2ch vs Sankaku Complex: Foreign Otaku “Greedy Thieves”

moe-pirate-by-takashina-masato

The fall of OneManga and the exchange of incendiary remarks between Sankaku Complex users and 2ch denizens continues, with the latest thread showing 2ch taking particular umbrage at such reported comments as “TV is free so manga should be free too!”

The latest exchange of fire was provoked by a Japanese news article highlighting the negative reaction of international fans to the closures:

“It’s weird that you have to pay for hamburgers when TV is free. McDonald’s should provide free hamburgers!”

“Writing manga and novels is tough. Just what do the guys saying ‘make it free’ think of the value of other people’s work?”

“Tell it to the publishers in your own country first!”

“Is TV free overseas?”

“In Japan it’s free too. What the hell are you talking about?”

“If TV is supposed to be free then please show me all those American movies and dramas for free too.”

“They’re pretty shameless even for a pack of beggars and thieves. If there are no official releases then get a company to import for you. If you can’t afford it then work.”

“Having to pay is weird. You pay every month for Internet. Make manga, music, anime and western movies free!”

“If you move to the system where ISPs have to pay money to a copyright association…”

“TV is free only because of advertising… think about it.”

“There are some like this in Japan too, but overseas otaku are just totally greedy and avaricious. You can’t make much of a market of their ilk.

They keep going on about making net contents free like it’s some great idea, but you just can’t make back your costs like this.”

“A question – how many millions of users did this site have? Will sales of manga increase without it? Or will they decrease without the publicity?”

“Who can say? They can either take the publicity or stop it for sales – in this case they chose to stop it.”

“A lot of the defenders were using that kind of sophistry to justify themselves. Not so much now though.”

“Without the site they have no way of knowing the manga at all, so it won’t sell in any case.”

“It seems if the anime is broadcast locally the manga sales tend to do well.

It seems that with people reading the manga for free and watching anime illegally, there’s no money in it so broadcasters drop it and as a result it continues not selling.”

“The attendance for events certainly went up, but at the same time sales were actually going down.”

“If they crackdown now their sales will only decrease even further…”

“What about the price difference between the US and Japan? Dragonball costs like $17.99?”

“America has price competition so you can get Dragonball for like $12 on Amazon. In Japan the same volume costs Â¥980, so it’s actually about the same.”

“Considering the cost of translation, typesetting and distribution, $17.99 is not unreasonable.”

“Japanese publishers are idiots, aren’t they? Just making it all-you-can-read for $5-$10 a month would have probably worked nicely.”

“Really, Japanese publishers should be joining together to launch a single ‘free’ site to draw in all their fans and make money from that.”

“So TV is free? Then let’s have American comics distributed free as well?”

“TV is free? Where? You can’t watch anime for free anywhere on Japanese TV.”

“If you let our manga out of the country human rights groups overseas will just start complaining. Japan is weak to foreign pressure, so it ends up affecting domestic sales in Japan as well.

Just what merit is there to letting people who refuse to pay money read our manga?”

“They just want mangaka to work for their benefit for free. Try working for free yourselves before lecturing others.”

“Just getting rid of the cheapskates who won’t pay won’t harm the publishers at all.”

“Remember when some foreign pirates illegally downloaded an eroge and then their worthless media was all over it saying it should be banned? [See here & here] Not only do these bastards think they have a right to get everything for free, they also think they have the right to criticise us!”

“Some anime tried free distribution, delayed a week after the Japanese airing. They still complained about it being late and the subs not being good enough, saying fansubs were still better – honestly I don’t think you can work with these people at all.”

“At least buy the manga you worthless beggars.”

“I get the impression they could just release an ‘English version for foreigners resident in Japan’ – they might well get a lot of overseas orders…”

“I’m a copyright holder. Honestly if you’re going to end up with it being watched by foreigners like this, especially creepy Chinese and Koreans, don’t turn it into an anime at all. These guys will never pay for anything, they deserve to be treated like maggots.

The same goes for whites and blacks like this. They should all be sued into oblivion, the Japanese like this too!”

“yooooooooo
YOOOOOOOOOO”

“They need to completely ban all subs in English and Chinese – they’re all just translating the English version into the other languages so getting rid of it will help.”

“What do you expect from the American masses? It seems most of them can barely tell Japan and China apart.”

“Foreigners = pirates.”

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849 Comments

  • Actually, I live here and I can say for sure that there aren’t many pirates in Japan. People buy what they like because there are so many anime-related shops nowadays.

    And don’t take the 2ch comments seriously. 2ch is a place where idiots who have nothing to do go and bitch about their sad lives. If you read the post and thought the otakus here are angry at foreigners, you’re wrong. 2channellers are looked down upon in Japan, did you know that?

    AndI guess it can’t be helped that there are more pirates overseas… And yes it’s because Japan doesn’t sell their stuff to foreigners (not directly, at least). And no they won’t be able to in the near future, either. Why? Because Japan will get complaints from those who get offended easily by manga/anime/games. I wonder if any of you guys know about the censorship problem here. The publishers get tonnes of complaints from both Western and other Asian countries about “offensive material”, and right now there’s the government’s thinking about implementing this retarded law that bannes sexual content, explicit violence, etc in manga and anime. The Japanese areN7t willing to sell their stuff overseas because they’re afraid of getting complaints like, “OMG THAT IS CHILD PORNOGRAPHY!” “ZOMG THE JAPANESE ARE SOO PERVERTED HOW COULD THEY SELL ERO FIGURINES LIKE THAT?!”
    Studio Ghibli is an exemption because they don’t have any dodgy material.

    So yeah… anyway what i really wanted to say was, most Japanese aren’t racist.
    And whoever said otakus are fat, you’re wrong. I know an American friend whos an otaku and he’s thin as heck. Plus most japanese otakus are skinny because they’re not interested in eating and they barely ever exercise lol.

  • Pirates can not afford to buy a product because the price is too expensive. While the price of these goods become expensive because of additional costs due to piracy.

    You like to debate between the chicken or the egg that comes out first.

  • Y’know, one issue I’ve found with the whole manga market in the English-speaking world is the method of distribution.

    Over in Japan, you have weekly and monthly comic anthologies. Jump, Ace, Dengeki, etc., all of these can be found on the newsstands and bought with cash money, meaning kids can work odd jobs or save their allowances for the latest issue and go buy it on their own after school. This allows lots of exposure to many different manga authors and their work, but more importantly, it allows the target demographic to remain centered on the 8-14 crowd.

    It’s different overseas. In America, Jump is the only manga anthology that shows up on the newsstands. Nearly all manga are thus purchased as full tankoubon, doing which requires either a trip to a brick-and-mortar bookstore or an online purchase.

    Problem 1: Most bookstore chains choose locations that make it problematic to reach them by foot. This means that the prospective buyer has to either commute by bus or drive there themselves. If they’re under 16, they can’t legally drive, and it’s not safe for kids to take the bus in most cities unless they ride with their parents.

    Problem 2: Buying online requires a credit card, which can’t be gotten legally in the USA until age 18. This means the parent would have to approve the purchase and use their own money to buy the manga for their kids.

    In both cases, this either forces the demographic of buyers above the 16-year-old mark, or brings the kids’ parents/guardians into the equation. This, in turn, means a lot more parental involvement in what their kids are reading and buying, and I think there’s a good majority of parents in the English-speaking world who would balk at buying their 13-year-old son a volume of ToLOVEru featuring Lala’s bare tits.

    It also skews the demographics and narrows the buying field a bit, as in the West – just as it is in Japan – most boys give up on reading comics once they hit high school age, so a lot of the over-14 crowd (who would have the purchasing power) simply are not interested in reading manga.

    Also factor in that a lot of manga is expensive – sometimes prohibitively so – in the English-speaking world, and you’ve got even more problems.

    I like the $10-$25/month unlimited online reading suggestion from that 2ch user. The industry really should jump on that idea; they banded together to take down OneManga, why not band together for the sake of getting their foot into a market full of potential? There are tons of World of Warcraft addicts perfectly willing to pony up that kind of cash every month for the same old shit, day after day. Why not push manga at them?

  • IDK why japanese people are complaining and calling foreigners pirates, when they come to our country they are the foreigners. they shouldnt say hurtful things like that to others, instead of saying all those xenophobic things on 2chan, they should go an d make babie, if not then in a few years there’ll be more “foreigners” who will be willing to take care of their women. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

  • I’ll admit that Americans illegally get their media for free more than they should, but…

    Come on, you’re really gonna tell me Japanese people don’t do this kind of crap too? Has Japan really set itself back to where they believe all foreigners to be “black sails”, and that everything about their way of life is pure? (a familiar attitude they insult Americans for, might I add)

    Come on people, do we really have to automatically steriotype? Let’s be buddies! No? Alright, fuck you then.

  • Long story short:

    I’d buy these things if they WERE ACTUALLY OFFERED IN THE STATES. Most of these things won’t see the light of day in the USA or Canada, only the most popular or “most suitable” properties will ever get a shot at that market. So honestly, I don’t care if shut ins in Japan want to call foreigners a bunch of freeloaders. You simply can’t freeload on what you could never pay for in the first place considering there’d never be an English translation otherwise.

    So, until anime and manga studios start offering more translations and subs for reasonable prices online, or finding a way with greater breadth in brick and mortar stores, its most people’s only option. 2Ch and other such places can troll, insult, and rage all they want, I could care less. In the end, they aren’t the ones making anything I care about. I’m waiting on the industry to do something productive instead.

  • I enjoy the free manga offered on the internet, but I also understand the need for the mangakas and publishers to acquire food and shelter; yes, I understand they are human and manga are a result of their vocation. We need to be able to give them some money, but another reality is: if the ACG seize to be free, the industry would probably not survive anyways. The market and demand of them is not very big in North America. The free products that we get would do better to advertise for the companies than to profit.

    I for one, a soft-core ACG lover, which is the vast majority of ACG lovers, know that I would probably cut ties with this Japanese Pop Culture if it stopped having free benefits. As of now, I occasionally buy and even donate to the Japanese companies, but if I were to be required to pay, I would just stop being involved all together.

  • The problem is that there is a middleman, jacking to prices from $5 a book to $12 a book due to licensing fees and paying translators. Yet there are plenty of people who will translate the manga and put it up on the internet for free.

    The copyright holders should get with the scanlators and use their translations for foreign releases of the manga. This can cut the sale price of the manga, which in turn can help increase sales in an unstable economy.

    Copyright holders should care more about pushing solid merchandise like figures as there is no way us “maggots” will be getting things like that for free.

  • we cant help but use online manga readers because the availiblity of manga here suck
    normal bookstores never stock the manga you want and even if they do have it itll only have like every third volume
    even specalty store never have the whole set
    plus it takes to long for them to license and offically translate them and certain reliable scantalaters do a much better job

  • i’ve lived off and on in Japan. i have a decent collection of Japanese anime DVDs. i am fluent in Japanese and Korean so i prefer original presses, but money and distance won’t always allow it. i like to support my favorite writers, artists and studios. so why would i pirate anything?

    1. bizarre random censorship – i have noticed it more than a few times. i once watched a movie in Japan, then watched a DVD with a friend in the USA. there were random scenes missing. i refuse to pay for incomplete works.

    2. unreleased – some of my absolute favorite series have remained unreleased internationally for years. Nodame Cantabile tops this list at the moment (i so want the Wii games, too).

    3. export of tons of total crap vs. export of a few quality titles – whenever i look at a translated manga book rack in the USA, i laugh. i know that so much of that is either unpopular in Japan or very old and licensing/publishing rights were likely cheap.

    i would also like to point out the FALLACY that companies use to justify high prices and content control. they claim they lose ‘millions’ of dollars/yen/wan/etc. to pirates by counting sheer downloads. this relies on two ideas: pirates would buy EVERYTHING they had been taking and that pirates somehow prevent people from buying stuff. the companies use this as an excuse to put the squeeze on their artists and writers (just like in music).

    i think it is easy to see that those are totally false. the pirates are not stealing DVDs and tankobon volumes. also taking into account unreleased anime/manga, a substantial amount wouldn’t represent lost sales anyways. people are also still buying licensed DVDs and goods en masse; just do an image search for anime/manga collections. in short, the executives are just angry that they couldn’t afford their fourth mansion/yacht/Ferrari and fret about imaginary money and sales.

    Hollywood made a record profit from massive budget movies in 2009, despite constant MPAA complaints that pirates were ‘killing’ the industry. same goes for music companies and the RIAA, reaping massive profits in 2009.

    as someone that works in the entertainment industry myself, i think more companies need to start listening to their fanbase. those that have taken a chance with their ear to the fans have been totally rewarded.

    btw, i’ve tried to avoid naming companies so it wouldn’t look like i was shilling for a company.

  • I like how 2ch equates sankaku with ‘westerners’, when the majority of sankaku users are made up of AUS, NZ, UK, & Singapore.

    Even funnier is that almost 90% of manga raws are uploaded from japan. Police your own country before crying about it to us. You are the source of your own problems, japan!

  • If foreigners are thieves what do you call some of my friends (and me) who spent average $1600 every months importing all their merchandise? seriously they lack of brain capacity to think. Anyway didn’t they think some of their “kin” is the RAW provider of their copyrighted media?

  • I don’t know about you guys, I but I wouldn’t complain if it weren’t because anime brought to america are critically wounded in the process by publishers and censors leave it somewhere past from unwatchable

  • “Japanese publishers are idiots, aren’t they? Just making it all-you-can-read for $5-$10 a month would have probably worked nicely.”

    ^Truer words are hard to find

    The point of making it free is making manga availible the same way as books at the libary
    aka pay the artists through tax money

    Granted the Libaries would be very troubled having everyone wanting it the moment of the release(guess you could make online reading that way

  • Ehh, this again? ..Or rather not again, but still dragging on.

    Ever heard that hard-life phrase?
    “Sh!t stinks same way everywhere”

    Seeing how we’re on the Internet, any sort of argument is waste of air required for brain to work, and some braincells that die in process from overdose of stress.

    I saw some puzzling fanfic about this..war story to be precise. Amusingly enough, give those people real guns and field and they would start to kill each other, without even remembering what was the reason, after some time.

    Mankind never learns 😀

  • otakuは海賊行為に厳しい
    彼らが誇りを持ってその産業を支持しているから
    日本人にも同じように非難する

    海賊行為してanime fanなんて言うな
    どんな言い訳も正当化もできない
    こうしてforumで語り合う権利ないよ

    ↑Read by Pirate fansub

  • Ahhh a great amount of hate spread about… I find you all foolish for arguing amongst yourselves over something as foolish as this. Actually you guys make me a bit sad. I am really starting to wonder just how how old some of you are. As for me, I will say I read manga on one manga. That does not mean I would not by manga, I have several book shelves of manga myself. I am also writing my own manga currently. had anyone buy it when it comes out, and upload it to the net. I don’t care. I would make enough money from the sales anyways. I am saddened by all your childish attitudes on the subject. So one-manga is gone. Life goes on. But please…. just act your age. I’m 18 and I feel more mature then some of you…

  • To form a crowd for the purpose of focusing on collective hating must be pretty refreshing for the japanese otaku as they usually take the despised position – just kidding.

    But if one assumes that the mass-distribution, physical or digital, can be kept up like it used to be, then that person is just not contemporary.
    None can require money vor 1 and 0, the adherence on that atavistic condition shows deeply anchored backwardness: massively spread articles used to have the luck to be demanded, nowadays they aren’t and none has a claim on luck, hence distributers of those goods have to come up with a new concept (that includes the music-industry as well). Requiring conservative conditions should not be desired.

    gez. Ger.-reader

  • A lot of titles like Kodomo no Jiken isn’t coming to the states, how am I going to get it if not through piracy? Plus I buy manga based on the ones I pirate, without piracy I wouldn’t be able to buy a lot of the manga I currently have.

    Also YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

  • The reason 2ch is bragging is because they’re all NEETs and get their parents to buy manga for them. Its easy to buy when the money’s not yours, right? Try buying anything with crushing student debts and a part time job that pays minimum wage.

  • ideas are free,culture is free,embrace the copyleft
    i was thinking about japanese as open minded
    but know i discover only medieval thinking
    they are frustreated about their closed society
    full of rules and empty of freedom
    new slaves for the money god

  • I find it funny how the scanslation scene was ignored by the license holders for years because it actually generated sales.

    Good luck trying to sell the license for a manga about bread-baking without it becoming infamous for being a hilarious read long before it s anime adapation through scanlation.

    The minute the scans became readily available without the inconvenience of having to search for the stuff on IRC and we have tons of people including japanese people who learned english at school reading them, thus directly affecting the japanese sales figures and thus leading to the current situation.

    New Manga stll gets licensed, things like Bleach, Naruto or One Piece aren`t in danger of not beong published any longer in the western world.

    So where to the japanese rights holders lose money?
    In the japanese scene.

    And mostly not in the tankoubon sales (which people still buy to reread the series they love whenever they want to), but in the magazine sales, since people are satisfied to know whats going on in current chapters by reading those online and not having to buy the same manga twice as a magazine and as a tankoubon.

    • Is this really the reason the Japanese publishers kicked up a fuss? Is there something more?

      Because, either wittingly or unwittingly, they’ve thrown fuel on the fire of Japanese Otaku cultural-appropriation butt-hurt, causing this stir we see here. I can’t measure the damage this has done to international Otaku relations. While I see many comments on Sankaku trying to take 2ch arguments into consideration and arguing a case, it seems like the only 2ch lines that have been translated into English have been either hate-filled and vitriolic, or are choosing to retort to arguments that are not particularly compelling (or even idiotic “TV is free why can’t manga be free hurp durp”). Is this because this is all that is being said in Japanese, or is it because more interesting arguments would be too long and too annoying to translate for us? I want to know.

  • The irony is that the japanese publishers mostly went against the english sites mostly because japanese people (who also learn english at school) went there for their easy manga fix (to dodge having to go to some peer to peer service which have a long history of being logged in japan), therefore affecting their sales directly.

    The publishers didn`t mind the publicity in the west they got through scanslation, allowing them to actually make “more” profit of licensing obscure manga titles for western distribution (just look at all those years where hundreds of odd-ball titles were licensed “just in case they get popular”, but were never actually released on paper afterwards).

    It was A-ok as long as some effort was involved to fetch them from IRC or peer 2 peer.

    Throw the scanslations (which the japanese companies and fans happily ignored until then) on easy to reach, easy to use platforms to make reading them involve no effort at all and see the japanese sales figures cut back.
    It was exactly the same thing when a japanese fan simply uploaded a video showing his copy of shonen jump and slowly showing off each site for people to read.

    Convenient way to read it for free –> japanese fans (which are the target audience which actually matters to the distributors) hop onto the train other people have been sitting on for years without any hassles –> current situation

    • That’s very interesting. Here I was wondering how foreign scanlations affected the Japanese Publishers, and you’ve provided an answer. So you think it’s because Japanese fans started reading the free English translations?

  • I’m an otaku and a NEET in one of those post-soviet republics. I do not intend to work, my money is limited and so I cannot legally buy anime, why if I can dl it for free, and I already paid so much for internet(150 euros a year for 20MBit+public ip+no FUP)? I have not upgraded my hardware for seven years, so I can only play DVD resolution anyway, sometimes 1280×720 with well set lavdopts parameters in mplayer will play well on my AMD Duron 1800Mhz.

    I cannot work because all money a would get would decrease my social support from state and so I would not get any additional value, I would have to work half a month to get what I have now without having job at all, and only after that I would get some more money. I do prefer slacking and bumming around while I can, the damned politicians are going to stop this next year so as our state does not end up like Greece, and I will have to find a job. Damn!!!

    By allowing to download anime, Japan is spreading it’s cultural influence, it’s like in Civilization. I have found my personality very similar to Sato from anime series NHK, I made a lot of same stupdities and laughed a lot while watching it. I embraced otaku, NEET and hikikomori culture of Japan, and identified myself with it. For me Japan is a paradise garden for NEETs and hikkis, when there are so much of them. It is defining their culture. I wished I lived in Japan and was otaku and hikikomori there.

    Thanks much to fansubs for bringing this culture to me!!!

    • “By allowing to download anime, Japan is spreading it’s cultural influence, it’s like in Civilization. I have found my personality very similar to Sato from anime series NHK, I made a lot of same stupdities and laughed a lot while watching it. I embraced otaku, NEET and hikikomori culture of Japan, and identified myself with it. ”

      I live in Taiwan. I’m 27. I’ve slaved away at English since I was five. I’ve had every class in school and every private instruction there is. I practice it with every native speaker I can find in Taipei. I’ve worked hard at it, very hard.

      If I could construct sentences with richness and complexity like yours, I would be very happy indeed. Hell, I’d almost give up sex, LOL!

      My hat is off to you, sir.

      BTW, politicians suck everywhere!

  • I have to at least say One thing on this war before it’s over.

    I understand why people would get onto the internet and get manga/anime for free, I’ve never done it my self most of my friends have. Most people live on the internet so finding manga/anime on here that they like gets them interested into finding more.

    Me, I would rather buy them than watch them/download them for free. I have a great respect for a lot of manga/anime artist as I would love to aspire to become one myself. What others do, well, I see that as it’s their business and not mine.

    I definitely see where 2ch is coming from blaming everyone for wanting it all for free, but I also see it from our side as well. Really, I think all this war consists of is just one person blaming another and so on and so forth.

    The manga/anime artists distribute their works to the masses and eventually someone will pick it up and wants to share it with others over the internet. It’ll Always happen no matter what anyone says or does. People will get their hands on raw material and sub it for free, sending it out onto the internet for all to get their hands on.

    This war here is just one of Many that will keep happening as long as the internet exists. Just because someone says no doesn’t mean that others will listen.

  • > “They just want mangaka to work for their benefit for free. Try working for free yourselves before lecturing others.”
    I do work for free. Or more specifically, I give out software for free, but if you want more support (or specific customizations) than the supplied docs, you will have to pay for it.

  • okay we’ve reached the conclusion that 2 ch are hypocrites reading manga online is still stealing and prices are exorbatant for each side exactly how long are we gonna focus on onemanga it sucked there are series that I love that aren’t even on there and they always had late scans you know you shouldn’t really be angry at 2ch though they just want us to care granted they’re going about it horribly but yeah that’s it I,m probably gonna get downvoted but Sankaku is probably like this sadistic figure laughing at all of us sankaku basically just wants us to fight its battles for it I,m not tryin to turn all eyes on sankaku just you know this feud is never gonna end If they keep up this ridiculous he said she said .granted 2ch started it first but let them be I think the first 2 times they voiced their rage we got it …lol you know I,m bothering to type all this to kinda voice hey we shouldn’t fight over stuff but we all know the comments that are gonna make it to 2ch are “Those fuckin japs are hypocrites lets shut down 2ch servers” and not one intelligent comment is gonna make it over there not one tryin to discusss compromise or anythng and If one does make it its gonna be trounced by an unbeleivably hateful more intense comment god this entirew situation is like a bad accident with a fifty car pile up you know its horrible but you just curiosly wanna look

  • I like to live in Japan. But I think what I would get the most from most Japanese is, “Get the f*ck out of here foreigner-scum!” So it kind of scares me. I wish that some publishing corporation would release all legal-copy right manga material in the U.S. I pay for it. I pay for everything. I don’t illegally read manga or watch anime that is not legally published. All it is is acceptance. I support Japan’s interest here. And it’s correct. Nothing is free. If you want something you have to pay for it.

  • i’m agree with manga not be free
    money= more manga and better quality
    but i’m disagree with racist coment that foreign people are piracy??
    come on, japan in the history always copy everything
    or you want another little boy in your city?

    US is not all world

  • kajunbowser says:

    Grrrreat! Yet another chance for the 2chan hypocrites to blather on about “Americans suck” and all the rest of the ignorant B.S. they’re saying.

    Don’t they realize already that we could definitely f-up these 2channers’ niche markets by just not giving a damn about anime, manga and galge industries? Well, we practically do somewhat, as we pay usually somewhere around half on the products that they buy anyway over here, lol.

    I believe we’ve discovered the least intelligent group of 2trolls on the internet: the ones with their pantsu in a twist over OneManga. Never saw what the big deal was around the site being shut down anyway. (~_~)

  • Amusing.
    Sadly, though, I have to agree with some of what they say. English-language manga and anime fans really the most terrible bunch of freeloaders. I look at the credits on anime and I see Chinese names, Thai, Korean, Vietnamese, even studios from tiny Singapore. English names? Once.
    Japanese fans also draw dojinshi and turn pro, giving back to the system.
    They become animators and live on $10,000 a year so you can watch for free.
    I can see why some of them get a little tweaked by how leech-like a lot of foreign otaku are.

    • So… because you see in the credits the names of people of nationalities other than japan involved in the production of the anime, freeloaders from these countries have more of a right to pirate than English speaking fans? You know that the reason that anime is out-sourced to countries like Korea, China and Singapore is because it’s much cheaper for Japanese companies as they need only pay these foreign animators a fraction of the money they would be paying their own Japanese workers, thus contributing to the problem of underpaying homegrown animators and taking money OUT of the domestic economy?
      I think many of us are failing to address the underlying issue: the fact that various pre-existing problems in the current system are being blamed on conveniently generalised scapegoats, in this case those “nasty foreigners”.

    • One: Proof

      Two: Generalisation

      Three: Without sites like OneManga, then Naruto wouldn’t be as well known, and the mangaka would be living on eating pencils and paper. The only reason why series like Naruto, OnePiece, Bleach etc are so popular is because of the popularity online. There wouldn’t even be translated copies of manga if it didn’t exist

  • You can read American comics for free online, those are called webcomics (duh)! They even encourage being translated into other languages and make money selling their merch and books (pretty much) directly.
    Don’t mangaka get shit pay from publishers? Just destroy that stagnant publishing system for good and get an international audience without having to be licensed overseas.

  • Why everyone has to be so damn extreme about this?
    Oh, right… lack of brains.

    To all japanese jingoists: I’m a foreigner and I download some manga and anime.
    Yet, I also buy A LOT of anime DVDs and manga, have imported tons of artbooks and figures, and have convinced friends of also doing it.
    Considering I have to pay high taxes on those, no one can ever question how much I have contributed.

    I can guarantee you that if there were no fansubbers and websites like OneManga, the revenue generated from big titles that are known around the world wouldn’t be as big (such as One Piece, Full Metal Alchemist, Naruto and others).

    Hollywood movies made and planned to be based on mangas and animations would never be made. Doesn’t matter if you like them or not, truth is that this generates tons of money.

    Finally, it has been proven over time that fighting piracy is fucking stupid. You can’t fight information sharing. The smart people are finding ways to use this in their favour. Idiots are burning money on failed attempts of shutting up p2p networks and stuff. You shut one down today, tomorrow will be another 10 filling it’s role.
    I just can’t understand why these people learned nothing from Napster.

    I spend at least 2000 bucks every year with anime and manga related stuff. Of course, if there were no fansubbers and websites like OneManga ever, I wouldn’t even know animes and mangas. Would probably be spending all my hobby money on movies and series instead.

    But I know what’s the problem with publishers – it’s the same as music labels: They refuse to confront the problem and find a real solution, since their brains got so filled with greed there’s no more space for creativity.
    They are going the RIAA way, and they are going to get fucked for it.
    You don’t have to go far to see that. With all the news of how bad mangaka work conditions are for ridicule wages, it’s pretty obvious how much greed dominates some publishers’ schedule.

    One way or the other, industries like the ones shutting down torrent websites, making a couple of arrests over the course of a year while hundreds of thousands continue getting what they want, are fighting a losing battle.

    Which is fine by me, really. Because they’ll give room to those able to adapt to the new reality and move on.

  • God Dammit Sankaku, Stop reporting on this. This argument is no longer an argument, and more of people spouting “that could work” or “this could work” while the stupider post angry comments. We seem to have reached the decision that pirated manga is still stealing, so why are we continuing to fight?

    • Because the issue isn’t as simple as just saying “pirated manga is still stealing”. Reaching this conclusion without considering the context leads to the kinds of comments we are seeing from the more extreme 2ch posters.

  • All I can say is wow. but anyways if the selfish japanse could start releasing the good stuff out side japan so I never have to import. Sure they say if you don´t have money work sure im working my ass of but still I can not afford allot of the stuff cuz the Import taxes in Sweden are freaking high but they never taught that we have import taxes did they ?? I say japan start selling more license. it took japan 6 final fantasy games before selling a license so we in Sweden could share a great series.

  • Again, the home guardians on allowance can suck a pole. I pay for my stuff, I use free sites to find good stuff and then buy it IF it localizes. If we could buy all the stuff we read, I’m sure many of us would. But the fact is, obscure shit doesn’t get published. Fuck, I’m insanely baffled about Sundome being published. There’s a series you would HAVE to have trolled online before you’d know it was published and yet, Yen goes apeshit and cans these sites that led to people like me buying their stuff.

    They should earn their own money before they whine that we refuse to spend all our earned money on stuff (I generalize they are all home guards, but fuck them, they generalize us first)

  • ChaosAngelZero says:

    “There are some like this in Japan too, but overseas otaku are just totally greedy and avaricious. You can’t make much of a market of their ilk.”

    I’ve already bought over one thousand manga tankoubon, all licensed, translated and published by Editorial Ivrea. I’ve spent hundreds upon hundreds of dollars over some good ten years, since they started publishing Ranma ½ way back on May, 1999. I’ve read all kinds of series, from Evangelion to Midori no Hibi.

    Now I mostly buy classic series (Dragon Ball and One Piece have just started serialization down here) since most new ones are just pathetic, clearly a downwards trend of Japan’s comic industry, just as their animation series and videogames ones.

    I’d recommend you Japs stop buying shit moe blob and “ecchi” series and start demanding more quality and real variety in your products.

  • Fapping Time says:

    everytime I read anything regarding 2ch users, I’m filled with the urge to kick the shit out of them and steal their collections of goodies…

    shouldn’t be like that, we’re all anime fans in this, but just like in the really real world, douche bags are everywhere…

  • i honestly hope 2ch users read this comment.

    you act as if manga writers are losing an exorbitant amount of money because of scanlations. why not try looking at your own precious companies that pay mangaka. they’re cheated out off every cent they make. its a widely well known fact that they don’t get nearly enough money as they SHOULD. pirating manga hurts sales as much as pirating hollywood movies. the piece of pie lost is smaller than the actual money going into combating pirates. wasting energy and resources on something that WILL continue is ridiculous.
    and all this drama coming out of 2ch is just hate for non-japanese for whatever reason. i read pirated manga. but i buy merchandise of the manga i read. have you ever tried downloading t-shirts, action figures, posters, and countless other merchandise that spawns off of every property? kinda difficult.
    i believe the companies going after scanlation sites are fighting a futile battle, and is only doing this to try and strike fear and terror to those who enjoy pirated booty, and maybe hopefully discouraging future pirates. a move taken from the fucks at hollywood.

    now if you’ll excuse me, i gotta get back to watching High School of the Dead. And reading Naruto. thanks japan! keep em coming!

  • You wanna know what’s the funniest part about all this lol onemanga isn’t even closed down you just can’t read manga on it anymore but there still forums where you can….post links to sites that do allow you to lol ha ha fucking pricks hey If they keep calling us “hairy barbarians” lets call em “infertile cockolds”

  • man just fuck these 2 ch ass holes they hate a women just because she was honest about her love life….pfft as If they were with her in the first place. you shouldn’t let 2ch discourage you about japan though theyre like the shit on people’s shoes of japan anyway fuckin hypocrites they call us maggots well fine I,m goonna feed and fester off of your filty rotten asses and enjoy every minute of it in fact I feel like burning a bunch of manga and have the same manga up online then take a picture of it yeah dawn it its like they took everything that was wrong with hmanity and made it into a ball then named it 2ch

      • @ Anon 1 and Anon 2. Both of your ideas are ideal for all of us Manga fans there. My only concern though, whether or not they would simultaneously release their manga/volume/chapters/ a week or 2 after its release. Also, would their be “region protections?” Because if that’s the case, I don’t see it working well.

        @ Anon 2. Damn right. I wish they’d have an 18+ section with doujinshi and hentai novels. Unfortunately, I don’t see it happening anytime soon. (Especially with American business)

        • Why not just make a JP-registered server with an English page selling it directly to consumers via credit card? 18+, region protection problems, etc. – N/A. Censorship, too – governments can’t really do anything about a foreign company without any physical presence on their soil.

  • Christ they are still bitching about this? Don’t they have like manga cafes everywhere where you can pay like the price of a Mcdonalds hamburger and read all the manga you want for an hour and one can find manga in waiting rooms and discarded on the fucking subway. What do we have like that? The very limited selection at my local library? Having to sit amongst the chattering 14 year olds in the manga section at Barnes and Noble? Or paying $20 for a book I can finish in 15 minutes (much less if its not a dialog heavy series).

  • “They’re pretty shameless even for a pack of beggars and thieves. If there are no official releases then get a company to import for you. If you can’t afford it then work.”

    … do they really expect us to learn japanese and take several jobs to read some manga? *punches a baby in the place of those shitty 2ch otaku*

    “There are some like this in Japan too, but overseas otaku are just totally greedy and avaricious. You can’t make much of a market of their ilk.

    They keep going on about making net contents free like it’s some great idea, but you just can’t make back your costs like this.”

    … … … … apparently they don’t seem to notice the people suggesting monthly payment services.

    “yooooooooo
    YOOOOOOOOOO”

    by far the smartest comment up there

  • Looking at the comments reminds me of a bunch of kids fighting over a toy!Grow up and let the right holders deal with it.Race doesn’t matter with the ignorance of some of the statements it just makes me sick.We all live on the same rock so learn to deal with it.

  • They say we can’t tell the difference between China and Japan, yet they seem to have a hard time discerning between Americans and the rest of the planet.

    It’s funny how they lump us up with the feminists. The so called human rights groups that speak out against manga are a small but very loud voice. The rest of us want nothing to do with them. They should note that we hate them just as much as they do.

  • I may not approve of everything Funimation does, but I like that they have previews and even entire episodes on their site. I’ve been buying more of their DVDs than I used to as a result. If only the companies would do the more obscure anime that I like… I think they’re doing better than they used to on that front, though.

    On the other hand, I rarely buy manga anymore. I only buy what I like and can look at before making the purchase, and bookstores tend to be more expensive than online stores like amazon (in my area- $10 difference between the two). Without scanslations or at least proper previews online, I’d have to use word-of-mouth. But my friends have a completely different taste than I do, so I couldn’t even trust that.

    And this is being gracious and assuming the manga in question is being distributed overseas. Which it usually isn’t.

  • “There are some like this in Japan too, but overseas otaku are just totally greedy and avaricious. You can’t make much of a market of their ilk.”

    This guy is in a bit of denial if he thinks it is just “some” Japanese that steal manga.

    “A question – how many millions of users did this site have? Will sales of manga increase without it? Or will they decrease without the publicity?”

    99% of what one manga had was read only because it was free. Outside of a few rare and interesting titles no one in their right mind would pay that crap.

    “Without the site they have no way of knowing the manga at all, so it won’t sell in any case.”

    Many more sites out there.

    “It seems that with people reading the manga for free and watching anime illegally, there’s no money in it so broadcasters drop it and as a result it continues not selling.”

    Most of the Anime you will ever see over here is generally garbage like Naruto. It is amazingly rare to find gems like Cromartie High School out here.

    “So TV is free? Then let’s have American comics distributed free as well?”

    You actually want them?

    “If you let our manga out of the country human rights groups overseas will just start complaining. Japan is weak to foreign pressure, so it ends up affecting domestic sales in Japan as well.”

    Give your politicians a kick in the ass.

    “Just getting rid of the cheapskates who won’t pay won’t harm the publishers at all.”

    Yup, the declining manga sales and the state of the business is more or less solely on Japans shoulders.

    “Remember when some foreign pirates illegally downloaded an eroge and then their worthless media was all over it saying it should be banned? [See here & here] Not only do these bastards think they have a right to get everything for free, they also think they have the right to criticise us!”

    Funny I recall it was the fact that it was for sale on Amazon and a bored news broadcaster came across that fact.

    Also tell your politicians to grow some balls and stop bowing to international pressure.

    “They need to completely ban all subs in English and Chinese – they’re all just translating the English version into the other languages so getting rid of it will help.”

    Generally they translate from the original Japanese to any other language. No one wants a translation of a translation.

    “What do you expect from the American masses? It seems most of them can barely tell Japan and China apart.”

    Well can you tell Canada and the U.S.A. apart?

    “Foreigners = pirates.”

    Arrrrrr Matey!

  • “Some anime tried free distribution, delayed a week after the Japanese airing. They still complained about it being late and the subs not being good enough, saying fansubs were still better – honestly I don’t think you can work with these people at all.”

    I buy some manga and I’m pleased with the translation, however the editors site clearly states that the Jap copyright holders don’t allow them to catch up to the latest volumes forcing a lag

    I stopped buying anime DVDs cause the translation and/or dubbing is aweful, bad, terrible, crap(it’s that bad). I’m considering buying some recent series to check the quality of recent translations though.

    If I’m forced to choose between good-free fan translations and expensive-crap official releases, don’t expect me to buy the crap ones.

    It’s not too diferent from reading inside the shop or seeing it in a friends house, the internet just made it 100x easier and almost guilt free

  • considering we don’t have access to most manga…other then the internet….we don’t have much choice but to take…if they published most of the manga that i like…here in the usa..i would buy it in a heartbeat….i would much rather own a hard copy then some digital crap….but it still comes off as hypocritical considering most of japanese otaku have and do steal manga, music, movies, games and what not…so i think before they start slinging accusations..they should first curb there own pirate ways.

  • i support fansubing and manga translation . but it is a problem wen the pulshers in the EU don’t care and think it is idiotic.. i can’t fucking read japanes and i can’t fucking understand japanes.thets way i don’t buy somting i don’t understand. if the japanes publishers and the funsabing grups get tgther and ther will be motly pay system for dowlonding manga and anime in english ill pay to dowlond . i buyed the suzumiya haruhi blue ray becose it has english subs.

    go japan . if you dump the frogine publishers and go white fansubs you get money frogine publishers sucks.
    they think they know somting but they suck ..

    i will pay if it will be availibel.. plz..

    • Dude, work on your English. I don’t think any Japanese or English speaker will understand you like that.

      Although I kinda get way you’re saying in the end. Japan should dump its foreign Manga publishers and do it themselves right? Well, it ain’t gonna happen anytime soon because the Japanese Publishers have yet to even transition to digital releases. Also, they haven’t put enough effort in their foreign market. OpenManga is simply an attempt by scanlators and online fans to pull a Crunchyroll on Manga. As far as I’m concerned, I have yet to see the Japanese Publishers or Mangaka make any official annoncement/endorcements of the model. The future of Manga is looking bleak, but all we can do is wait, and see how all this rolls out.

  • Great. Now 2ch is pissed and some Sankaku members will post equaly pissed off responses and those will be the only ones to make it back to 2ch and thus the cycle continiues. Why can’t we just get along?

  • TV isn’t free. TV actually costs (at least in Sweden) a fee. However, you must pay this fee or else you won’t have a TV.

    By this logic, I should be able to tape something from a TV channel and give to someone else that has a TV, since they also could have seen it on TV in one way or another. So therefor, distributing TV rips is pretty much like letting someone else watch your TV, which is in fact free for everyone involved. It’s kinda like lending someone a book, it’s the same principle. Is lending a book to someone illegal? I think not.

    So therefor, downloading TV rips from different countries should follow the same standard. After all, you don’t pay for the channel and programs themselves, you pay just for actually being able to use your TV (at least in Sweden). Therefor downloading TV rips of anime should in fact not be illegal at all.

    I can see the problem with manga though, since they aren’t published for free anywhere.

  • So Japanese are ranting about their prized possession manga and anime hmmm…. saying all foreigners are pirates but if we look at our perspective Japanese to us are foreigners so who is the real one huh?

  • Kinny Riddle says:

    Funny, I thought I saw a South Park episode subbed into Japanese on a Japanese streaming website (not NicoNico) the other day.

    And when right-wing politicians proposed a conscription system in which these 2ch right-wing hikkikomoris are finally being given a chance to actually be useful to their society as well as a golden opportunity to give these “upstart Koreans” and other disrespectful foreigners the stuffing they deserve, since they’ve always been bashing Koreans/foreigners (mostly Korean) 24/7, they all chicken out.

    Fucking hypocrites.

    • @ Kinny. Yep that’s pretty much it. That’s what the 2ch people get for not allowing immigrants in their country. If neighboring Asians would AT LEAST be allowed to enter the country, they’ve would’ve gotten more foreign gals and labor that’s essentially needed for a country that’s declining in population and economically. In other words, thanks to their xenophobia, they will now miss out on those great Korean or Chinese gals and get neither in Japan. Thanks to the 2ch and their right-wingers, they will be lonely roneries for the rest of their lives.

      @ Jack D. Ripper. You should watch Welcome to NHK! You’ll like it. 😉

  • Silly Japanese people think Americans can’t tell two different cultures apart. It is kind of funny how they think we’re all just a happy bunch of pirating idiots. I say if anything gets put on the internet, people shouldn’t be surprised if people look at it, let alone download it.

  • Several of my Japanese contact told me that lot’s of Japanese download western stuff by the truckload. Some because the can’t pay for it, some because it is hardly availible there, some for preview purpose and some because they believe as a Japanese person they don’t have to pay for it since it does not come from Japan because we all know that the japanese are the master race -_-. Anyway they download for the same reasons as the western world does, they are no better or worst in most cases. So yeah hypocrite much?

  • I’ll bet anything that the amount of anime/manga piracy in Japan is just as bad, if not worse than it is outside of Japan.

    I mean, no way everyone is willing to pay 50,000yen just for 1 series. The hardcore otakus maybe, but I’m sure it gets tons of pirated downloads.

    2ch is just a bunch of hypocritical racist faggots.

  • You know what, I download Anime series and movies and because of that I legaly own between 200-300 anime’s. Before I could download anime I would very rarely buy anime for the simple fact that because I could not preview it before hand and got burned 2 out of 3 times buying a crappy show that was not worth the money and support. Before I could download I had to go buy word of mouth and reviews and because of several bad investments I became extremely reluctant to buy anything. But thanks to illegal downloading I can now preview them and buy the one’s that are good and worth the money and thus the risk became a lot less of buying bad shows that do not deserve support, thus increasing the amount I would buy from then on. So yeah I do not feel guilty for downloading even tho it’s illegal, cause in the end I made me spend more money in buying it legaly. But if you really want to make me buy less legaly or nothing at all anymore, I will gladly stop downloading, but don’t come crying when sales and profit go down because people buy less because of it, that will simply be your own fault. Either take the bad with the good or don’t take it at all. ;).

  • HOLY SHIT so many comments here! xD

    Anyway, people should just stop crying. We’re no worse than Japanese and Japanese are no worse than us. Things aren’t free and I personally read Manga online and BUY IT AS WELL. There are actually people who do both. If it wasn’t for online manga I wouldn’t have known that there was manga to begin with. But please be a nationalist some more and spout more BS on the subject just for general amusement.

  • LOL 2ch. You all download American movies and dramas, too, obviously, so everything you’re arguing for is null and void. Foreigners=pirates goes for you, too, you fucking hikkikomori bastards.

    And everyone can tell Japan and China apart. Japan’s the one with the chilled shimapantsu being sold in a cup. Yeah, have fun with that.

  • Just remember.. all these insults are coming from the same people who send death threats to idols and seiyuu for having boyfriends… When American actresses and singer or whatever get married we RESPECT THEIR LIFE CHOICES! I mean damn what a concept here we don’t actually try to ruin their lives or tell them how to live them! Stupid Japanese think they can rule the lives of others without any consequences then want to complain about the issues we have in some of our society. F’n hypocrits!

  • I just LoL every time at 2Cn XD. Why would I want to take anything seriously from people who Nerdrage and want an Idol dead for having a life XD. Would rather be branded a thief then someone who advocates murder for something so silly as having a life. ;).

  • Hold up…

    This little feud could only persist if each side had access to translations of the other’s posts. Who, exactly, is making said translations available? And what evidence do we have that he’s not just playing us against each other in an evil scheme to generate lulz from our tears?

  • If we are pirates we need to pillage and loot Japan. We will kidnapp, have consensual sex with all their ladies and steal their mangas. Seiyu girls and japanese girls should be free to have sex with us, the foreign pirates. Be careful Japan, the pirates are coming. Let’s raid Japan !

  • Like others have said before me, there is basically no other way to read manga or watch anime than to do it through the work of other fans, if you’re not japanise. If you aren’t sold what you would be willing to pay for (and not with months of delay, which is the case in official stuff) who is to blame you for taking it anyways.

  • Wrong approach, 2ch.

    The idea is not “TV is free, so manga should be too.” More correct would be to say “the Japanese have a system of allowing potential consumers to preview a work for a relatively low price, whereas this system does not exist in America, so Americans are expected to purchase a product without any prior knowledge of the content; therefore, they turn to illegal distribution.”

    For example, with televised anime, the Japanese pay two things– their monthly cable bill and the time it takes to watch and possibly be swayed by advertisements– to view an anime, possibly in it’s entirety. A cable bill is rarely just paid only for anime, since you get so much other content for that; furthermore, very little of that goes to the studios or copyright holders. This leads to advertising. The consumer only pays for the anime in this way if they watch the ads instead of using a DVR, and if they decide to buy the product after having seen it; otherwise, you are watching anime for no additional marginal cost. Some of these users are confusing “paying for something” with “contributing to the copyright holders”. Unless you believe that it is okay to watch fan subs if you pay the fansubber, this logic does not hold.

    If foreigners had a way to watch anime and be exposed to 5 minutes of advertising for it to be legal and relatively inexpensive (for example, little or no additional charge on top of the already-paid monthly cable bill), they would. This is called Crunchyroll, and it is doing quite well in the United States.

    Concerning manga sales, same thing applies, but slightly differently. Japan’s preview market is the manga magazine, a relatively cheap format that allows a consumer to see a slew of different titles before purchasing. This is obviously less “free” than cable TV as there is a marginal cost, although that is offset by the share ability of the medium. (and Japanese folks, don’t pretend that you don’t sometimes preview magazines without buying the, we see you in the convenience stores ). In America, the series that do make it into manga magazines (in other words, Shonen Jump) are practically guaranteed to do well. Others suffer the same problem of a lack of a preview market.

    Finally, as to whether or not the introduction of an illicit preview market– scanlations and fan subs– hurts the industry, the answer is that for some it helps and for some it hurts, in the same vein that some people who watch the anime in TV in Japan will decide to buy it and others will feel satiated so they will not. To give my own example, I own something on the order of magnitude of a thousand volumes of manga, about 80-90% of which I first viewed via scanlations; lucky for me, i can buy the legit Chinese versions of things that wont make it to the US. There are plenty of titles I haven’t ended up buying because I didn’t think they were that good. But if a Japanese person does not buy the DVD for every anime they ever see on television, even the ones they don’t like, they need to take the plank out of their own eyes first.

  • “These american pirates”
    “Foreigners are pirates”

    If these people want to be in the right they need to stop generalizing. As a Japanese man raised in the west these comments sound extremely juvenile and ignorant, not to say people are doing any better to try and be the better man.

    Besides, the main source of the raw material is uploaded by Japanese pirates. Hypocrisy? Racist? You decide.

  • PonySlaystation says:

    @#$%ING HELL!!!
    How many the @#$%ing times does this shit have to happen!
    Cant we all ****ing hav some peace and quiet for once!
    lets get this straight 2ch wussy/pissy harrassments aint gonna do shit and we have enough freakin trolls and shit around adding fuel to fire.
    ARENT U PEOPLE TIRED OF THIS SHIT ALREADY!! SAME SHIT IS GONNA HAPPEN! NOTHING IS GONNA @#$%ING CHANGE! JUST LEAVE IT ALREADY!

    anger eliminated…mentality back to normal… nervous system back to regular operation.

  • Most of you assholes never buy any anime or manga, seriously there are 1000’s of different animes and mangas available in stores like rightstuf or animecornerstore. And there are a lot of cheap anime in amazon and ebay. if you don’t buy any anime or manga you are not an anime fan at least support the anime industry.

  • In this thread: xenophobia. Their fear of criticism just proves they think they are right in everything they do and how dare any foreigners think otherwise. Its quite sad actually. I think the most intelligent thing said was “make them pay $5/$10 per month for unlimited usage”, that is by far the best idea, instead of us “maggots” being kept away from their genre.

    • >the most intelligent thing said was “make them pay $5/$10 per month for unlimited usage”, that is by far the best idea

      Yeah your the most becoming one who should move to communistic nation.

  • Can’t help but to laugh at 2ch comments… they reflect the reason why Japan is dying =) I wish the best of lucks to the japanese NEETs/otaku, who don’t work either, and will remain virgin and sexually frustrated the rest of their lives =D

  • “If TV is supposed to be free then please show me all those American movies and dramas for free too.”

    I find this funny, when you can actually watch those American movies and dramas for free too, and not only American, plenty of movies/series/dramas available online from other countries as well, you just have to download them.
    its probably not even limited to just videos, there are plenty of comics, books etc etc available.

    There’s only one requirement for most tough..

    You need to learn this magical language called:
    English

    (Its also requirement for watching most anime fan-subs.)

    and just in chase:
    “Its not fair I don’t understand English”

    Its the world language, deal with it. Theres plenty of things that never get translated to my native language (Finnish), which include 99% of games, software, manga, anime.

  • ( not american, french )
    Japanese don’t want us nor to buy it, nor to steal, but still, a LOT of foreign people really love about anime and manga, why should they prevent us from our hobby ?

    It may be because otaku fear foreign’s critics about loli ( hum yummy loli ), but they’re already being criticised in japan.. aren’t they proud to be an otaku ?
    I am. And no matters whoever from wherever tell me i’m gross, i’ll just ignore it and fap on magical girl.

  • amazing how the japanese are composed of fucking idiots and fucking dumbasses. If you don’t want people to like your shit, then don’t make it available to be brought over to other countries and that will be done vise-versa since you ungrateful jap bastards. Cut off the Uncensored American porn you slant eyed fucks love to “steal”

    • herp derp watch me throw around racist slang to make me look cool.

      It’s also kind of hard to prevent stuff like that coming over, what with the internet and all. There’s nothing Japan can really do about it except be even more xenophobic and cut off all outsiders. Can’t really blame ’em.

  • Japanese people should learn to understand the circumstances and the question “why” it has become so. But after all I don’t except much from people who treat burakumin and ainu like trash. Let’s hope you otaku don’t start a new saitama-accident, like in 1989 because of the stupid gaijin-problem which you just understand on the surface.

  • Think it this way: in Japan they buy a magazine with manga and after a while they (according to them) buy their favorite mangas’ volumes, even knowing exactly what’s inside. You could make a comparison in reading the manga online and then buying the volumes of the mangas you find interesting, but it isn’t happening in a ‘good’ scale. So it can be said there’s a difference in culture.

    But sometimes is a lot more complex than that, as said before by other people, USA is not the rest of the world (I stick to the fact that ‘America’ is a continent, not USA, too much ego for them), and in my case, to get just 1 volume of manga, after a long search and a lot of luck, it is, or a crappy copy, or an original/english version with a price over U$30, so yeah, i’m a damn thief because i can’t afford that even for my most favorite manga, sorry for that, but I still think that their manga (most of it) is awesome.

  • Just don’t tell me that exactly because of hatred to pirates, love to right-holders and overall lawful mind state, Japanese do have invented a new ultra private non traceable p2p network with dispersed storage. It called “Perfect Dark”. That makes there pirates far more superior than every other on the planet.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_Dark_%28P2P%29

    Japanese, is no less than every other nations, are pirates. And this facts makes them a two faced scums much more than our wishes to get something cheaper or for free. And they do not have rights to blame us at all.
    SRY 4 my English.

  • i can afford any manga >.> its just that when they sell in the USA the time between releases are long and i tend 2 forget that i was reading it >.> and if u go 2 a library here u can read american comics and i get 2 watch anime on tv for free >.> u can also watch american movies and dramas for free 2 get a library card and rent it >.>

  • I’m seeing some random post in Japanese. I think I’m the only genius around that has noticed this. They are posting in Japanese because that’s the only way they could win against us. I’m pretty sure some of us do know how to speak and read Japanese (Imma newb in Japs), thus they decided to target the majority that don’t know how. Funny thing is, attempts to flame somebody who cant comprehend the language you are using is just as bad as attempts to fap to a Zerg.

    Sooo, what am I saying, to the minority who wrote in Japanese (Which I presume are 2ch citizens) :

    If you guys want to flame us on something, at least learn how to even write a bloody sentence in English.

    がんばって、エエゴは簡単過ぎるの語だ!

    As somebody who prefers neutrality, I’m giving my words of encouragement for them to actually learn how to speak Engrish.

  • 自分達の思い通りにならないと、すぐ日本に核攻撃しろという事を言うアメリカ人がいるが、「恥を知れ」と言いたい。
    漫画が無料で見れなくなるからと言って、日本人を殺せと言うアメリカ人は反省しろ。

    • How dare you say that about your own mother :o. Don’t you know how the respect your own parents. So sad to see these young folks talking such filth about their own mothers these days 🙁

    • ていうか日本を核攻撃したらmangakaもアニメ企業もなくなっちゃうのになw
      外人は誰がマンガとアニメを作り出してると思ってるんだろう?

      • あはは、これは笑える。
        そういう問題じゃないと思うよ。
        日本のアニメだって、最新のジブリのスタッフロールをみましょ、だんだん外国人がのっているよ!

        テレビの放送する物は韓国や中国で作るところも多いし。
        まぁ、たしかに、日本の会社が金を出して作っている。

        その話をおいといて、
        問題なのは、2chにも、SCにも、両方側でまともな会話できる人が少ない。
        すぐ相手のせいしたり、小学生レベルの攻撃する人も多いし。お互いに脳のない奴はいっぱいいる。
        「てめぇ」とか「死ね」とか、どち側にして、
        あんな言葉使いで会話がにならないでしょ!

        また、わざと、悪い事を言ったりするから、火に油をつかるだけばかり。

        SCでは、とにかく、自分の本心を出すではなく、かっこう良くするため、わざと、変わった事をいう人も多いから、それは理解した上でコメントした方がいいじゃないの?

        • >そういう問題じゃないと思うよ。
          そういう問題だよ

          >日本のアニメだって、最新のジブリのスタッフロールをみましょ、だんだん外国人がのっているよ!

          そうですね。だからといって外国人が偉い訳でもなく、それを一々気に掛ける外国人もいません。あなたみたいに何でも上から目線で裁こうとする態度は何処の国でも嫌われるんじゃないですか。

          >SCでは、とにかく、自分の本心を出すではなく、かっこう良くするため、わざと、変わった事をいう人も多いから、それは理解した上でコメントした方がいいじゃないの?

          何が言いたいのか解りません。他人の考え方にケチつけてどうするんですか。

  • Here’s a thought: How much do you think mangaka would get paid if they moved over to the west? More than a few cents per page I’d think. Of course, this is only possible if they can take their licenses with them…

    Ah well, either way… I have a bookcase of tanks and a bookmark for scanlation releases… My conscience is balanced 😀

  • You know what i always find funny about the post. it is that they act all saint like and never pirate themselves. Don’t the know a lot of the scans come from there share site that just so happens that Japanese people upload. I can bet that they pirate a bunch of American shit like movies and other forms of media. they are just scared that they wont be able to buy little figurines and character pillows to fill the void of their lonely life.

  • There’s fuckload of manga sales in western world as well, but I guess it’s easier to lump all westerners together. Yeah, everyone’s a filthy pirate, there are no exceptions, there are only real people inside my country borders, other people are filthy pigs yadda yadda.

    And this whole shitstorm is fucking retarded, it serves no purpose to translate their hatemail to us and our hatemail to them, only purpose that is serving is never ending flamewar between raging extremists and I guess that’s exactly what Sankaku wants.

    Fuck this shit.

    • dude. who gives a fuck wat they say. this is the interent. unfortunately, they can troll and be douchebags all they want. they can also make up all the crap they want and start rumors. ch2 in a nutshell. so dont be mad, laugh.

  • 2chってだけで叩いてる奴ばっかりだけど、
    お前らの大好きなハルヒも初音ミクもけいおんも、
    2chで狂信的に騒がれまくったから、ここまで人気がでたんだぞ
    。
    しかも2chの奴が描いた絵とか作った音楽とか女神とかネタは大好きなんだよな。

    にもかかわらず2chが嫌いなのが矛盾してて面白い。

    • wwwまた妄想しやがって
      お前の脳内の2chは一体感のある聖なる物なのかw
      ここに絵を描いたり音楽作ったりした奴らの話がなんででてくる。
      ここの奴らが軽べつするのはな、1ドルもださず違法ダウンロードをする一部の人間を見て「外人は皆こうだ」とか抜かす糞野郎のことなんだよ。
      つまり2chの一部の人間

      どうせ外国で売るわけもない漫画を外国人が読もうがなんだろうがお前自身に何の損があるって言いたいんだ?wいつから外国の漫画出版社のことをこんなに心配してくれたんだ?お前が楽しんでる漫画が国内限定だと何か得でもあるように反応してるが国内限定だからって大したことじゃないからww欲しがったり憧れたりする外国人の視線がそんなに気持ちいいか?ww実は外国の漫画出版社とかどーでもいいだろお前。

      それにな、外国サイトにコメしたいなら英語でも勉強してからしろ。外人軽べつするのに読めないように日本語で書くのは何なんだよww独り言でもしてんのかw

      If you’re gonna talk shit, at least type it in English so that people can get a chance to read and reply you fuck. Are you scared little xenophobe?

      • 糞野郎って意味じゃこのサイトの奴ら同じじゃねーかw

        2chの一部の奴らを発言で2chの奴らを全員まとめてneetとかgayとかjapとかそんなのばっかりじゃんw

        それに自分が金出して買ったものをただでダウンロードして喜んでる奴らを見てムカつくのは普通だろ?

        しかもここの奴らは何故か「日本人が悪い」って結論にいつも持って行きたがるからなw

        • 君は嵐なのか正論を持った人間なのか区別つかなかったから気にするなw
          嵐は嵐だし、一方的に責める時点で負け組みだと思う。両方同じく。無視すればいいんだよ。笑えるとか言う必要もない。

        • なんで急に煽り口調から丁寧な口調に変わってるのか知らないけどw
          別に俺は責めてるんじゃなくて、
          2chや日本人のことを煽ってる奴らに対して、
          そんなに2chや日本人が嫌いなくせに、2chが作り出した初音ミクブームとかけいおんブーム(笑)に乗せられてるし、日本人の作ってるアニメやゲームや漫画やHENTAIが好きっていうのは笑えるって思ってるってことだけだよw

        • ここのコメントをそんなに深く読まないで欲しい。
          このサイトのユーザベースは嵐だらけってことくらい明らかでしょ?
          決してSankakuのニート共が2chのニート共よりマシだと言っていないし信じていない。

          俺は漫画とか触れていないから個人的にこの問題について強い意見を持っていないけど、2ch側の意見もちゃんと理解できる。金を払わず盗むのは間違ってる。でも責めばっかしないで海外側の立場も認識して欲しい。値段の差、外国出版社が拾う確率のない作品などなどといった事情で普通に日本国内で盗むのと比べ物になれないと思う。だからと言って違法ダウンロードが正しいとは言っていない。もし機会があったら金を払うファンもいるが海外だといくら払っても叶わない事情もあることを理解して欲しい。

          俺が言いたいのは一方的に責めるのは間違ってるだけ。
          「日本人は皆人種差別する」とか「外人は皆泥棒」とか言う嵐共は一生消えないだろうが無視したほうがいいと思う。

    • I know! It’s like one of those M. Knight. Shamalamadon’s twist endings. No one expects xenophobic rants from 2ch!

      Only, just like M. Knight, we really all see it coming a mile away, like some lame, dumb dog.

  • If none Japanese speaking part of the world could get their hands on Japanese anime and manga at same time as Japanese people do. That alone would solve a lot of problems regarding pirates.
    Then how many shows do you think air in Japan that never make it oversees? Some people like them, but they cant buy them because dvd’s wont include English subs. So it s much easier to dl a fansub.
    Not to mention that import / skipping price is nearly the same as price of that damn dvd.

    Take for instance Shakugan no Shana light novels, I love them, I bought two of them, I would by more if licensed company had bothered releasing more!

    Its not the users who is greedy, its the corporate system.

  • All this coming from people who likely pirate western movies, games, music, TV and cartoon shows…

    As many have astutely pointed out: western publishers only pick up on a minuscule amount of manga/anime, and usually only the long running and/or really stupid ones they can make a quick buck off of (IE Inuyasha, Bleach, Naruto).

    Though some have also said that western publishers fail to pick up on many manga/anime because they figure everyone has already read/watched them. Well I counter that with the fact that 90% of manga/anime put out in Japan would have the hell censored out of it IF it even got picked up.

    Can you see something like Mitsudomoe with a 12yo obsessed with breasts, or any yuri anime, or something like Strike Witches airing on public TV?

    And the Japanese companies have lost publicity at the loss of a place like OneManga, because even if people can’t buy the manga/anime in English, if they really like the show they’ll buy the other products like plushies, figurines, etc.

    Also the prices do get inflated when they come over to America, just to comment on that particular idiot who said 980 Yen was about the same as $12, $1 = 150 Yen…do the math…more around $4.50 at original price.

    • “America has price competition so you can get Dragonball for like $12 on Amazon. In Japan the same volume costs Â¥980, so it’s actually about the same.”

      I am not trying to be rude but In Canada it cost $12 plus tax, and in USA it cost $10 plus tax.

    • Hey idiot ever heard of Funimation? seriously there’s like 1000’s of animes dubbed, and 1000’s of mangas translated you can go to rightstuf, animecornerstore or amazon and you will find it there.

  • Oh my god I LOVE the Japanese! Someone please please for the love of zeus translate these for them. They are so silly it’s almost sad to make fun of them. For one, most Japanese think McDonald’s was THEIR idea. Two, they don’t realize that we have four season here in the usa. They think only they do. And the rapeplay thing they keep bringing up, as so many people have said already, it was not we that started it.

    Point to one of those 2ch users that does not have any western pirated games, movies, music, software and I’ll, well, there aren’t any. Not one of those people can say they haven’t pirated something. Hypocrites are funny. Do we pirate? Hell yeah. But most of us pirate our own shit thank you very much. Just as I’m sure they pirate most of their own stuff.

    But then, the majority of folk on 2ch and Anon around here are just the minority of people. Most Japanese and Westerners have no clue what goes on in places like 4Chan, 2ch, ebalmsworld, TYNC, Sankaku and sites like it as well as scanlation or movie sites.

    We are a small minority here and there. So it makes it even funnier when one attacks the other because we are both exactly the same. Anon haters bitching for no reason because we are thieves and hatful and have nothing better to do than type online and see who we can upset for pure fun. Awesome.

  • i’ll just say it again. if the nihonjin publishers would just offer an online solution that is better waiting 6-12 months for a limited selection of censored manga that usually only get translated if they also have DVDs they can also well with crap dubs.

    just give us something online in english that publishes with in a month of that chapter’s release in a weekely mag. price it more like an american comic book like 5 USD.

    • The average American comic book costs $2.99, one could object that manga volumes contain more pages and should cost more. Well a comic book is in full color, and is also drawn in a much better (and therefore harder to draw) style.

      So compare that better drawn, full color (also larger) 28-page $2.99 comic book to the $12 Bleach manga volume in the same store…see a little bit of a ridiculous price difference here?

      • I have to agree that American comics are harder to draw and stuff.
        Most of us, western anime “otaku” tends to think that manga/anime is the most otherworldly-holy-perfect-beautiful thing existent in this world, and end glorifying Japanese people too much, up to the point of thinking they are godlike.

        Until recently I always thought that manga and anime were all popular, and everyone knew/watched anime or at least read manga, but after looking around for a while I noticed that we are but a tiny minority of the overall population…

        One of the reasons anime/manga still does not much profit over in west is not just because there are fans downloading and not buying, is simply because American cartoons, for instance, are way more accepted and much more profitable worldwide than manga or anime, cartoons and comics are everywhere.

        Anime is not popular as we usually perceive it to be.

        I used to think “why americans do things like Ben10, that is obviously a failed attempt to copy anime style, and not anime style itself.”, just to realise that, they didn’t want to copy anime style at all, drawing manga/anime is not like drawing cartoons (I’m not counting comics here), and doing an American anime that would look like an anime would require too much investment, study and training, but in the end it would not be profitable, because the money required to do such a thing would not be returned, because, the fact is, most people over here don’t care about anime/manga.

        My point is, manga and anime are not selling well over here, but whose the fault is?
        I think pirates are not at fault, at least not completely, since US TV Shows and Movies are pirated and they still make huge amounts of profit, and they are still licensed worldwide.
        So I think the main fault here it the complete lack of interest of everyone else.

        We tend to think that manga is perfect, the Japanese get full of themselves, and the rest of the world don’t give a shit about this.

  • Whoop de doo! I’ll just stroll into the super market and walk out empty handed because manga is non existent in Australian stores. Gee, 2Ch, you have enlightened my mind! I can totally imagine asking the store clerk of K-Mart for a copy of “High School of the Dead Volume 4”

    2Ch! What can we do with out you?

  • I hope this makes it to 2ch

    “Some anime tried free distribution, delayed a week after the Japanese airing. They still complained about it being late and the subs not being good enough, saying fansubs were still better – honestly I don’t think you can work with these people at all.”

    Naruto and One Piece both release a week after Japanese airing, and they are both making plenty of money off advertising and sales. Look, I’m not a big fan of Naruto, but, as an American, I subscribe to the manga because I wish to support the progressive distribution model that they are using!

  • I spend a lot of money on anime and manga. These generalizations are asinine. However, it is refreshing to see that this wave of responses from 2ch holds more mature ones among the drivel.

  • Digital distribution is the way to go, make an all you can read service, charge about 15 – 25 pounds a month for it, its a done deal.

    But no, they’d rather have technology utilised to rob them instead of using it to their advantage. With that kind of marketing sense, I torrent my manga to spite them. I want a sensible way to purchase manga, or I shall NOT purchase manga.

  • They’ve definitely got a whole arian race complex going on. It’s wormed it’s way in to a lot of their underlying culture, not just how they talk on internet message boards.
    (though not to your face,lol)

    Just look at their citizenship laws….which are basically if you’re not all ready 100% japanese, then you’re out of luck on the citizenship thing lol

    And even then it’s citizens aren’t allowed dual citizenship like other countries allow.

    Like that Japanese figure skater who became a russian citizen to compete in the olyimpics
    (and landed flat on her ass)

    …she had to give up her japanese citizenship first.
    (because she didn’t like her partner,lol)

    It’s actually pretty funny considering the japanese are supposed to be so intelligent, technologically advanced, and (at least in public) respectful. Yet you get past that and they’re a bunch of hicks from 1823 (or 1964 depending on who you talk to)

  • 著作権は守るべきだってのはよく言うけど、だからと言って守らない奴を殺せとは言わない。 でもアメリカ人は著作権を守れという日本人を殺せと平気で言う。 それを言う事にまったく躊躇が無いのがアメリカ人の特徴でしょうか?

  • しかしなんでアメリカ人ってこんなに人種差別主義者が多いんだろうねえ? 漫画が読めないなら日本を核攻撃するって自分で何言ってるか分かってる? 冗談じゃ済まないですよ。

    • 我々は我々の国のフィリピンに拠点をスローなぜそうアメリカ本当の人種差別はない。なぜ同じことをしない?あなたはまだ、右アメリカ軍基地があるので?

      • アメリカ軍基地と人種差別と著作権に何の関係が有るのですか?(ため息)

        しかし、この程度の知能しかないのがこのsankakuに集る人間のレベルなのかねえ・・・

        • 私はあなたがアメリカを憎む考えですか?ある三角からいくつかの時間にニュースは、米国の兵士のいくつかの子供たちはコードを置くことによって、ユーザバイクを犠牲と知らない被害者をもつれここ何が起こるかも、米国の兵士で、彼らはすぐのようだ強姦虐待です。彼らは正義を精査!

  • WTF? Removing Sub in Anime? Hey how do you advertise your product?(If really 2h want it how about turning Japan into North Korea almost strict import/export) There is still some people will buy original DVD release which is why there is UNCUT version. I see no DVD release been stream maybe pirated copies so why do bother removing it when people didn’t know if the anime is good or not?

    • That’s precisely correct Altair. I don’t know about you but it gives me the impression that the most of the Anime/Manga Industry in Japan does not really care about its fans worldwide nor are they taking advantage of the mediums’s growing popularity worldwide.

      For the most part, the Anime/Manga industry has ALWAYS been fan-driven dating back to the early 80’s when fans in North America and around the world would bootleg SUBBED Anime VHS and distribute them to their peers. The FANS are the ones that helped the Western and Eastern world discover Anime’s existence and that gradually led it to be on TV. (Dragonball Z, Sailor Moon, Pokemon anyone?) The FANS are the ones that helped bring Manga’s Popularity to its height. Without FANS, the Anime and Manga industry would be dead.

      Its really pitiful to see Manga Industry struggling to survive in the US, where else back in 2006, Manga was OUTSELLING American comics. Don’t believe, GOOGLE IT.

      You wonder, why isn’t Manga tie-tie with American Comics? Because the American Comic Book industry reaches out to its fans and spends thousands/millions of dollars to actively promote their properties in Hollywood(Marvel, DC, Dark Horse Comics, etc, are major examples) thus breeding a new generation of Comic Book fans. Where else on the Manga side, this enthusiasm is non-existent.

      The lack of communication between the Japanese Anime/Manga industry and its fans are ultimately going to lead to its collapse. The Anime/Manga distributors/publishers in the U.S. only cannot promote their licensed properties(with the exception of Viz, which has managed to score a couple of deals with Warner Bros).

      So to all 2ch people, hear us out. Without us overseas fans, the Anime/Manga industry overseas AND in your country will be as good as dead. I would hate to see Anime/Manga fade away like that.

  • BHA HA HA HA TV IS REALLY FREE HERE IN THE PHILIPPINES I WATCH VOLTES V, YU YU HAKUSYU, SHAKUGAN NO SHANA, GOLGO 13(although is cut so I watch in the net), DRAGONBALL(complete), COYOTE RAG TIME SHOW(cool anime although it is unknown to me), FLAME OF RECCA, and may more… NO MONTHLY CHARGE JUST ELECTRIC BILL!

  • Could have sworn 2ch was made in America.

    2ch was opened on May 30, 1999 in a college apartment in Conway, Arkansas, on the campus of University of Central Arkansas[10] by Hiroyuki Nishimura, known simply as “Hiroyuki” (ひろゆき?)

    sounds like made in America to me. hell it’s operated in Singapore to wow isn’t that where Real Modern Day Pirates come from?

    so it’s software pirates talking on a site made in America that is owned by real Pirates damn sounds like they got Pirate Bay beat in the Pirate category.

  • I’m not surprised by their views on “foreigners” or what they call a “gaijin”. what a lot of people (western fans especially) don’t know is that the Japanese the ethnic, Yamato in particular, are xenophobic by nature even towards other ethnic Japanese not of “Yamato descent”. the main reason why this problem continues to exist is due largely from a lack of support for penalties to discourage discrimination from the government and fierce opposition from the media over there. in conclusion the responses at 2chan are in-fact quite natural and even expected from them i personally have come to accept it for what it is and thus can say the only thing they’re good for now is making anime and video games and until they learn to become more racially tolerant. I’m finding it hard to accept them as a people because they don’t see how many fans they have world wide who truly accept them, their culture and their various art medias

    data sources:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racial_issues_in_Japan#Comment_by_U.N._special_rapporteur_on_racism_and_xenophobia

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4671687.stm

    http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/nn20100226a4.html

  • Does anyone else find it hilarious that they are calling us greedy pirates that demand free manga/anime, yet they send out death threats and insults the minute the person no longer associate themselves with manga/anime? Don’t lie to us, we saw your threats towards that Haruhi anime director and Aya Hirano’s choice of leaving anime and having sexual intercourse with older men. Which is worse, wanting free stuff on the internet that no matter what, is going to happen or dictating someone’s life, then throwing them aside the minute they no longer provide you entertainment/sexual fantasies? Does this mean that for all that time I’ve been watching the Colbert Report, I now own a bit of Colbert’s soul? If thats the case, I should try and visit his home and tell him to shave his head (again) and have a personal spot on his show reserved for me, and only me. FOR EACH AND EVERY EPISODE.

    C’mon, guys, WE ARE BOTH SCUM, WE SHOULD UNITE TOGETHER AND BECOME ONE BIGGER SCUM.

  • For a culture so hellbent on developing media that lends itself to selling merchandise instead of the media itself, they sure do complain a lot about piracy helping boost the importation and sales of stuff like figures and posters…

  • Whooo, this really resembles the whole happening around downloading music of the net.

    But instead of them 2ch-lads just hating on foreigners for reading ‘their’ manga illegally, they could’ve made some profit out of it.

    Instead of taking down OneManga, they could’ve ’employed’ them. I have used OM for a long time and I’m willing to pay a price to read manga online. I’m sure a lot of fans wil agree with me.

    Let’s say for $10,- you get the ‘basic’ manga set. The top 10 manga (Bleach, One Piece, Naruto, D. Gray Man) included and a 5 to 8 other manga, your pick. And of course the manga which are completed.

    For a higher price, like $15,- the ‘basic’ manga set but the amount of manga you can pick out for yourself is 20 to 23.

    And for the last price, let’s say $20,- you’ll get the whole sha-bang. The top manga, every manga you want and the manga which has been completed.

    And to make sure this system is not running on the same pace as the real life released manga, new manga chapters must be uploaded 2 weeks after the publisher released them.

    The hardcore fans will still import the manga because they’ll want the real deal. The publisher get a share from the profit and some of it goes to the OM-crew. And if the OM-crew get’s increased by some part-time translators, then everybody is happy.

    Shortly, the publishers profit from the ‘piracy’, the fans still get to read their manga online, the hardcore fans will still import and 2ch just needs to lose some of that pride of theirs.

    But hey, I’m just a foreigner with an idea.

  • If japanese people never knew.
    most newly released american movies and dramas are all on youtube and if not, its up somwhere else free to watch.

    if its not subbed in japanese
    well blame your own people for not taking initiative

  • So a shallow, superficial, snobbish, high class, reputation and disgustingly cutesy image driven country of suicidal, elitist, sexist, racist, and ageist bigots with advanced introversion and social anxiety disorders based on fitting in with mindless insipid individuality sapping trends are trying to tell foreigners that they are wrong because they are fascinated by this culture. Well clearly someone has made a mistake in taking an interest in reviving Japan’s decaying corpse of an ecology.

  • lol I get a kick out of these 2ch reactions.
    I’m one of those “pirates” who used onemanga … allot. they were the only site i had found that had a tracking system in place that let me mark series and find out when they were updated and filter out the daily mass updates of the other stuff.

    the publishers really shot themselves in the foot on this one. they should have bought the onemanga site or offered an equal alternative, but they didn’t. I would have gladly paid a monthly fee for the services the onemanga beta provided, and if all of the manga on onemanga was actually easily available in america I would buy it.

    the problem is that a large volume of manga is not available to the u.s. audience and so we HAVE to turn to sites like onemanga to be able to read unlicensed mangas. I find it hard to believe i’m the only person who would be willing to support the industry, if only they would just give us a way to do that which does not include waiting a year in a half for a book that they just copy pasted scanslations into (yes they are that shameless).

    • (same person) i just forgot to mention that because the publishers shut down these sites, i’m more likely to just stop reading manga then go out and buy a paper copy.

      why?! because i would first have to wait a year before the paper versions of the chapters i haven’t read were available and even then if it’s not one of the big three (Naruto,Bleach, Onepiece) chances are it won’t be available at my local bookstore. which btw i should add has stopped carrying manga because all anybody ever did was walk in and read a stack of books on the couches.

  • can someone go and post this in 2chan in japanises please.

    in america, i can buy 1 manga for the same price you can buy 4-7 mangas

    in america, manga is translated and translated in the least offensive way possible for more potential sales.

    in america manga is censored because of content not so much anymore but it still happens.

    in america you can suck at translating and still get a job, look at negima 1-3 for an example.

    in america we get tv for free, minus hbo and showtime like channels. the bill you pay for the service to get normal channels isn’t paying for the channel.

    and tell them to fuck the fuck off, movies that get put out in every language by competent translates is not the same as manga. if you want tv shows for free, than yea, you deserve it, and if you cant get in on tv, feel free to pirate it.

    but most manga never comes to america, they are takeing down sites that provide us with something no company in america is doing. you want to profit from us, translate it and distribute it online yourself, you charge a monthly fee for a free for all, and there will be alot of people jumping at that offer. but until you get it through your non progressive heads that not giving us an option isnt helping you at all than go fuck yourselves.

  • If I could buy it for the same prices that it is available in Japan (In Australia), at the same times that it is available there, then I would buy it.

    Untill then, tuff shit.

    (I do buy shows/anime when (IF) they ever become available in Australia.)

  • I see the Japanese are still ignoring the fact that publishers do more harm to mangaka than pirates. Mangaka are forced to sign terrible deals and remain poor while the publishers get rich for doing none of the real work.

  • “I’m a copyright holder. Honestly if you’re going to end up with it being watched by foreigners like this, especially creepy Chinese and Koreans, don’t turn it into an anime at all. These guys will never pay for anything, they deserve to be treated like maggots.

    The same goes for whites and blacks like this. They should all be sued into oblivion, the Japanese like this too!”

    Thats why we cant have any decent manga releases outside japan. Xenophobia rules…

  • And now all this bitching is only going to benefit the site owner.

    Who knows, he purposely put this on 2ch to get reaction so as to dramatize it and put it here so that the mass of people coming here can earn him good click and income.

    Wait for the comments and rise and rinse again. Oh all the good $$ coming in.

    2ch talk and bitch about everything, here choose the most sensational news and over and over again it prove that the messes here are stupidly accepting this kind of news. Me included.

  • Right, like they’ve never done any pirating. Let he who is without blame cast the first stone.

    They seem to enjoy bitching about American movies and television, but it’s not too hard to find those for free online as well…

    Why wait for a belated, expensive, sloppily translated, and censored manga release?

  • Okie yes being free is bad, but hell thanks to Onemanga before it closed I bought the mangas i really loved that I found from that site. I would even do the same to Anime if they wouldn’t butt fuck it to hell with censors and bad dubs, Perfect example One piece. Gum Gum Rifle my ass -.- And the reason we have free mangas is because ppl do it you asians complain about western dramas , comics not being on the internet for free its because obviously you all are to lazy to actually translate it and post it like we do. I bet if you people were doing this you would be reacting like we are now. So before you whine your ass off picture yourself on this side.

    • This is such a stupid retort.

      The thing is American movies and dramas are not for FREE. Sure there are ways to get them for free, but that does not mean it is for FREE.

      Scanlators and Fansubers work as their own free time as their own hobby. You think anime and manga are able to be done like that? You go and work a full time job where your life hood depends on it, for free. then you talk.

  • Although I’m sure this post is disproportionately full of the worst comments on 2ch with less of the reasonable ones, the responses still concern me.

    So much invective thrown at us foreigners because somehow reading what were almost entirely scanned and uploaded by Japanese nationals and which we will largely never get an opportunity to buy legally in our on language somehow is destroying the Japanese manga industry.

    I do buy manga and anime, and don’t appreciate the generalization that no westerners do, but I refuse to import something I can’t even read that well, let alone enjoy all the subtle jokes of. I mentioned it on the previous post that the best solution for this is for publishers of both manga and anime to set up an international Hulu-like system to get these distributed worldwide, paid for by subscription or (preferably to eliminate excuses) country-specific advertising depending on your IP, and with subtitles done in a comparable time to fansub groups. This isn’t at all unprecedented, for instance Funimation has quite a good video site setup now, and sites like OneManga show that such a setup can be supported by ad revenues–hopefully with mangaka getting a cut.

    But will we ever see such a thing? Not while the publishers are stuck in the last century and continue to screw their mangaka and readers, and likely not while the fans in different regions are constantly at odds like this. So 2ch, if you’re reading this, get your wilder posters to stop blaming us evil baka gaijin for everything and start making more noise at publishers instead, so we all benefit.

  • Haa. This is getting pathetic. If you haven’t experienced life from both sides…don’t say jack. You can’t very well back it. There is a lack of understanding mixed with anger and bored trolls. This drama will go on for ages without making any significant progress. Time to move on.

  • Xenophobia at its best

    I think 2ch users need to realize this isn’t Japan and we can’t go to a local bookstore and browse their extensive collection. We in the West are limited and thus need manga sites to act as bookstores so we can browse manga before making purchases and or read manga that is unavailable to us.

  • I’m glad I’m an non-american pirate since both the Japanese and the Americans seem to believe they’re the only parties involved. We from the rest of the world can pirate freely without drawing any flak.

  • in Poland we have interesting bank ads, it ending phrases is “thats only you have for free, what you make yourself”

    and guy who think everything is for free is stupid or old looser who live on parents pocket

  • Man, if publishers want to make more profit from anime and manga overseas, they should sub and translate the stuff and stream it at the same time at its broadcast in Japan. I would at least pay for this service.
    They don’t have to dub anything, since nodoby who downloads fansubs is interested in dubs anyway. Just make a good sub and everythings fine.

    Waiting for an official release is no option to the major part of us. Everyone knows it who watches animes or reads translated manga.

    Most of the time we don’t even get any release at all. Lucky Star anime in Germany? Nope. And that’s just one example. With online distribution you could bring the whole anime library to us without much risk.

    But no, instead of trying to make some profit they’re just ignoring us and crying like babies.

    And if I read what those 2ch guys write, you might think that they own the anime/manga business because they are Japanese. How ridiculous is that?

  • Oh god, not again.

    I would honestly just like to say the “please don’t feed the troll” argument, but I do have one or two things to say otherwise.

    One thing however, I’m surprised there are actually smart comments here, like “If they crackdown now their sales will only decrease even further…” or “Japanese publishers are idiots, aren’t they? Just making it all-you-can-read for $5-$10 a month would have probably worked nicely.” Also a couple of others too. I would explain why these are very poiniant and true observations but others have done so in other articles as well as this one. But one thing is for certain, these comments have proven that the generalization that 2ch is nothing but hypocritical, idiotic, xenophobic trolls is not entirely correct.

    However, a good number of them then just go and generalize us foreign otaku.

    First things first, it is no fault of an American or any Western consumer that the restrictions on H-games and other things of that nature are tightened. It’s the fault of your own politicians who have no fucking balls and will gladly bend over and take it up the ass for any misplaced moral guardian’s demands. People will critisize you all the time if you make or enjoy something that is widely considered “questionable”. It’s an unavoidable fact of life. We live in the internet age, meaning whatever you do will be there for the world to see. Hell, you people at 2ch might even see this translated so you can read it. This is not the Edo period. This is not fucking Sakoku times here. Your hobbies will be put under international scrutiny and there is nothing any of us can do about it. The proper thing to do is to stand tall and protest against your ball-less politicians so as to preserve and protect your hobbies. To blame us foreign consumers for what our governments do is a cop-out, pure and simple.

    Second, yes, there are plenty of foreign fans and otaku who only pirate and don’t buy. Some of them can be found right here on sancom. But that doesn’t mean ALL of us do that. I have my own collection of Anime and Manga that I bought either in stores or online, for the most part with my own money, some of which I actually went hungry for a day or two. I just watch streams of fansubs because there is NO WAY I am going to spend $45-$50 plus on a box set of a show I never watched. I read scanlations because I want to stay up to date on my favorite series, and some of them aren’t even in stores, nor are they coming here anytime soon. But I buy them when they make their way here officialy. However it is importaint to note something here, 2channelers. I am an American, meaning it’s easier for me when it comes to officially translated material and legal online Anime. FUNimation has a huge catalogue of their Anime online, with episodes in their full length. But its only for those in the US. Even those in other English speaking countries like the UK, Ireland, and Australia can’t access it online nor can they order FUNi’s DVDs or Blu Rays to be shipped. Which is crazy, because it’s all the same Dub and official Sub for each English speaking audience member around the world. It’s just a matter of distributor. Also, in the way of official and legaly sound material, the US tends to get it first. Other English speaking audiences tend to have to wait longer. However, if you come from a non-english speaking country (that doesn’t speak Chinese or Korean), then all bets are truely off. Official material for non-English, Chinese, or Korean speaking audiences is either painfully slow or entirely non-existent. American distributors won’t ship outside of the US, so what’s a Filipino, Brazilian, French, Russian, or any other nationality of otaku to do? Pirate, that’s what, because they have been given no other option. So while I do buy the official material I like as it comes out, please keep in mind that some actually do have good, legitamate reasons for pirating.

    And thats all I have to say to you 2ch. I hope that the people on that site see this message, and I hope that some understand it. And above all, I hope I haven’t wasted my breath.

  • the day they stop literally fucking their DS and moaning Nene nene and stop downloadin torrents with japanese subs of Desperate Housewifes and Lost, is when we will follow their ‘excellent’ example of buying every last damned volume of manga

  • Stupidity is their sin. It’s incurable, all they can do is see the results of it and still complain about it through their idiotic view, not being able to see the scenario of reality.
    Get a grip of reality, you 2ch don’t even understand the basics of economics, business trading and international trading tariffs etc. Before commenting, go get educated properly instead of that of biased, ignorant-tainted knowledge.

  • I AM STEALING YOUR COUNTRY’S HARD WORK AND PRODUCTION VIA INTERNET, I AM A TERRIBLE PERSON AND A HORRIBLE EXCUSE FOR A HUMAN BEING.

    I WILL NOW PROCEED TO BREAK DOWN AND CRY LIKE THE SHELL OF A LITTLE GIRL I AM.

    No, really.

  • I used onemanga as a means of browsing manga that would perk my interests; if I found something I liked I would likely go out and buy it if it were available in the US, otherwise I would continue to read it on said site.

    Most on 2ch can’t comprehend that we can’t simply hop on a bus and go to a local bookstore and browse their collection of manga since most stores in the US are limited in what they sell.

  • If their hypocrisy and xenophobia could walk, godzilla would look like a tiny puppy compared to them.

    Either way, it’s beating the dead horse, but – where is the anime and manga, that:

    – can be legally bought ONLINE
    – has a website using normal english with paypal donate/purchase buttons
    – is in digital form using (mostly) open standards
    – is DRM unencumbered
    – has quality comparable to at least /poor/ fansubs

    Your xenophobia cuts you from millions of fans, your publishing “geniuses” living in the middle of last century can’t (or more precisely, don’t want to at all cost) grasp internet. You have really yourself to blame, being unable to do practically anything digitally, when people outside Japan get your content almost exclusively by digital means for plenty of reasons – be it convenience, speed, language barrier or even avoidance of government’s moralfags. Both fansubbers and scanlators would happily help you for free with official releases. Add fucking 2+2.

    Ironically – manga/anime related site provide you with free advertisement, which majorly contribute to your profit from outside Japan. Without them, people wouldn’t even know about the existence of a lot of works.

  • This would be less of a issue for me and others if half the manga we read got a international release. Defense Devil, Zettai Karen Children, Beelzebub and Fairy Tail are just a few that don’t get released outside of Japan. The sad thing is that a;; of the mangas I listed are all similar in nature to Naurto, One Piece and Bleach which have proven to have a good fanbase in the states, so there’s no really excuse not to release them state side.

  • I laugh at these stupid chinks.

    For fuck sakes they opinion means nothing, since they create nothing. All they do is critize the people doing the work the whole time producing nothing.

    Frankly I couldnt give less of a shit what they think. They are of course the most pathetic of the otaku.

  • Ok then 2ch, i swear on the lives of myself, the lives of my family and the lives of the entire sankakucomplex community will stop “stealing” your manga/anime products… when all your manga/anime characters are short, have less than B-cup tits, slanted eyes, and only black hair. That means no blondes, no brunettes, no English, no Nc’donald or Starpucks rip-offs, and no big boobs! Oh yeah, no incorporation of any weaponry or firearms that are produced outside Japan… and zombies… definitely no zombies.

  • “I get the impression they could just release an ‘English version for foreigners resident in Japan’ – they might well get a lot of overseas orders…”
    some one gets it…

  • What the hell? Did we only send illogical 13-year-olds against 2ch with excuses and not actual facts on what limitations we have? I mean granted we’d still be called dirty thieving foreigners, but at least they’d know where the weak link in the sales comes from.

  • Marine-RX179 says:

    I loled at their price comparison by cherry picking a certain mange, when most manga in general in Japan cost around 500yen ($5), where as in US it cost 1000yen (£10) or more.

    And it’s not like people can just pick up any manga they want in their nearby book store, and then there’s the issue with the English manga’s poor quality of translations (worse than scanlation), as well as specific manga titles that never make it to oversea.

    Also, back to the issue of the Japanese publisher sucking most of the money away leaving little left with the actual mangaka themselves…if the mangaka can publish their work themselves digitally over the web, with decent translations for a reasonable price, I think people would more than happy to pay to download the manga they want to read. I mean come on let’s face it, the money sucking vampire publisher in Japan are hurting the mangaka income more than someone oversea reading manga that they probably cannot get their hands on aynway. The Japs need to wake up and stop eating up the bullshit their manga publisher are feeding them.

  • Hmm to say something stupid and spitefilled back to 2ch? Do I even wanna bring myself down to that level? After thinking about it it’s a definate maybe. I mean..

    I do wish I too was a neet living off my parent’s wages without working myself, having the leisure and the time to bitch and moan about some foreign land whining about my country’s habits. Buuuut i’m not like that.

    Admitting, I do have to admit my share of piracy, but if I liked the product I’d buy it (kept in it’s packaging) for displaying and to honor the companies I like. But if the product sucks i’d delete it and ridicule the company for making crap carbon copied unoriginal manga, anime or erogame.

    So quoting someone else, they should be thankful for piracy, or else their products wouldn’t be known and have any overseas demand. And lastly you want us to pay for these pirated goods, make sure they are good quality and not crap, and delivered ON TIME to keep good business.

    Haa, I said alot. x.x

  • Ugh. Maybe if the companies that 2ch so worships and follows like little sheep would open their eyes and realize that there are markets oversees, too, then maybe the West wouldn’t be assumed to be all “greedy pirates”. Sorry if that’s the only way to get the good stuff nowadays. :/

  • I used Onemanga.com as a filter. I wouldn’t have bought most of the manga I own without it; such as select volumes of “Bleach” and “Naruto.”

    It’s no different then when I go into a bookstore, pick a book, read it, and then decide not to purchase said book. If I do find a book I like then I’ll buy it! I’m basically filtering my options.

    On that note, nothing turns me off more to a potential purchase than a hideous cocoon of plastic enveloping a book. It doesn’t matter if it’s by Stephen King or any other favored author. I will not buy it! Why? Simple, I lay down money for the work not the name on the cover.

    And this is basically what japanese publishers are doing . . . Putting plastic on my filter options. I don’t agree that all manga should be free; artists and writers worked hard to make a product to support themselves. However, that doesn’t mean they made a “good” product. And I should be able to filter what I want and don’t want.

    If they limit my options, than I don’t want to risk paying for something that might suck worse than “Troll 2.” So I’ll just wait for the price to go down or in most cases forget about it entirely. Either way, they lose a customer.

    Also, OH MY GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOD

  • you know what 2ch, i will swear with the lives of myself, the lives of my family, and the lives of the entire sankakucomplex community, we will stop stealing all manga and anime products from Japan… when all anime/manga characters are short, A-cup size tits or less, slanted eyes, and black hair. No blondes, No brunettes, no english, no Nc’donalds or Starpucks rippoffs, and absolutely no big boobs! Oh yeah, no incorporation of weaponry of any kind that is made outside japan….. and zombies… definitely zombies.

  • I hope 2ch sees this. I want to tell them something:

    When I can buy your country’s goods at a decent price and in a decent form/quality, I’ll purchase them legally. Since the prices are exorbitant (to say the least), I don’t feel I need to go into debt just to enjoy your culture. Contrary to popular belief, the U.S. isn’t “The Land of Plenty” anymore. We have budgets, we live on instant noodles, we barely make it to the end of the month.

    Just look at import RPGs. Himeyashop wants around $90 + shipping for a game. After all is said and done I pay 120 bucks for a game that I have to stumble through with walkthroughs written by people whose main language isn’t English. For that reason, I “pirate” them since paying 120 bucks for a game I’m going to struggle through anyway is insane.

    Also, when North Korea gets tired of beating up South, they’ll come for you. Don’t come crying to my country when they do.

  • heh I find it funny that 2channers are calling american otaku’s beggars apparently I guess I’m a beggar with extensive manga collection I own of over 300+ Tankoban I think I have contributed enough to the greedy manga publishing companies of america unfortunately not much money goes to japan from sales in the U.S. anyway it’s way less than what they get from their readers in Japan and even then the amount of money the artists get is till a pittance compared to the time and effort mangaka take to produce these books so who’s actually wrong here? also may I point out that if it weren’t for pirates U.S. manga and anime companies wouldn’t know what shows to publish or get the licences for in the first place. Plus American publishers usually rip off their the subtitle tracks for the final product from Fansubbers without their consent, that’s hard work by people who get no money, and for their efforts their work gets stolen by people who make lots of money because they have lots of money to waste on buying licenses oh lets not mention the fact Fansubbers never get recognized by these thieves not even in the credits and get called pirates for bringing anime to the U.S. even before it’s licenced over here.

  • just know that without “foreigners” buying up all of your electronics, tvs, and handhelds, japan would be no where. besides we all know that without America, the world we be dealing with Jorea.