve always bought my manga pretty much from any other sources that I can find. Some manga that I like from Japan is Japan only, but I didn’t do any downloads of some sort, but my friend since he’s always a maniac for these sort of things sends me his stuff of what he downloaded lately. Just accepting it from him kinda makes me feel no better…besides that, Piraters could be anyone, including japanese people. No one on this planet should have much of a say in this if somebody from other different countries go out to get this manga readable online. I should not be surprised about this in the least.

    Some efforts to shut piracy down is out the window for the most part considering the persistence from other piraters. It sucks for mangakas to go through crap like this for this ridiculous charade that they are spun around with. After all, it’s their work, their money. They do all they can to make that money, they feel bamboozled when something happens that makes them feel or actually robs them of the money they truly deserve.

    I knew about the other mangas from some sources and I admit going to manga online sites or scanlators that allow them to read online and give them a read. Some manga are splendid and with the work they’ve been doing on them, I know they deserve their cash money. Some mangakas are taking this very hard and maybe are overexgerratering over this, but this is something that affects them.

    Anti-piracy moves take a long time to get rid of every single source that is the cause of their problems, they don’t got anything to get rid of it all with one click and the near future stuff is so far away.

  • I guess that makes me half pirate since I’ll view works online to get a taste. If I like it, I’ll gladly support the authors/producers by purchasing anything licensed in my region or just strait from the source itself, Japan.

  • they need to utilize the interwebs more

    iTunes type marketplace. Fast paced world and all that jazz. Many people want things, and want those things NOW. Years to translate or get imported locally? No Thanks.

  • Meh, Im cool with her opinions and agree about it. It’s mostly centered towards those who in fact have the option of buying based on geographical location anyway.

    As a Canadian however, if I wanted to read it, what am I supposed to do? Learn enormous amounts of Japanese and import?

    Wait for a shitty translated version in my local coles or Chapters, or in the case of the anime, in my local Comic Book Shoppe or Silver Snail?

    Yeah fuck that – I’d rather download it thanks. When the infrastructure for a convenient system of getting the shit, and getting a quality translation is in place, maybe then I’ll pay. I want to support creators and keep awesome stuff coming out as much as anyone else, but it isn’t made easy. And until it is, I’ll do what I gotta do.

  • i have no problem watching say an add from a sponsor before watching an anime on an official site. these guys over there just straight up do not regulate their stuff and take the steps to make the piracy on all the sites meaningless.

    take south park for example, every single episode is on their site for the price of watching 0-3 commercials. that is AWESOME. anime just needs to do the same thing, make a main site over here in the states with fast loads and proffesional subs (and no censoring) and the problem would be next to fixed. and they can do that for new shows too, have a team of guys just sub new anime in a timely matter. this is really not that complicated.

    these bums just need to invest a little, especially in the overseas market.

    these guys over price their stuff anyways. and if they actually got rid of the piracy their fans would drop by 50%.

  • In my lifetime, I have spent literally thousands on merchandise. Without these pirated versions, I wouldn’t have known that the majority of what I’ve gotten existed. Obviously I’m not the prototype example, but I’m sure I’m not the only one in this situation.

  • For the people who don’t know, SQUARE ENIX EUROPE french is going to publish some of their manga online…

    http://www.square-enix.com/eu/fr/manga/

    For the moment we don’t know how many this will cost us to read their manga online, but more information is to come before the end of the year…

    If this operation works well maybe other publishers will do the same in The USA and all around the world…

    Ps: I hope you will understand what i wrote. English is my fifth langage and is also by far the one I write/speak the worst. Sorry about my bad english…

  • The problem is that they let the piracy go on too long. At this point, they can shut down a few aggregation sites, but they can’t stop everything. Going after the individual people would really be the only way, and that’s so impossible to do that it would be foolish to try. If it didn’t work for RIAA with all their money, it won’t work for the manga industry.

    So, we’re stuck with people who would rather steal than pay and a bunch of people who whine about them stealing. You’ll never guilt a single pirate into paying, nor can any distribution model ever satisfy them, so why bother.

  • I DL stuff, i wont say i dont, its easyer and i have a crappy job so i couldent even afford to buy and import the stuff i would want to watch and read, even the stuff i can find is normaly dubbed, and i fuckin hate dubbed it ruins it

  • While it is understandable, the problem is this; many manga works are not distributed worldwide which would limit it to the Japanese. If the Japanese really want foreigners to understand their culture, they sure share it with them, like distributing an international version of a product, let’s say manga, however some of them are egoistic.

    Also consider that the ones that upload the raws are the Japanese themselves. Why do they always blame the foreigners if the ones that made the mistake is themselves?

  • 2DGIRLSONLY says:

    I feel bad, but ordering online is costlty since they rip us off, i usually spend the money on the merchandise of the series like Gundam: I’ve been buying gundam merchandise since i was 6 all those MG giants on my shelf bah

  • I’m defiantly guilty of downloading her works. But I do pay for things once I get access to them in the language I understand. Though, of course I don’t always have the money to get all of them… but I DO get them when I can.

    Still feel a little guilty though..

  • Granted if you can’t get it in your country and it isn’t worth the 120 fee to import it… (because we are all so rich right?) I understand being a pirate. But also hold true to the labels, if I really dig something, I am more likely to buy it just for the cute box and the dvd set directly from the anime stores themselves. Sure you can buy them from amazon, but to really support the anime to the fullest try and get it directly from the company. And sometimes they send stickers and toys! w00t. And folks…. Pirate the F*CK out of things while you can because it’s gonna go away real soon –

    – Kat –

        • If you feel that breaking copyright (note that I did not say stealing there) is wrong, then yes. If not, that is your moral prerogative, but at least you’re supporting one of your hobbies.

          I try to do the same, but lets face it, there are bills to pay and a paycheck is limited. I bought my copy of Windows 7 because it was reasonably priced, but I only use Photoshop for resizing, color touch-up, and sharping of images. There’s no way in hell I’m going to pay what they’re asking for that. I buy a handful of graphic novels almost every time I walk into a bookstore of series I really like, but I still read the latest Jump chapters online as they’re released. Personally, I don’t feel that bad about it, because I try to support what I’m capable of, even though copyright violation is technically illegal.

  • Let’s all pretend for a minute that file sharing doesn’t exist and that video sharing websites don’t exist.

    1- I wouldn’t watch/read ANY manga or anime because they are WAY too expensive and I don’t have enough money to waste on them.

    2- I wouldnt even KNOW half of the mangas I read or animes I watch EVEN EXISTED…

    and I’m pretty sure this is also the case for a HUGE percentage of all the people who read it “illegaly”

    So yeah.. this author is just greedy. Let her starve.

    • Yeah, she’s greedy for wanting people to get paid for their hard work.
      If people keep pirating a series instead of buying it, it will stop making money.
      If a series stops making money, the person creating that series usually stops being published.
      If they stop getting published, they don’t get paid.

      • You don’t get what I’m saying. My point is that if file sharing wouldn’t exist, her sales wouldnt be that much higher if AT ALL… because people who buy mangas, BUY mangas, and people who DON’T buy mangas (like me), DON’T buy mangas…regardless of file sharing…

        • The problem with these claims is that they DON’T have actual proof of these supposed “lost sales”. The RIAA tried to get away with this for years claiming hilariously large numbers of “loss” and when they were recently asked to finally validate those claims, they were unable to back up their data. All the lawsuits they’ve been involved in were claiming losses that someone just pulled out of their ass.

          This is the same situation here. They’re frustrated at lower sales, which are likely based entirely in the economic changes the last few years, and too stubborn and lazy to change their distribution and sales models. So they’re attacking anyone in arms reach, even if those people were originally a great source of advertisement for the medium.

        • Whether those e-mails lost sales or not, you have to admit that telling the AUTHOR of a series that you pirated it is kind of insulting in itself.

          “Hi! I love your work! But I don’t love it enough to pay for it!”

        • if she has statistical proof, from publishers or book store chains that her sales are directly because of file sharing, than let her PROVE it. Those fan e-mails don’t mean A THING. She acts like everyone of those fan e-mails is a lost sale… what proof does she have that the people who sent those e-mails would’ve bought the manga?!? on the contrary, they probably would have never read it at all…

  • I am not going to say that pirating anime/manga is a good thing to do, but reasoning like that is also somewhat stupid since they say that they will starve to death, only because people dowloading anime illegally. Why? Aren’t they paid for their work by the publishers. Complain about underpayment with the publisher who mostly don’t care about mangakas to begin with, they are making the big money, not the original creators, the mangakas! And try to publish your own manga online in digital form, become independent!

    As for pirating, well I can imagine that people pirate things that they can’t pay for or some people can wait for the manga to come out in the west since most of the English versions of the manga come out 1 or 2 years later here, there’s no such thing as simultaneous publishing similar to what Crunchyroll is doing now with anime series (simulcasting). I think people will buy legal manga if they have the choice for a fair price.

  • All I have been hearing here is excuses!!

    If it doesnt sell at your country, there are still ways to order it online legally!

    If its not in your language, learn their language!

    If you cant afford to buy it, dont use the products!

    If you don’t want to do any of the above, then $#%&^%&* admit that you are stealing their products!

      • RaspberryKisses says:

        no he is not. there is no other way for some people to get new anime because of language barrier or because it’s nearly impossible to import Anime from japan. “If it doesnt sell at your country, there are still ways to order it online legally! ” he clearly never ordered something from japan located in let’s say Russia. let me say you this ordering online from japan is not the option to us. And not everyone so smart or have time to fully learn the language. i’m working and live alone so i don’t have time to study anymore. And English is not my primary language. i learned it in school and learned after graduation additionally because of the superior English funsub. i just want to watch anime and buy figures of anime i like. thats my passion but hobby will be torture if i had to buy anime i want to watch form japan. i still buy figures from anime i watched and those money go to japan. i simply cannot do more because it’s impossible.

        • RaspberryKisses says:

          yes we have. 4 in Moscow. but they are selling only Russian licensed Anime and it’s like 20-25 mid-old animes on DVD thats all. they don’t sell Japanese DvD or BD. all they sell are figures and stuff like watches bags and shit. most online stores operate only in Europe or US. yes there is Play asia but normal (not expensive) delivery takes 2-3 weeks and it’s a major pain in the ass. i sometimes buy games and figures from Play asia but once or twice a year because it’s so uncomfortable and hard.

    • For the most part, I agree with you. If you can’t afford to buy something, then wait until you can and don’t try to justify stealing it.

      However, telling someone to learn a whole other language just to read comics or watch a television show is unrealistic.

  • sdarkpaladin says:

    A few questionable points about the mails though:

    1) How many of those who sent the mails are below 10 years old? Cause seriously, you don’t tell a shop that you stole stuff from them.

    2) How many are gaijins?

    3) How many are trolls?

  • It’s true. If I wasn’t so poor, I would buy my anime. As dorky as it is, I have plenty of equally dorky friends would would be impressed with such a collection. My bedroom needs to be kawaii’d up, and fast! But that takes money.

  • Recently, topics like this come up on Sankaku Complex really often…

    Quite frankly, I couldn’t care anymore, but dragging on about this every week will give this site(and subsequently the regulars) a bad name.

    I know Artefect isn’t exactly agreeing to the act of piracy, but bringing up every quote from every industry personnel about how they dislike us and piracy they closely tie us to, while firing back at them every single time, will make us look bad in the long run.

    Shit like this should be brought up only every month or so. I don’t think we need to be reminded of how they dislike anyone non-Japanese everytime.

    …On the other hand, though there are no clear-cut, blank-or-white stand on this issue. I know it’s unfair to assume everyone in Japan thinks that way. But in retrospec, news like this is starting to make me hate them.

    And love or hate was never an issue to me before I start haunting this site…

    • I don’t mind these articles. (It’s better than this site trying to show European topless sunbathers again!)

      As a webmaster of a narrowly-focused site, you have to post what’s going to get a lot hits. This is an on-topic subject for the sankaku readership and for Japanese visual culturists in general, it’s a magnet for controvery, a lot of people will read, thus a great many hits, click-throughs, etc. I don’t fault Artefact at all for posting this content. It’s highly relevant.

      If you don’t like an article, skip it. There are plenty of others here to enjoy!

      ๐Ÿ˜€

  • Off-topic, but this is too fucking funny:

    “To date, the authorities have been unable to find more than 281 Japanese who had been listed in records as 100 years old or older. Facing a growing public outcry, the countryโ€™s health minister, Akira Nagatsuma, said officials would meet with every person listed as 110 or older to verify that they are alive; Tokyo officials made the same promise for the 3,000 or so residents listed as 100 and up.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/15/world/asia/15japan.html?th&emc=th

    Win, thy name is Japan X)

  • Fact, most that pirate are the ones that also buy the most things(merchandise, media) ;). And the rest wouldn’t have the money to pay anyway.

    Granted some people are just cheap and won’t buy something they use only once but that is a very small percentage of those who pirate.

    There is nothing new here, its been done since.. forever. For instance copying a VHS tape is illegal but I doubt most people ever thought twice about that. It was just marginalized since there were no records of how many people borrowed or copied a movie from someone else.

    If they want to bark up the right tree in the Japanese market take a look at the super high prices. Someone is profiting and I doubt its actual talent. If you want to bark up the right tree in the US, release stuff when you do in Japan otherwise people are not going to wait.

    Want to bark up the right tree for everyone when it comes to anime and manga, make it available in an easy to use digital format. For instance take a look at the success that is crunchy roll. Heck look at how Hulu is changing american television which is similar to the crunchy roll format.

  • It’s ok to ask something in return for your work. but when guys make translations for free, of course they steal and spread the product, but they also make it accessible for other people who wouldn’t even bother to watch or read the original, because of import prices and language barrier.

    Thus, turning the works into a pirated yet accessible one, they increase popularity of the works, indicate interest level, and where/when they should look for sales expansion.

    I often look after releases myself and appreciate the work translators crew make, being unable to pay for everything I got to test-watch. I don’t say pirates or leechers are saints who toil for a better society, but publishers should be questionning themselves when they are less reactive and efficient than “a bunch of amateurs”… it’s like fat doughnut-fed old cops filing complaints because they don’t want to run after kids on skateboards :/

  • On account of the recent commotion, I’ve been feeling worse and worse for being a part of that “eating rice for free” thing. But there really isn’t much we can do about it, is there? People in America, UK and other big countries have quite a wide choice of translated manga to buy at local stores, though for quite high prices, but what about us, people who live in small countries without any manga bookstore… Having the expensive translated manga shipped from abroad? Out of question for a student like me, and so for many other people belonging to working class. Still, there are about 25 volumes of manga resting in my bookshelves.

    Furthermore, those people are wrong to begin with, assuming they lose money when somebody illegally watches or reads their work. They’ve never had that money coming. If somebody decided to avoid the illegal acquisition, they would get it never. With the way the current anime/manga market is working (slow or shoddy or expensive, etc.), it’s preposterous to expect EVERYONE outside of Japan who wants to watch/read something to ALWAYS get it in a legal way. However, I believe that EVERYONE might at least FROM TIME TO TIME contribute in a way and support the creators of the works you like. Even by buying one volume of manga or a DVD/BD with anime or some other related merchandise, you do a good thing.

  • For such a manga, one that’s not in the spotlight much and with lower circulation yeah, I’d guess that its kinda important that your fans support you when they’re few, specially those that consider themselves “fans”.

  • “In the words of a certain steely fellow, this violates the Law of Equivalent Exchange!”

    ???
    I never finished the new FMA but…I thought in the first anime run there was no “real” Equivalent Exchange?

  • Judging from the comments she’s right about the fact that people can’t comprehend that piracy is wrong. Despite having a million reasons of why you pirate; at the end of the day you must admit you’re doing something that’s not okay. It’s not manga here that’s the issue, it’s commercial products in general. For all you know she might be referring to japanese people only for this case but the principle still holds, there are probably tons of english media that you pirate do not deny. A rational person acts in self-interest you also have to admit that you’re doing it because you’re thinking about yourselves and don’t give a damn about the creators since they’re subsidised by other people

  • Ok lets think about this, if it’s not released in the US for example. And most of us can’t read Japanese(I rather spend my time learning another programming language since that’s what I’m going to school for), what is the point of us buying it. That’s throwing out money away, now I advocate to my friends if you like it buy it I have no problem downloading it to check it out. And I do buy manga (I’m starting to run out of book shelf space >_>), but I’m not going to buy something I can’t use. And scanlators made it possible to see if we would like it or not. I never would have picked up negima if it wasn’t for the fact Ken Akamatsu was the one who worked on it, and if it wasn’t for the onmibus version I bought. Just like with anime, if we don’t understand Japanese why spend a ass load to import?

  • I am pretty sure she is referring to her Japanese readers.

    โ€œI got it off a friend on a ROM and read it :)โ€

    โ€œI found them all on an overseas video sharing site and read them there :)โ€

    โ€œI became a fan of the second season so I watched all them on an overseas site โ€“ they were really funny!โ€

    The fact that “overseas” was used in the second and third sentence really gives me the impression it is Japanese who are also using places like Onemanga.

  • I think she’d also like to have a word with Hot Topic and their merchandise with Black Butler designs printed on them. It was only recently that the anime/manga is being licensed here, but Hot Topic has been holding these designs for quite awhile. Hell, its almost normal nowadays to see people ripping each other off. Its going to naturally happen, especially in this day and age of internet distribution, you can’t fight it. And I doubt this morality sermon will, in anyway change those people’s minds.

    But she should be happy about this one sale, I have this flaming passion for off the top butlers and crazy shotas, I’ll be getting the Bluray disc once Funimation(?) starts releasing them.

  • “So, if you have no money, is it OK to watch for free?
    The answer is โ€œNo.โ€
    In the words of a certain steely fellow, this violates the Law of Equivalent Exchange!”

    IT DOESN’T VIOLATE THE LAW OF EQUIVALENT EXCHANGE, BECAUSE WATCHER GIVE HIS TIME, WHEN THE MAKER GIVE HIS WORK. WATCHING A CRAPPY ANIME IS LOSING TIME. SO PEOPLE WHO MAKE CRAPPY ANIMES ARE CRIMINALS.

    TIME IS PRECIOUS, ISN’T IT?

  • Give me a mail address I’ve sure I can put some money in an envelope and mail it to you. Might be Korean money, but you get more than i would have actually buying the books. And you get it directly so you get 100% of the cut.

    I’m sure more than half of the illegal readers are able to do that and are restricted by location and providers rather than lack of money. Some bills and and something to mail it in is available even in the deepest of mountain villages.

  • Well, in the case of Black Butler, American fans have no excuse to steal her work, as both the manga and the anime adaptations are licensed. However, for anime and manga that haven’t been licensed or may never get licensed, fans of a particular series this side of the Pacific have no means of accessing them except by “pirating” them. And what’s more, it may be the only way to preview a licensed anime or manga. So in this regard, she’s being far too harsh and unrealistic.

  • Guess I should return all the Kuroshitsuji merchandise I bought after having pirated the anime before it was licensed =(

    If it’s not legally available here, and we’re watching it and that encourages us to buy it when it does come out here, what’s the problem?

  • Licensed manga is practically non-existent in my country. If I read Kuroshitsuji on the Internet no one will lose their profit. You have no right to bitch about “foreign thieves” inless you actually publish your manga in other countries, you greedy people.

      • I’m not the commenter you’re replying to, but I would classify wanting money from a market my product is not being sold in as greedy, yes. It’s like opening a store and only selling only to people on street A, but then getting angry about “lost money” when one of those customers let the people on street B partake that they refuse to sell to.

  • Spending hundreds of dollars on figures certainly doesn’t count as paying for the anime I watched, does it? People buying those figures watched the anime illegally, liked it, and ended up spending money. Buying every anime would be the end of the figure industry as you wouldn’t have any money left, and the chance of actually watching something you like enough to buy figures would be near zero, as you could afford like 1% of the series you watch otherwise. So yeah, what they are saying is “give us your money and let the figure makers starve to death instead”. I rather keep figure makers alive as much as I can afford. Figures are permanent investments where I see what I will get in advance. Anime on the other hand is a one time thing you watch once and rarely ever again, while you don’t even know in advance if it’s good or not. At least 50% of anime being made is so bad that I’d be asking for a refund if I were to spend money watching it. And that 50% also includes unfinished stories, so please stop making them. Start airing a series when the manga has a finished story…

    Anyway if we could…
    -download it legally for free
    -watch it legally for free
    -decide if it is worth our money or not, and pay accordingly after watching it
    -and we could pay an amount WE consider fair (You know there are countries where a people earn $100 a month…they can’t afford your prices, but still want to watch anime.)
    -and it would have English subtitles and available at the same time as in Japanese,
    then we would pay for it. At least the ones that CAN afford it will pay. Those that are barely able to pay their ISP bill won’t pay, but you don’t lose profit on them either.
    Capitalism : you must provide what people demand. If you do, you’ll get rich. If you don’t, and call us thieves instead for getting it under actually reasonable conditions, you’ll starve to death. As simple as that.
    (Same goes for manga.)

    • i am on the same boat like spend more then 300 dollar on manga/anime merchandise one year.

      explain then this to my pvc figures will be faster available on the local shops then the English license of manga/anime ๐Ÿ™‚

      the most weirds is those figures past over in no problem but anime/manga with some moral problem will never get here :p

      example like : Kondomo No Jikan , etc

  • an anime market outside japan exists only because fansub exists; many people would never bought an anime without knowing if it is good or not. many anime after a couple of episodes become pure CRAP. and people who made animes know it, and made them this way to collect money.

  • Bronxdragon says:

    Wait fuck you guys don’t call me a pirate when you won’t even supply me with my peg leg, barrel of rum, stolen concubine for my early morning fixenes, and my faithful parrot who says fuck you to everyone!

  • How about this Japan.

    Employ our fansubbers you dopes. They’re fast, they’re efficient *sometimes, they’re KNOWN – they have a FOLLOWING.
    I’d gladly pay for an edition in which had LEGITIMATELY good english subs. That’s just one track to include alongside the audio video and JP subs on your DVDs and BRs. Don’t even need english VA’s most of time they suck anyways.

    Doesn’t even need english on the front cover or title – I enjoy anime, I know who the hell is who on a cover, or what anime it is based on that.

    Until then, YES I will continue downloading – and YES I will continue purchasing such content when it’s made available to my country, as I always have.

    Bye for now

    • That’s not how it works, am American, but even i know not everyone in the world is entitled to all the things the japanese have. Just like not everyone is entitled to all the things Americans have, how bout you try to buy imported dvds. most of the Japanese dvd’s have english subs and you seem to speak good english.

      • I agree with that, I don’t understand why anime fans have to have it in japanese all the bloody time. I’m a fan and I prefer my stuff at least dubbed(I bought girl meets girl and it might as well been a import, because it wasn’t dubbed (so much for buying a US copy)). But I know people who complain if they hear a anime in english not even giving it a shot (singing parts I’m iffy about).

        • I dislike dubs because of the way they’re produced and because of the people who voice act in them. I’m sorry, but middle age English speaking women should not be hired to voice 16 year old girls. Period. It is audibly noticeable that they’re straining their voices to sound squeaky in a vain attempt at copying their Japanese counterparts. It hurts the ears and takes away from the experience.

          Also, just like voice work in video games, they record all their lines separately and then have them pasted together for a pathetically unemotional final product. At one point in the dubbing industry, a company was bragging about their computer software that squished the lines together to match mouth movements. The reality is it made the final product sound even more unnatural.

          The Japanese cast on the other hand, are picked because they fit the role, and record in the same room so that they can see their fellow cast members and better reflect the emotion of the scene. It makes a difference, and it’s why I just stay away from dubs altogether these days.

    • I’ve thought the same thing. Groups like DB even try hard not to step on official licensors’ toes, and will go out of their way to point out that they weren’t forced to drop shows. Why not do it like they used to for hackers, and go “hey, you’re pretty skilled! How would you like to do some official work for us?”

      I suspect the biggest barrier is just loyalties and contracts with existing translation groups. Still, at this point, I have the cash to easily support the shows and series that I like, but I tend to avoid English works now because there’s no way to tell when it’s censored or just horribly localized. “Believe it!”

      Even a bad translation on an intact work is tolerable to me – if they could just implement some kind of industry-wide “seal of approval” that verifies that no art or dialog was intentionally changed from the original, I’d snap that stuff up en masse. Right now, I don’t have time to comb forums and websites every time I have a slight urge to buy some manga, so I just forgo it since I’m tired of being ripped off with edits/fakes.

      It’s funny how my manga purchasing has gone over the last 15 years… At first, a few Japanese tankoubon and English comic book style 1-2 chapter manga because that’s what there was. More tankoubon as anime became popular. Then a massive load of English translated books for about a decade, growing larger each year, then stopping a few years ago. Now it’s capped by a couple handfuls of tankoubon again. I feel sorry for the Japanese authors since this is an issue the English industry brought on itself, but it will still affect their bottom lines in Japan when people in the West choose to buy or pirate something.

  • Interestingly enough, this was one of the far more sane posts by a Mangaka about this issue. It was nice to read one where someone expresses gratitude to fans but still explains sanely why pirating is bad.

    It’s a nice change from the usual “AAAAAAAARGH FOREIGN BARBARIANS RAAWR DIE YOU HEATHENS!”

  • I download most Anime and only buy the good ones, if you want my money don’t half-ass it. If its good ill even go as far as importing if its not available locally.

    Really though im all for supporting them as long as it is good, there are countless trash gimmick Anime out there purely made to milk people for money. I think that as long as they continue to try and exploit fans, fans will continue to exploit them.

    It’s my money that i work hard for and i wont invest in faulty products. Try be for you buy FTW.

  • I like reading it online when it comes because i want to keep up with the story. American releases are just to slow but i still buy the manga so i can compare it with fan made translations and having a it as a book is always nice without the downloading or image loading times

    • Anime and manga won’t cease to exist. Sooner or later someone with more brains sitting in a company nearing bankrupcy will start to sell internationally in multiple languages. This someone will make tons of money and start to buy the rest of the anime / manga industry.

      The world market is huge. Even if most of the stuff gets pirated there is still enough money to earn to sustain a bigger anime / manga industry than Japan has now.

    • I really wish I could buy them off Japan, it be kinda nice to have manga like that as a collection, but I don’t have the money and I don’t think I ever read manga much in the first place…lol But there are “technical” ways to watch anime for free and not feel like a dick or without official streaming sites. It doesn’t have subs tho…

  • “”She can perhaps be forgiven for treating her readers as being intellectually stunted, given that an increasing proportion of anime fans the world over seemingly have great difficulty comprehending that anime and manga are not in fact charity works they are entitled to view for free, but instead can only exist as multi-million dollar commercial enterprises dependent upon direct financial support from fans.””

    No, she can’t. If they want to sell anime\manga to most of us, then release it translated please. I watch anime online that never comes here. I read manga that never comes here. And hey, guess what? If it DOES come here, I fucking buy it. What do they not understand about this? I have a few books published, in English only, if they are translated and stolen I’m not losing a fucking sale because, guess what, overseas people may not be able to read it in English thus, won;t buy it.

    I get it. So do most people. If we create things and people in other contries want them, they are pretty much sol unless someone translates it for them, or the publishers uses their brain to translate it for them and sell it overseas.

    I have had no luck getting my work outside the us. Even if I could find people to translate them, so I coudl try to get them out there on my own, well, hard things man. Hard things.

  • Yeah right….heard it a million times before, doesn’t apply to reality still.

    What about all the people who only became aware of said manga by reading scanlations and later decided to buy it? Doesn’t fit into the original rant so it doesn’t count as a valid point, eh?

    Sorry but there are so many series out there that i certainly won’t buy anything without proper evaluation beforehand. Did that statement just kill a dozen catgirls? Or mangaka? Didn’t think so.

    • That and i don’t see any non-japanese directors, sketchers or what not dying from there salary, something which is also regularly torrented and seeded.

      This pirate excuse is just a coverup for there own weak cashflow strategies…

        • In case you were unaware, there was a niche translation market for VHS fansubs that were copied and sent via snail-mail long before the internet took off. That’s why some of the first digital files (like the tiny RealMedia copies of Dragonball Z fansubs) ones were so incredibly static filled much of the time. The tapes were often 4th or 5th generation copies from the originals, and the signal degraded so badly that by the time the digital was made, it looked like garbage. Series that ended up on Cartoon Network like the ones you listed happened well after these VHS fansubs stirred up interest in anime.

  • they are attacking the same peoples that are acutely buy some mange or anime dvd, Blu rays ???

    money will always be spend on something only the priority is different … example merchandise of the related manga/anime , songs on CD , illustration magazine, etc. Ignore this fact. also this will free publicist of the excicst of it ??

  • We may be “immoral thieves” but at least we have fun ๐Ÿ˜›

    Seriously though i’m starting to believe that japanese people are a bit obsessed with morality. (At least theoretically). Sure no one can blame her for not wanting her work to be read for free. But you know.. If what you are doing isn’t giving you enough money then you should probably change your job. It’s not the end of the world.

    As for the equivalent exchange thing, that never existed in the human world to begin with.

    • The concept existed to a certain extent, but it’s more of a strived ideal rather than a reality.

      Also, if all creators gave up their jobs because they couldn’t make a living, our entertainment industry would be pretty damn boring.

  • Actually, this is one of the more sane responses we’ve had. I like this: this mangaka actually acted like a rational person in explaining why you shouldn’t pirate the series, rather than just going “BAAWWWW FOREIGN BARBARIANS RAWR”.

  • RaspberryKisses says:

    if there were more licensed anime in my country i would buy anime. but all we have it’s 20 or something old animes (licensed) and no new stuff at all. i love anime and i’m willing to spend money on it but i can’t because anime creators don’t even know or care that there is demand on their anime in my country. And i can’t watch it on TV like Japanese do. So i download anime.

    • well there are some few animes available and there air some on tv but those are not interesting/already seen/have a shitty dub/ shitty censor(up to the point of completely removing scenes
      worst excample: Naruto 52 eps is the whole anime series on tv. ok the number of eps is not the main problem cause there might actually be enough fillers to sum up to the rest but the voice and censors are frightening and im actually scared but just of the quality

      • RaspberryKisses says:

        yeh all anime on TV in my country (only one channel that shows anime and American cartoon shit) have dub (it makes me puke) and it’s so f’ing old that it’s not worth to even show. and they are looped so they show same anime over and over again. So it’s not even worth mentioning.

  • Well i think its really funny slight annoying.. The japanese do exactly the same as us.. They take our movies and download them and share.. Still they call us “Immoral Thieves”.. I love japan but i hate stupid people..

    • “Itโ€™s the same…walking out of a restaurant without paying.”

      I argue that she’s wrong with that parallel. It’s more like thanking the chef for the good food and waiters for the good service before walking out on the bill.

      • Not exactly.

        It’s like having someone somewhere far away from that restaurent to cook exactly the same for you. You eat, think it’s delicous and write to the creator of said recipe, that he did a wonderful job.

        Anyway, there is something really messed up about copyright. Like, the illusion only because you thought of the story first, you’d own it or something. Owning a story. Sounds ridiculous to me. I pay, if I pay at all, the one telling me the story, not the one that devised it.

        • If the creators – the mangaka – think they don’t earn enough, they have to change how they work. Like sell their manga themselves, without publishers, internationally, in several languages, using the internet. They’d earn way more.

          Alas, considering this article, they still need to start thinking first.

        • Yes, they shall stop making stories. I don’t care. If they just think up a story and I don’t have the means to read it, what good does it to me at all? It’s the one bringing it to me, that I have to thank. At least according to my logic. The same goes for technology. Only because somewhere someone thought up this really cool thing, it doesn’t mean anything to me. If I can’t access the technology, it might as well not be there at all, I don’t care.

          If he only brought half the story to me, I’ll have to go directly to the author, paying him to create more. So I pay the creator for stuff I want, but that isn’t completely created yet. And I pay distributors for stuff that is already created. And the distributors pay the creator. Or at least they should, but this isn’t how it goes always, sadly.

          Anyway without piracy I wouldn’t even think about creators at all, because I would be busy handling the distributors, which I skipped – because of piracy.

        • And that’s when the creators start thinking, “Well, if I can’t make enough money creating the story, I might as well not create a story at all.”
          You should be paying those who put their blood, weat, and tears into their work.
          Not the one who basically used conventional and 3rd-rate means to translate/tell the story.
          At least, for the most part. A small percentage could be given FOR their work, but the creator is the one who did most of it.

          At least, that’s what logic tells me.

  • Surprise! I buy Chinese-TLed Black Butler from Kinokuniya.
    Does the money go straight to her? No?
    Then what difference would foreigners who can’t read Japanese and have no reason to import directly from Japan make if they pirate or not. The money only goes to the publisher in the region.

    • The money never goes straight to her. In Japan, it goes to (estimated) the bookstore, the distributor, the publisher, and then her. A translated version goes to the bookstore, the local publisher, who pays a portion to their translation teams who are probably on contract, and another portion goes to licensing the manga in the first place from the Japanese publisher, which passes it on to the mangaka.

      So it’s not necessarily that the more you buy, the more the mangaka sees – but it IS a fact that whether or not you buy it, the local publisher has spent money to bring it here, and if no one buys it, they can’t justify doing that with another series.

    • The point is your local publisher also has to pay a certain amount to the Japanese original publisher to acquire the right to distribute it, and thats server as indication of how much popular the manga is, and how much privilege they can give to the mangaka also based on that. Well, unless even your local publisher is illegal distribute the manga themselves, which i don’t surprise since there a lot of publishers like that in my country

    • I think what she means is the money that they don’t receive thanks to the people who buy them and distribute them overseas or in Japan. If you think about it that way, then it makes a little more sense.

      • My bad for misreading.

        Then I still think many people’s idea of Steampowered online thingy is the way to go. There could be a percentage of the sales made online going back to the mangaka directly.

        Problem is piracy will still occur, and might go on even stronger due to the fact that the stuff is already translated and in digital format. D:

        However if the service locks up the files and allow streaming and not downloading etc, people would be pissed to be unable to rewatch/read while not being online. It’s like the same problem with Assassin’s Creed 2 and Ubisoft.

    • That’s the problem with any form of media with the net nowadays. Rather than trying to fight against piracy, they should try and allow their stuff to reach as many people as possible. Even Japan has some occurrence of piracy.

      One way is for instance, looking for overseas manga publishers. There are publishers here in Singapore that actually publish AND do good quality translation. (ChungYi for manga.)

      However there’s also the risk of losing money spent on publishing and marketing overseas. In the end mostly the very popular (not good, popular) titles are published.