2ch on One Manga: “Good Riddance to Foreign Thieves!”
- Categories: Manga, News
- Date: Jul 25, 2010 09:17 JST
- Tags: 2ch, Copyright, Crime, Fansubbing, Internet, Sites, Translation, USA
2ch’s usual scathing response lends some insight as to how the closure of the world’s biggest manga piracy site sits with Japanese manga fans.
As ever, not all of their opinions are based on sound information or reason:
“Won’t they just start another site under a new name?”
“The biggest illegal distributor online, eh? Hurry up and destroy the rest.”
“Teach them the consequences of serious crime!”
“Just deleting them won’t stop it – the data will live on forever. You have to put in place fines and make it a serious crime or you’ll never stamp it out. It’s the same with music and movies.”
“With the major source gone I expect the small ones will die off too.”
“Scanlation won’t disappear, but a billion monthly page views is obviously going too far.”
“The industry has brought this strange situation upon itself by not seeking damages. Being forced to pay damages would have set a precedent and discouraged them from being so brazen.”
“Now get rid of Megauploader – they are busy making money off fansubs!”
“Manga is wasted on foreigners. Those outside Japan should stick to reading manhwa!”
“With a billion page views they must have been rolling in it. Best to sue them.”
“The reason it came to this is probably because this content is only that of the yellow races. They should have sued first like Nintendo. They’ve probably got used to scanlation so it’s no good now.”
“Good move. Now do it more with music and movies too.”
“It’s the fault of those idiot publishers for doing nothing. Whilst Hollywood was busy protecting its copyrights they just let it slide. You reap what you sow.”
“With the strong yen they are probably aiming to curb Japanese copying.”
“The disease has spread too far – the market seems to be collapsing like that of anime. It’ll be layoffs and bankruptcies from here on.”
“They enjoy making scanlations – it’s like a club activity to them.”
“It’s like that for fansubs too, but they’re all saying they are helping propagate them. Even the guys writing ero-doujinshi don’t think like that.”
“If you don’t release simultaneously with the Japanese release they will pirate them. They are that committed.”
“They get them even faster than the Japanese regions do. It’s too much…”
“What a bunch of crooks. They make a fortune off donations and advertising revenue. They pretend they are creators and heroes. I want to watch Hollywood movies and American dramas at the same time as their US release. Of course, for free.”
“Overseas manga is ridiculously expensive, so that’s probably behind One Manga’s popularity. However you look at it, ¥2,000 for a single volume is way too much.”
“If the prices drop they’ll just start using censorship as an excuse instead.”
“They wouldn’t buy even if it were cheap. Their anime is far cheaper than in Japan and they still won’t buy.”
The indignation of Japanese anime and manga fans who see themselves having to support an audience of freeloading international fans unwilling to support creators, whilst themselves paying top dollar to ensure even niche audiences can have their needs met, is perhaps not unreasonable, however unsightly its manifestation may be at times.









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Goddess of 2ch: “Full of Lust & Urges (& Also Videos)!”
Why NOT BAN a place called LIBRARY or a law that prohibit BORROWING MANGA from a Friend! LOL!!!!
The companies on Japan tried, but the people said NO.
I certainly wouldn't mind paying for anime and manga IF IT WAS AVAILABLE. Unfortunately, most of what I read and/or watch just isn't available in the Western world. How about these companies actually license/publish in English and I'll shell out the cash.
It just comes down to the fact that a lot of anime is worth checking out but not necessarily worth paying for. Lucky for us, streaming is becoming a major thing now and it's opening up a lot of windows for people who simply can't afford to spend hundreds of dollars on a single series anymore.
Riiiight.
Because 2ch scum doesn't illegally download any western games/movies/music...
Almost everyone with access to a computer has at one point broken copyright laws. People who post their "morally correct" views on how it's bad to steal online are hypocrites with superiority issues.
The only ones who actually haven't ever "downloaded illegally" are the people without access to computers, those too old or too young to use them, etc... The kinds of people that you wouldn't find posting their moral shit on forums.
Industries just need to get over "illegal digital distribution". They need to start viewing that as free advertizing. Quality will always make money.
Quality movies keep on breaking records in sales (yes, even when you inflation adjusted). Music will always make money through live concerts and licensing fees. Plenty of people will even buy the stuff just because they like it (movies, games, music).
Industries are just too greedy to see that almost all of these "illegal downloads" aren't lost revenue. They are a market that doesn't exist. Average person with average downloading habbits (let's say 4 movies, 4 games, 100 songs a month) in reality cannot afford to buy them all. If downloading wasn't an option he might go see 1 movie, buy one game and 20 songs. Or maybe not. Maybe he would borrow cds from friends.
On the other hand let's take a shameless example of a pirate who downloads anything and everything just for the sake of it. Eventually he will play a game or see a movie that really blows him away and will want to buy it.
Weird, the thought that japanese people could be complete douchebags didn't occur before I read this. They're pretty stupid, too.
“What a bunch of crooks. They make a fortune off donations and advertising revenue. They pretend they are creators and heroes. I want to watch Hollywood movies and American dramas at the same time as their US release. Of course, for free.”
I don't know how they equate movies and manga; the former costs (hundreds) millions of dollars to produce, latter is pieces of paper. If they absolutely wanted to see movies when they came out in USA, they could watch shitty cam-rips, just like how people in the Weest have to watch shitty cam-raws of movies that come out in Japan.
Dramas, well they CAN watch them online for free like everyone else. They have google, they can find links just like everyone else.
Looks like I will need many bullets to clear all those "yay OneManga closed down" idiots from this world. Cartridge load...I cried blood already when MangaToshokan got most of it's content deleted.
For now, MangaFox is busy with all the OneManga readers moving to their site, hope it holds better, that OM.
BTW people are mass-downloading from OneManga with batch downloaders, so I think someone will start up a new site soon(I already saved 70% of my fav. manga =).
I use another site and know another where people can read manga. I never liked One manga and never really used it. If manga was released quickly and completed as soon as possible, I would have no problem with buying them but unfortunately that's not the case. I won't make excuses for reading manga online though. It is wrong... but with this new age, it's not very hard to do SOMETHING that isn't cheating creators.
In the world I see everyone has an E book reader like kindle or Ipad or at least "gasp" a computer.
New mangas come out and you get to read the first chapter or whatever for free.
Then it gives you info like released weekly, bi weekly, monthly.
$ per chapter or volume.
Then you can auto subscribe like internet, tv or cable and on the release date you can either have it set to auto download and bill you credit card or other payment method, or have an email alert letting you know your new download is ready.
This would be worth it to me just so I don't have to keep checking to see when new chapters are out.
No scouring the nets for old "out of print" stuff.
Its such a easier business model then, having heaps of stuff printed, delivered, unsold copies disposed of etc.
The current business model sucks.
Overcharge for lots of extra costs, lose money to piraters, higher big money lawyers to chase them.
I meant hire, not higher. Need, coffee.....
I used to legally purchase all my manga and I still prefer having it on paper and officially. Unfortunately, many of my manga aren't worth paying money for only a week after release given how impossible it is for me to dodge spoilers (both online and offline).
LOL What a bunch of hypocrites. My ass they don't download free stuff all the time acting like they're high on the moral ground. Then again it's 2chan, what's to be expected? I really hope someone somewhere in japan posts OUR responses back to them though.
On a side note, I'd like to give a middle finger up to whoever said people should stick to manwha. Manwha is great too, and just because it's korean doesn't make it genetically less superior to japanese manga. All manga in the world deserves to be read and no amount of whiny ass generic internet losers no matter how much they complain will keep and prevent such freedom of expression to expanding from the outside world.
On a closing note, if you're STUPID enough to pay 5000 yen for an anime DVD that's basically the same episode just because you're a fan (i'm talking about the Haruhi Endless summer videos) and eat any shit the corporations feed them they deserve paying over the top and being robbed.
This isn't the last wave my friends, It's the FIRST. Get use to it because the battle for scanlations have just begun.
CAN THE 2-CHAN !@#$ERs COME OVER TO MALAYSIA AND SEE HOW THEY GODDAMN DUB ANIME AND MANGA?!!! AND I MEAN DUB AND TRANSLATE!!! CAN'T EVEN GET DECENT RAWS FOR A DECENT PRICE!!! IMAGINE HAVING TO PAY 3 MONTHS WORTH OF UR POCKET MONEY JUST TO BUY A SET OF ANIME WITH ONLY 10 EPISODES INSIDE FOR ALMOST A 100 BUCKS!!! AND AFTER SO !@#$ING MANY YEARS THE ANIME OR MANGA HAS FINISHED AIRING!!! WITHOUT EVEN A DECENT TRANSLATION OR SUBTITLE FOR ITS PRICE!!! AND NOW THEY'RE BITCHING ABOUT HOW FOREIGNERS SHOULD JUST !@#$ OFF AND GO BACK TO MANHWA?!!! AND DUN !@#$ING GET ME STARTED ON CENSORSHIP!!!
“Manga is wasted on foreigners. Those outside Japan should stick to reading manhwa!”
Well I think the internet is wasted on 2ch and guess who invented it 2ch bitches - THE FOREIGNERS
I like reading Naruto and One Piece, but I like reading other stuff like Chocolate,Shitsu Rakuen,Yankee-kun to Megane-chan,and Ao No Exocist.
You ignorant foreigners admire our culture and copy all we do (from cosplay to our food). This website is the real proof you envy us. It shows your inability to create things. At the same time you dare to insult us and to call for war. It's outrageous.
You just copy and steal without paying anything. Onemanga was scanned by japanese and you weren't able to hide this website. You don't deserve this generous help anymore. It's your own fault, if it dissappeared. We have to pay for your stuff, you will have now to pay for ours.
You even stole our Godnesses from our own board without being generous and thanking us. It's a lack of respect. And you wish to have sex with our girls and lolis. You are western perverts and paedophiles. You won't have them, no foreigners allowed. Japanese girls for japanese men only. Your IP will be reported to our countries police. It's despictable and demonstrates how low you are nowadays. Do your own mangas, respect us and stop stealing our girls and culture.
We won WW2 after all. You are now our slaves and admirers. Respect us or bow to us. We closed Onemanga, we will close all websites stealing our culture, admiring and hating us at the same time, even our US copied board. You lack respect, we won't have respect anymore.
ha^∞
U DUN GOOFED?
Obvious troll is Obvious?!
Nice try troll! No native nihonjin writes English that well.
How can you assume all scans come from Japanese people?
I know whites that live and scan in Japan :D
I'm asian. and I'm offended
Yeah, I seriously doubt that most of the posters are touting this bullshit who are not PAID posters who are trying to make it appear that "EVERYONE IS AGAINST MANGA PIRACY!"
Seriously, who do they think they are fooling!
One of the main reason for manga sales down in Japan is that the Japanese download the raws from sites....and they are complaining we are plunging the sales down......
i know japanese mangas and anime are sold expensive and not easy to purchese out from japan.
日本のアニメと漫画が海外では高くて手に入りにくいってのは知ってるけどさ
but it does not mean everyone should be able to watch it on web for free.
だからってネットでただで見られるようにするべきってなるのは違うと思うの
understand 2 simple fact
簡単な理由だよ
industry and creaters have to make money to make good contents
いい漫画を書くには作家と出版社がお金を稼がなきゃならないから
it is against the law
違法行為だから
i hope every otaku can enjoy manga and anime for right price and fast
全オタクが漫画とアニメを相応の価格で早く楽しめるといいのにね
sorry for my poor english.
from a otaku in japn
英語へたっぴでごめんね
日本のオタクより
There are nice otaku's in Japan. We wish the same thing, enjoy アニメと漫画.
But there are many places/laws/countries make it difficult to pay for a good price. くそ!
犯罪は犯罪だが、すっげ~読みたくて仕方ないんだよ、こいつら。 俺もな、たまには
あんたもまさか一緒何かの映画でも、MP3でもダウンロードしたことないっすか? 「ない」って言うのなら、信じることが辛いんだけどなw
他のやつらには知らんが、やすいなら、きっと金をあげるっすよ。
それに何も買う気がないやつらなら、きっと買わないっしょ? ダウンロード出来るのか、出来ないのかと
へたな日本語ですまない。
But hey, why the sudden influx in Japanese anon? Is this article making its way all over Japanese blogs now? lol
いや、日本語上手いですよ
俺、漫画家なんだ。何か言おうと思ったけど
ここのコメント読んでて英語書く気なくなっちゃった
ダウンロードを責めるというより、なんで皆
スキャンした人に感謝して
描いた人や出版社を罵倒してるのかな。
楽しませてくれてありがとうって、本来俺達が貰える
言葉なんじゃないの?
君が日本語わかるなら、君だけでもわかってほしい
漫画は描くのにもの凄く時間がかかるし
お金もつぎ込んでる。仕事として描きたくない事も描く。
それを知らない人が勝手にスキャンして、ばらまいて
お礼をいわれて…俺は今、涙が止まらないんだ
I hope that you will have time to read this and
know more about what is manga-artist
ども漫画家さん、僕も日本出身の日本人です、けれど米国と日本に育って生きてきました(今はアメリカに住んでいるけど)
あなたの苦労は凄くわかります、そして今でも続けていることに多くのリスペクトをあげます。コメを読んだらあなたは金重心ではなく、感謝や誉め言葉でもありがたく貰う漫画家として印象うけました。あなたはいい漫画家だ、と思っています。
漫画家という職は一般人が思っているより辛く、金儲けが難しい職だというのは嫌ほど知っています。親友は今も漫画家で、まるでネガティヴで別人な人ぐらいになりました
でも、一つどうしても知りたいことがあります。どこで
「ダウンロードを責めるというより、なんで皆
スキャンした人に感謝して
描いた人や出版社を罵倒してるのかな。」
とういう印象を受けましたのですか?出版社は仕方ないと思いますけど(普通日本のビジネス開業なんて海外の一般人にはよく知られていない)、漫画家とスタッフに対してこういう件に関しては罵倒はしてないと思いますけど?そのonemanga.com に載せてある漫画の感想とか漫画家のセンスとか評価していますよ? forums とか行くと。ただもっと探してください。探せばあなたと漫画を感謝している人が絶対いると思いますよ。そして漫画家に対して罵倒しているなんてあんまりない。そしてスキャンした人が感謝されるのは一時的(死ぬほどいますし存在も忘れる)。漫画家に対しての感謝や誉めは長くて印象に残りやすい。彼らもオタクだ、盗みばっかする人達じゃない。
で、こっちの事情も解ってください。
確かに違法スキャンは良くない、でも決して完璧に悪くない
スキャンやファンダブが無ければほぼ外国人は漫画・アニメシリーズなんて知らないないだろう(アニメ店は非常に少ない原因)。ワンピースが一番いい例。米国2003年でワンピースをSHONEN JUMPにのせて、後単個本に出した。日本で爆発的人気があっても米国では少々人気を得た。読んだの覚えているけど、結構微妙に違う雰囲気だった。このとき、スキャンの方が日本と追いついていつもは出版しているのより翻訳が遥かに原作に近く雰囲気までもほぼ同じぐらい上手い。SHONEN JUMP認めている。
そしてついに、米国はアニメ版ワンピースを上映した。これが「原作レイプ」の純粋な形そのものだった。どちらの国にも絶対好かれないアニメだった。このアニメのせいでシリーズは最悪な評価を得て、デビューを台無しにした。米国では、アニメの方が先観客を寄せやすいから、これは致命的だった。でもスキャンがあったから、今でもワンピースがあり人気もあがっている。
VIZメディア(米国のアニメと漫画出版社)はこの結果を知り、onemanga.com と他のサイトに人気シリーズのスキャンを許可している。無料でまず人気を得てからビジネスしよう、知名度さ無ければローカライゼーションする価値ないや続ける意味も無い。米国は日本みたいにアニメや漫画を多く宣伝する金さえ無い。無料に賭けるしかない。漫画の2~3倍の値段で一般人さえ拒否する。
ハッキリ言います、経験からで意見をいいます、米国の一般人は日本人にくらべて金に余裕がない。アメリカはまさに税金地獄、それでも貧しい。これは解ってください。ファンなら絶対買います、そこは安心して。どうやってこの状況でシリーズを上手く売れるのか?それはもう人気と知名度を頼るしかない、たとえそれが違法でも。何故ならネットは便利で無料で手に入るものも多い、そして最強の宣伝効果もある。残念ながら、それほどここのアニメと漫画商売は厳しい。
だからスキャンはある意味良くも悪くでもない無料体験と宣伝
たとえ全てのスキャンを消したとしても。今の状況より変わらず、むしろ悪化する。漫画やアニメに1セント払わない人はただ暇つぶし程度で見て読んでる。無料じゃなくなったら、また別の暇つぶしOR違法ダウンロードするだけ。変わらない。ファンは多分1~3年追いつくとか待てないだろう(GANTZとか)。そしてもしも作品が「改悪」(酷いものも未だにある)されてそれしか売ってなかったらファンはシリーズを諦めるだろう。勿論ローカライゼーションも不安になる。なんせ、安全で解る情報が無いから(スキャンやストリーミングのユーザーレビューや評価とかが大きく関係している)。日本での不人気の漫画のデビューチャンスを失う。(スキャンとファンダブとかはマイナーな漫画やアニメを載せることがあり、これで一揆に有名になる場合もある)。最悪の事態にアニメや漫画はブーム程度に終わってしまう。
これがpiracyの力。不人気な物を逆転させることがある。そして、後商売になれる。
盗みも良くないし、腹立つ漫画家がいるだろうけど、実際これはある意味デビュー方法。作品に人気無ければ感謝も金も無い。けど、読者や視聴者に好かれば、感謝と金もくる。時間はかかるけど、絶対報われます。本当のアーティストならば、金より他人に何かを伝え、できるだけ多くの人々に自分の力込めた作品を見せるつけ、印象に残すことが目的のはず。
日本語下手ですみません
and sorry for a really long essay length Japanese comment.
うっ 読みにくくなってしまいました
すいません。
レスをありがとうございます、書き込んだ漫画家です。
ここのコメントに気づきませんでした、返信が遅くなって申し訳ないです。
色々と伝わった事もあって「なるほど」と思った事も
「それは誤解だ」と思った事もあります。
まず、出版社に対する誤解です。出版社はただ漫画家に漫画を描かせ
それを搾取して出版し金だけ持ってくような存在ではありません。
自分の所が大きい出版社だからとゆう事もありますが、
編集者はつねに読者の事を考え、読者の目線となって
時には漫画家以上に働き、漫画家の助けをしてくれます。
今日本中で人気の漫画はそういった真面目な編集者ありきの物です
漫画家と出版社は一つの漫画を作るのに不可欠なパートナーなんです
つまり出版社を悪く言う事は、自分たちの仕事を否定されるのと等しく
どうしても「こんなにがんばっているのに…」と思ってしまいます。
日本が悪い、jap、ゼノフォビアなどの単語を読むだけで
なぜこっちがそのように言われなきゃいけないのか…と思いました。
漫画家として、自分の作品を好きだと言ってくれる読者は本当に嬉しいし
それがどの国の人でも「読んでくれてありがとう」と言いたい。
ただ、漫画大国の日本ではそれだけじゃ駄目なんです。
子供達は少ないおこづかいの中からやりくりして、吟味して
できるだけ面白い漫画を買おうとします。漫画家としても、子供達に
楽しんでもらう為に必至で「買ってもらえるような漫画」を描こうと
します。そこで「アーティスト」より「ビジネスマン」としての役割が
大きくなっていきます。
少年誌でも、女の子の裸ばっかり載った漫画がありますよね、
あれは漫画家が好きで描いてるんじゃないんですよ。売れるからです。
アーティストとして描きたい事もあるかもしれません、でも
我慢して、わりきって描いてるんですよ。そうゆう物なんです。
すごくバランスが難しいですが、日本の漫画はアートとビジネスの
二つで成り立っていて、どっちか一つでも欠けると形になりません。
多くの人に読んでもらうのはアートとしては成功ですが、お金が入って
こなければビジネスとしては失敗です。
出版社が何にお金を使うのかと言うと、新しい漫画家を育てる為です。
これから出てくる才能を磨く為のお金を、今の人気漫画家が稼いで
いるんですね。そういったシステムがあるので、自分の漫画が人気だから
タダでもいいよとは言えないわけです。
なぜなら自分が漫画家になれたのは出版社と、読者と、
他の漫画家のおかげだからです。
色々と知らなかった事もわかりました、ありがとうございます。
英語のサイトで日本語を長々とすいません
thanks for your replay
its still illegal no matter what you say. and please study japanese a little more.
nicely said
Who do they think pirated it in the first place? Do they think that raws just fall out of the sky?
I really fear that otaku are becoming too consumerist and materialistic in their beliefs. How much money you spend doesn't determine how much of an otaku you are. What makes an otaku is passion, not what material possessions you own or how much money you have.
And nothing of Value was lost.
今違法ダウンロードしてるやつらの8割が購入するようにしてから出版社に言えば多分値下げするよ
wow that is sad, when i was over there ever one was downloading american tv shows ect, that right there make me think they are all jerks. lol well nothing going to stop they from scaning them and post them any way =^_^= more power to us
その漫画書いてるのも日本人なんですけどねw
ていうか
い や な ら よ む な !!
This type of sentiment is what stopped a lot of the fansubbing groups that used to jap-sub popular english shows for them from continuing.
The group I was part of a couple years ago that did CSI (yes, japs love CSI) stopped doing it because all we had were ungrateful bastards that complained that we should be doing it faster and more shows because they provide us with anime.
日本に来いよ!案内してやるぜ!ただし風呂は入ってから来てくれよ。くせー外人とは一緒にいたくないんでな
translation:
(You all) come to Japan, I'll guide you. But, you should take a bath before coming because I don't want to be together with a stinky foreigner
foreigners need only a bath to become decent people, japaneses should be refactored by god, you crooked legs!
____
/_ノ ヽ、_\
o゚((●)) ((●))゚o
/::::::⌒(__人__)⌒::::: \
| |r┬-| | (⌒)
| | | | | ノ ~.レ-r┐、
| | | | | ノ__ | .| | |
\ `ー'´ /〈 ̄ `-Lλ_レレ
 ̄`ー‐---‐‐´
HAHAHAHAHA!
ZAMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Pff the japanese don't even cater to any market but their own, they can't lose money on something they don't even send any on. So if they are failing in sales it the japanese them selfs that are responsible for it.
('A`)ノ くまの子みていた
ノ( ヘヘ
('A`) かく ('A`) れん
∨) (∨
(( ))
ヽ('A`)ノ ぼっ♪
( ) ゛
゛/ω\
('A` ) おしりを出した子 いっと…
(⊃⌒*⌒⊂)
/__ノωヽ__
__[警]
( ) ('A`)
( )Vノ )
| | ω|
I watch fansubs and buy dvds of the one's I like, I don't have the luxery of watching it on TV like they do. So they can go cry me a bloody river for all I care, besides downloading movies and tv series for personal use is legal here. And if they want me to support them, they should support the forgein markets more and provide more international releases so we can buy and support them directly. And the dvd's I do buy are all US releases since the EU get pretty much no love at all.
I am sick of the attitude of these americans! From now on I'm going to pirate all american music, movies and software. I'm only going to buy entertainment in japanese. They have no remorse... even after doing illegal things they still feel that they are right. Since american media doesnt get released everywhere instantly might as well pirate it all.
You probebly allready did.
I'm American and I don't have a problem with you pirating things that don't get released instantly in Japan or old things that are impossible to find off the internet. (I was downloading TV rips of Patalliro before the DVD set came out because there was no place else to get them.)
I go to see movies and buy American books because it's easy for me, not because I love the companies. I buy a lot of Japanese manga because I have a lot of Japanese bookstores where I live. But I download shows from the UK and Australia that will never come over here too.
If you can't get it, you can't get it. I don't take it personally. Watch what you like and if it's good enough then buy it when it comes to Japan. No problem?