Lolicon Christopher Handley gets 6 Months for Loli Manga

beakoand-backbeard-by-mizudamako

Christopher Handley, the manga collector who faced 15 years after postal inspectors seized his shipment of loli manga, has been sentenced to 6 months in prison for “possessing obscene visual representations of the sexual abuse of children and mailing obscene material.”

The details of the case are visible in a previous report, but in summary 38-year-old Christopher Handley, a programmer who lived in his mother’s basement, ordered 7 loli manga from Japan, which customs inspector “Inspector Raper” took exception to after going through his package, leading to a series of criminal charges.

The judge ruled a number of the charges unconstitutional, but two charges based on “obscenity” stuck: “possessing obscene visual representations of the sexual abuse of children and mailing obscene material,” based on a technicality – he had committed an act of “interstate commerce”:

Section 1466A, the primary statute involved in this case, prohibits the dissemination in interstate commerce of a narrow category of “hardcore” pornography involving real or apparent minors, where such depictions lack literary, artistic, political, or scientific value.

The court documents confirmed that Handley had in the eyes of the court committed a definite thought crime:

Mr. Handley may argue that this case is “just about drawings,” but such a characterization is misleading. This case is not “just about drawings” any more than child pornography cases are “just about photographs,” or cases involving threatening to kill a public official are “just about words.”

The acts depicted in some of these obscene materials are punishable in many jurisdictions by decades or more of imprisonment. The sentence should reflect these facts.

It would appear that possessing fictional depictions of violent crimes should by the same measure also attract a prison sentence.

The court’s official summary is available here.

Previously it appears he tried to gull the courts and media into thinking he was in possession of “yaoi” comics, but court documents reveal exactly which manga he was charged with receiving – all, save a bestiality manga anthology, were pure loli-manga by top loli-mangaka:

Maka Fushigi – I Love Doll

Maka Fushigi – Eromon

Maka Fushigi – Kono Manko ga Sugoi

Maka Fushigi – Jidou Porno

Nekogen – Otonari Kazoku

Tamachi Yuki – Mikansei Seifuku Shoujo

Anthology – The Animal Sex Anthology Vol. 3 (Kemono For Essential 03)

His defence apparently thought they would have difficulty convincing the local jury that these edifying titles were not “obscene” and so not constitutionally protected free speech, prompting his original guilty plea, in order to save him from a lengthy minimum sentence.

This did not stop them flagrantly lying about the content of the manga in question:

“There is explicit sex in yaoi comics, and the men are drawn in a very androgynous style, which has the effect of making them look really young.

There’s a real taboo in Japan about showing pubic hair, so they’re all drawn without it, which also makes them look young.

So what concerned the authorities were the depictions of children in explicit sexual situations that they believed to be obscene.

But there are no actual children. It was all very crude images from a comic book.”

The defence claimed that of the thousands of volumes he had collected, only a few were lolicon in nature, although their credibility is rather suspect in light of the utter fabrication above. The authorities kept 80 of 1,200 volumes seized, including such eminent lolicon titles as LO.

The judge sentenced him to 6 months in jail, 5 years on various forms of probation, and forfeiture of confiscated assets (loli manga and computer).

Additionally he will face lie detector tests and psychological evaluations, at his own expense, in order to monitor his “condition.” He must also pay a $200 fine.

The sentencing document is visible here.

It seems he will not have to register as a sex offender or be barred from future computer usage.

He faced a maximum of 10 years, and a lengthy federally imposed minimum sentence if convicted without the plea bargain.

Since he pleaded guilty and was convicted specifically on grounds of moving “obscene” materials in an act of interstate commerce, the actual murky overall legal status of loli-manga as constitutionally protected free speech appears to remain unchanged.

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370 Comments

    • It DOESN’T matter. It’s the state. They have that power. If you get caught mailing yourself that kind of thing in ANY state you’re PROBABLY screwed. It’s all about the security department representative and his discretion.

      I don’t like it just as much as you hate it but until judges and security heads change it’s nothing we can do about it. Such is the nature of the law.

  • Anonymous says:

    If you are not RABIDLY against , your opponents will use it as a cry against you. eg, “Sir, did you ever come out openly against Ginger Cats before the famous Cat trial?” No?, then that means you are PRO GINGER CAT!!! (Burn him)”

    Most of these poor judges are scared of being seen as pro some inept concept, that they do not understand, because a loud minority is against it.

    One famous American example comes to mid… “Are you now, or have you ever been, a member of the Communist party?”

  • Anonymous says:

    God I’m getting sick of this fucking country. But shit if you’ll find any place much better. If the human race is going to destroy itself, we need to get along with it already before those in power fuck up even more. Either that, or God needs to get off his ass and start the Apocalypse, or Armageddon, or Ragnarok, or whatever religion based “end of humanity” scenario is popular right now.

  • Anonymous says:

    because of a technicality this man’s life is ruined. he will never get a job (even at McDonalds), he has probably been disowned, his drivers licence/id will forever be marked with him as a pedophile, and I’m sure nobody wants to date him. Yet we allow criminals to freely communicate in prison so they can become better criminals

    if this is justice, than I don’t want justice

  • In Germany lolicon is also illegal. Nearly all the lolicon sites (despite Handley's conviction) are based in the US. (Good luck with that, btw.) You can't name a single German website that has lolicon, I'll bet.

    Actually, German censors completely fucked over Artist Stu Mead's website. Forced him to remove all his paintings – merely fictional views – from the web. So where's the logic in that?

  • Musashi75 said:
    USA law is most ridiculous in the world.

    No one would care in TURKEY if you own loli manga, cause its art or something, but dont dare to offend ATATURK that puts you in Jail.

    And this man is not a criminal for owning mangas,
    WESTERN countries should behead the real SEX CHILD RAPER Fucktards which go out of Jail in Germany where i live.Citizens are going mad about that such people run free in the country and most of them repeat their crimes !
    Also with the FRITZl-MF from Austria who raped and imprisoned his own daughters.

    Where is the logic about it?

    If I follow the logic of all your reasoning, the logic is…out the window.

  • Anonymous says:

    “Pedosexual”?

    No, my friend. The word is “pedophile.” Sexuality indicates gender preference. “Child” is not a gender. I don’t try to call myself a “macrosexual,” and there’s no reason for you to believe that your fetish is anything but a fetish either.

    Having said that, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with a fetish – I just think it’s mighty presumptuous of you to elevate lolicon and shotacon to the level of a sexuality.

  • Koyoto_Shadow says:

    The current ruling on what is obscenity is not a literal definition, but a completely subjective one. As a justice was quoted as saying “I can’t define what obscenity is, but I’ll know it when I see it.” This completely subjective system of what is acceptable to own or express in private is beyond simply not being constitutional.

    The theory itself can make sense on a completely superficial level, but it’s simply another form of control that the government and others try to extert over people’s lives…and their thoughts.

    X&V,
    K.D.S.

  • You know the hole Pedosexualism thing is not helping your argument. Frankly I find pedosexualism disgusting.

    The thing is when I see a loli manga etc, I don’t see them as actual human fucking beings or even as children or adults. I see it as, “Oh some nicely drawn 2d art”. I’m not really sure how to describe it.

    Pedosexualism is not attractive. Pedosexualism is what the term means, having sexuality towards children. Society has every right to be afraid of people who are sexually aroused by children.

    Frankly lolicons shouldn’t be into the “children aspect”. Gaah! This is too hard to explain.

    Anyways the case is messed up but blabbing about paronia of pedosexualism isn’t helping you either.

  • ”But there are no actual children. It was all very crude images from a comic book”

    I think he makes a fair point there , its impossible just by looking at a loli manga for sure (or some at least,) that they are indeed depicting underage children.

    I bow to this man who had the balls to say that to a court.

  • It’s still injustice but 6 months he won’t see the inside of a prison.
    BTW last I checked lie detector tests are not admissible as evidence in court.
    Really this case should have been thrown out and the postal inspector who brought up the charges fired and have his retirement revoked and given to people in Haiti.

    • They aren’t even arresting extreme lolicons. I showed my whole lolicon collection to the FBI, as I said before, which included the Enjeru series and Lewd Angels works…… they said NOTHING on that subject.

      They were more worried about whether I had REAL child porn, and when I told them no and showed them all my stuff, they went away.

      If you are HONEST about the fact that you are a pedosexual and SELF-POWERFUL when they come to the door and give the impression that you are NOT going to be pushed around? The FBI backs down 9 times out of 10.

      They don’t WANT someone (unless they are a murderer or kidnapper suspect) who is going to fight back against them.

  • despite all the outrage no one will actually do anything about it, otakus keep quite and lay low till they get caught and then we see the next arrest and hear more outrage. If anything is gonna get odne at all people will have to speak up, and thats just not gonna happen.

  • The fact that Mr. Handley is a comic book collector and has every genre, not just manga doesn’t make him a lolicon since those were the only books in the entire collection

    Stay classy Sankaku.

  • …pornography involving real or apparent minors, where such depictions lack literary, artistic, political, or scientific value.
    We need more hentai with real plot for it to contain more literary/artistic value.

    …political…
    Make satirical hentais set in politics.

    …scientific value
    Sensei wa ii koto wo oshiete a-ge-ru!

  • I believe this part of art is just ones ability in how well they can express a drawn character regardles of what they are or for what they were drawn,since they are only drawn characters and aren’t suddenly humans,animals or whatever they say since it’s still only drawn characters and they are only fictional.
    Guess people have a liking for drawn characters and the way one can express these characters,so it is considered art,but i still don’t know any terms what to call this new sensation.
    I even believe guro is art,becouse one who can express himself so violently in his art is truly of artistic value that is impossible to do it so in RL and it shouldn’t be done in RL.

    But if they still insist on giving rights to drawn characters,then i will draw my own waifu and demand they give her social support money since she can’t get a job 😛

  • Lol at all the butt hurt Americans. Do you love your country as much now? try to think about this case before you go back to your usual shit of posting racist comments in the china and japan news stories

    every country is fucked up in its own way. Fucking grow up out of this ‘AMERICA FUCK YEAH’ that you’ve been weened on since kindergarten.

    • ‘AMERICA FUCK YEAH’ That’s all you got?
      Let me tell you who the bad guys are. They’re us. WE BE BAD.
      We’re the baddest-assed sons a bitches that ever jogged in combat boots. We’re three-quarters grizzly bear and two-thirds car wreck and descended from a stock market crash on our mother’s side. You take your Germany, Spain, and France, roll them all together, and it wouldn’t give us enough room to park our cars. We’re the big boys, Jack, the original, giant, economy-sized, new and improved butt kickers of all time. When we snort coke in Houston, people lose their hats in Hong Kong. And we’ve got an American Express card credit limit higher than your pissant metric numbers go. Our country’s never been invaded because I’d like to see the needle-dicked foreigners who’d have the guts to try. We drink napalm to get our hearts started in the morning and eat railway track like pretzel sticks. A rape and a mugging is our way of saying “Cheers.” Hell can’t hold our night clubs. We walk taller, talk louder, spit farther, fuck longer and buy more shit than you know the names of. I’d rather be a junkie in New York City than King, Queen and jack-shit of all you other countries. We eat countries like yours for breakfast and shit them out before lunch.
      There.
      Satisfied?

    • Butt-hurt? That’s all you got?
      Let me tell you who the bad guys are. They’re us. WE BE BAD.
      We’re the baddest-assed sons a bitches that ever jogged in combat boots. We’re three-quarters grizzly bear and two-thirds car wreck and descended from a stock market crash on our mother’s side. You take your Germany, Spain, and France, roll them all together, and it wouldn’t give us enough room to park our cars. We’re the big boys, Jack, the original, giant, economy-sized, new and improved butt kickers of all time. When we snort coke in Houston, people lose their hats in Hong Kong. And we’ve got an American Express card credit limit higher than your pissant metric numbers go. Our country’s never been invaded because I’d like to see the needle-dicked foreigners who’d have the guts to try. We drink napalm to get our hearts started in the morning and eat railway track like pretzel sticks. A rape and a mugging is our way of saying “Cheers.” Hell can’t handle our night clubs. We walk taller, talk louder, spit farther, fuck longer and buy more shit than you know the names of. I’d rather be a junkie in New York City than King, Queen and jack-shit of all you other countries. We eat countries like yours for breakfast and shit them out before lunch.
      There.
      Satisfied?

  • In 1915 the Supreme Court of the United States of America deemed motion pictures to not be of artistic value, and thus not protected speech under the First Amendment of the Constitution.

    LET THAT SINK IN PEOPLE!

    • I did not know that. Damn.

      Here’s another one. The only legally protected pornography is ‘mere nudity’ or single male to female vaginal-only penetration that does not show the actual ejaculation of semen.

      That’s right, if you have anything more hardcore than that you could theoretically be charged with obscenity.

  • No matter how you look at it, no average layperson and certainly no government nor nation will approve loli.

    Tolerate, maybe to some extent… but definitely never approve.

    The moral of this story:
    If you have to get your loli fix, do it quietly, stay low, and don’t get involved with the law.

    You don’t want to be caught. Ever.

  • Trying to confuse the court with “yaoi” and “loli” is one of the stupidest things I’ve ever heard. I’m sorry, but this guy gets no sympathy from me.

    First, knowingly break the law and getting caught.

    Second, lying to the judge.

    And thirdly, this will likely set precedence to future cases. Increased postal inspections? Tighter enforcement? Change the law to prosecute all loli manga owners? Angry politicians and vigilantes out to witch-hunt anime and manga communities? Don’t forget, we can now add “lier” to our long list of unsavory characteristics that define our profile.

    Sorry, buddy.. you deserve what you get.

    And you’re unknowingly dragging the rest of us down with you.

    • Please, get your head out of your asshole. You are robbing your brain of oxygen.

      He broke no law. He has the right to view whatever he wants, even “obscene” material in the privacy of his house. It is a federal crime to look at someone else’s mail.

      It’s pieces of shit like you why we are losing our rights. You raise your little white flag and surrender for what millions died for only 60 years ago.

      • He was a manga collector. He had imported thousands of them before this, none of them loli.

        This was the first time he ordered 7 lolicon manga, some asshole would open his mail, which is a federal offense.

        They x-ray these packages and only suppose to inspect ones that are suspicious. How are books suspicious?

        • x-raying packages with books:

          When I came back from Japan, I had 55 manga/light novels stuffed into my backpack. At security (in America) they had to re-scan my bag with some manga in a different container, because all the paper stopped the x-rays lol.
          At least I wasn’t old enough to buy porn yet.

  • “Mr. Handley may argue that this case is “just about drawings,” but such a characterization is misleading. This case is not “just about drawings” any more than child pornography cases are “just about photographs,” or cases involving threatening to kill a public official are “just about words.”

    alright, what about every horror movie in existence? killing people is obviously a serious crime, yet many people watch, make, and enjoy films depicting such acts.
    any form of entertainment that does not involve actual human right violation should not be illegal.

  • The disturbing aspect of this decision is that the legal distinction between imagining a crime and actually doing it has been removed.

    I’m no fan of loli porn. But clearly there is a difference between taking a photograph of a real girl illegally having sex and drawing a picture from imagination of such an act.

    If there is any scientific evidence that looking at loli porn leads you to rape underage girls, clearly the law would be justified. However I don’t think there is anything to show it.

    • Ah, but the PROBLEM is that saying that the girl having sex is illegal violates HER constitutional rights, which children do have the SAME RIGHTS under the law as adults do.
      The Constitution says “ALL MEN” meaning… ALL HUMANITY, whether children, adults, babies, etc.

      All humans have the same right AND the same responsibilities when it comes down to it.

  • ..he tried to gull the courts and media into thinking he was in possession of “yaoi” comics

    So basically, it’s A-okay if it’s gay porn but not if he’s being heterosexual on young 2D girls..?

    ..Additionally he will face lie detector tests..

    Added more ridiculousness to this case; they’re actually making it sounds like he’s possessing a stolen top secret document from the military instead of collection of papers with inexistent girls.

  • With crap like this happening, the industry wonders why we download instead of ordering from Japan. THIS would be why. And I can guarantee you that if the person in this case who got railroaded ever gets loli manga again, it will be downloaded.

  • Why are you people mixing the EU with the US? From what I know, there’s no law in the EU that bans the possession of loli(or any other kind) of manga. It’s just drawings after all. It’s just a problem of the north america(US and Canada(and probably australia too)), clearly 2 very retarded countries!

    • US, UK, Canada and Australia all seem to be in disfavor of lolicon. I heard Germany bans it too, but I’m not sure about that.

      The Netherlands (where I live) has laws against virtual CP, but it’s uncertain whether or not this includes lolicon. Goes for several other countries as well.

  • And you guys who are complaining about this conviction are the same idiots who want to have guns banned. Dude, if we end up getting rid of guns, what the hell are we going to shoot conservatives with? You know, the fucking rats that put these sorts of laws into place?

    Masochists. I swear, man.

  • As much as I hate pedophiles, I think the idea that loli manga encourages pedophilia is ridiculous. I’d prefer for the people who are interested in that to satisfy their interests through manga than to exploit real children. It’s not like we can ever eliminate pedophilia entirely. Punishing someone for their preferred reading material is just ridiculous. It’s only a matter of time until we’re living in some kind of 1984-esque society.

    • Pedophiles are not child molesters. Wanting to have sex with children does not mean a person doesn’t have a choice on acting on such impulses.

      People are INNOCENT until proven guilty. Not the other way around.

      There are plenty of pedophiles in the world, and many are not monsters. They didn’t ask to be born with the attraction to children, anymore than gays asked to be attracted to the same sex.

    • Azure Xuchilbara says:

      In the end, we all need to replace every single leader of all the world’s super-powers with raging, perverted otakus…

      Tis’ the only way…

      No war, no moral dilemma, no drama…

      Think about it…

      Unrestricted making of videogames and movies…

      No more “Oh no, you can’t senselessly kill children in a videogame!!!” and “You can’t show this in a movie!”…

      If the creative minds of scientists and perverts collide, hell…We may even have Chobits…

    • Damn straight Loli is an outlet, just like violent video games are an outlet for violent tendencies. They are a pacifier not an instigator/motivator. Hense why places with access to such outlets have lower related crime rates than places without access to such materials.

    • Obscenity is judged by the Miller test.

      The Miller test was developed in the 1973 case Miller v. California.[1] It has three parts:

      * Whether the average person, applying contemporary community standards, would find that the work, taken as a whole, appeals to the prurient interest,
      * Whether the work depicts/describes, in a patently offensive way, sexual conduct or excretory functions[2] specifically defined by applicable state law,
      * Whether the work, taken as a whole, lacks serious literary, artistic, political or scientific value. (This is also known as the (S)LAPS test- [Serious] Literary, Artistic, Political, Scientific.)

      The work is considered obscene only if all three conditions are satisfied.

      What he was convicted for met all three conditions and as such Freedom of Speech no longer applies. And the reason why it was interstate commerce was because he ordered online from a seller that existed outside of Iowa. The manga traveled across state lines making it Interstate commerce. Its how they lock up most internet “criminals”

      • Name something you like. I will deem it obscene, and make sure you’re behind bars.

        See, it’s just that easy, and it’s unconstitutional.

        Our forefathers were not stupid; they thought of everything, and they knew everything had to be protected, or eventually nothing would be.

      • How do they determine artistic value? I’m pretty sure the average person can’t draw a manga for the life of them, it takes talent (and perhaps a lot of practice) to do so.

        You can call a few smears on a piece of canvas ‘art’, but a loli manga suddenly lacks any artistic value. Someone explain that to me.

        And if they come up with the ‘it looks realistic’ argument, wouldn’t that be proof of high artistic value? After all, it takes skill to make it that way.

  • …I’m seriously tempted to study law and become a judge so I can fight against stupidity like this. But one has to wonder if there’s a better way of fighting this utter mockery of the law without having to spend 15-20 years studying law just to do so.

  • Like Jeremy Clarkson of the most successful BBC magazine/show concluded, after a “special” feature in USA: DON’T GO THERE!!!

    TopGear hit the nail 😛 They were nearly killed by rednecks in Alabama, because of a few jokes they did.

    US really suck… they only trouble the hole world. Know the bank crisis origin? Trouble in the middle east? …

    May be the people do not suck, at least some, but in general the politics they do kinda does.

  • !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    District Judge James E. Gritzner

    Nancy Harris – Judicial Assistant
    Phone: 515.284.6291

    Address:
    United States Courthouse
    123 East Walnut Street
    Room 130
    Des Moines, Iowa 50309

    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Write letters and call. This bastard must not be allowed to sleep at night. He should be in jail.

  • Don’t know why people are bitching. That judge was awesome, and effectively gave that guy the best sentence he could expect for a case so strongly in the public eye.

    6 months is WAY below the expected minimum sentence, and there is no sex offender registration. Remember that the judge cannot just let the guy go free if laws are actually broken, which they were.

    Also remember the defense lied like a bitch. Overall, I think this outcome is much better than could be otherwise expected.

  • Obscenity laws completely undermine the First Amendment, and thus are unconstitutional.

    Obscenity can not exist. It is an opinion, and not a fact. The “standards” of a community are constantly “evolving” because they slowly let their guard down and stop worrying about bullshit that doesn’t affect them.

    Chris Whorley did not commit a crime.

      • Really? Call me a pedophile to my face asshole. Just wait, When you need protection in the future for a crime you didn’t commit, who’s going to be there for you? And don’t think it wont happen. People can be prosecuted and jailed now days if someone says there a sexual predator and types up a fake msn conversation.

  • ———-
    Why is the person that opened his package not in jail for a Federal Offense and the case dropped? This is a blatant violation of Chris’ rights.

    It is a crime to open someone else’s mail, and Whorley is going to jail for not committing any crime.
    ———-

  • “Mr. Handley may argue that this case is “just about drawings,” but such a characterization is misleading. This case is not “just about drawings” any more than child pornography cases are “just about photographs,” or cases involving threatening to kill a public official are “just about words.””

    What a fucking retard.

      • Screw opinion, its a FACT drawings or other artifical methods of depicting pictures, images scenes etc, which are FICTIONAL (except if you are drawing a scene which is taking place… which is just weird) are VERY different from a photograph which is a method of taking in a REAL scene and creating a picture which shows this REAL scene happening.

    • Azure Xuchilbara says:

      Maybe the feds hired some thugs to burn his doujin collection without the evidence tracing back to them..?

      You know how it is with the times…

      If he pleaded guilty for being a cowardly dumbass, then I hope he gets thrown in a pit full of Spartan Pyramid Heads…

  • “The acts depicted in some of these obscene materials are punishable in many jurisdictions by decades or more of imprisonment. The sentence should reflect these facts.”

    After this logic, possessing a horror movie makes you a serial killer and you deserve a death sentence?

  • Azure Xuchilbara says:

    As long as one of us survives, we are hentai legion…

    10 years…100 years…1000 years…

    It matters not as long as we save the works of these

    hentai doujin artists for future generations to come…

    Be a hentai archivist…For a hentai filled future!!!

  • The key point was the shipping over state lines of material that could be determined by the court or a jury to be obscene. The current “loli is loli if we say it looks like loli” was not actually brought up in the courtroom. If he’d been stupid enough to ask for a jury trial, what do you think the result would be? A jury in Bumfuck, USA would freak the fuck out over something like Comic LO and he’d have been nailed to the fucking wall. His plea bargain is an astounding giveaway for him. He might not even have to spend the 5 years in prison, as it is optional if it’s decided he needs psychiatric help instead. And to give an example of how flabby the prosecutor thought his case was, he agreed to keep him off the sexual predator’s list! This is utterly amazing.
    It’s easy for us to say Handley should have “fought this to the wall” but the time and money to do that would have been insane. And if he’d lost, it’s likely he’d have been slammed with a lot more prison time and registration as a sex criminal (a life sentence).
    Most sex crimes of this time are settled by plea bargain because the cost of losing is overwhelming and the prosecutors know it. And the publicity was bad enough already. Can you imagine being smeared all over the front page of newspapers across America for years of your life?
    I don’t blame him one damn bit and I have to say again he got away easily, given the laws that exist.
    Myself, I don’t think drawings are people and if they are, any comic or TV show that depicts a murder should result in arrests. But as someone pointed out above, when it comes to CP everyone’s brains fall out. Expecting to get a fair trial involving it is foolish.
    It’s also completely random. Guys have gotten years in prison for one CP photo in their cache. A guy in Ireland last year was found with tens of thousands of pictures and no charges were brought. So it all depends on where you get off the bus.

  • fuck this shit, cp isn’t illegal because it’s ‘obscene’, it’s illegal because actual children are getting abused/exploited, you can’t say that a fucking drawing is being abused, you can’t convict somebody over someone’s fucking art

  • Based on the logic of this, you will go to jail for artwork that shows someone being unjustly jailed, or a first person murder pick, or a sign that says “no blacks” is in a pick. Why not every point out fetishes that actually have instances of damage to other people.

  • “The acts depicted in some of these obscene materials are punishable in many jurisdictions by decades or more of imprisonment.” I’d like to see any western comic book where this does not apply.

  • Mr. Handley may argue that this case is “just about drawings,” but such a characterization is misleading. This case is not “just about drawings” any more than child pornography cases are “just about photographs,” or cases involving threatening to kill a public official are “just about words.”

    You can make a film depicting the assassination of political leaders. You cannot depict children having sex, even if no child came within a hundred miles of the depiction’s production.

    • That is the argument that some people should bring up….. books that have depictions of murder and games that have that are not illegal, so why should loli be illegal?

      Just because they are ‘obscene’ to some people? That’s too fucking much a viewpoint type thing, that NO ONE should be allowed to force on someone else.

  • I would demand for them to prove the children were children and that they were abused. Maybe even belittle the prosecutor for not bring one of the children into court to prove they were not coerce into giving a false statement.

    If you’re going to give a drawing the same rights as a human, be prepared to back your shit up.

  • Barbarian of Gor says:

    This is one of the major reasons why I call it AmeriKKKa; “Justice by Points”

    The prosecutor, the police, do not care in the least guilt or innocence, they care about “Points”. They make and break their careers by documented convictions they bring in, so they tend to go for easy targets then try to “Throw the book” at everyone to get as many “Points” as possible.

    This has been going on a long time, but only now is totally entrenched. The prosecutors in the McMartin case were fired, not for human rights abuse, not for willfully prosecuting people they knew halfway through the trial (at least) were 100% innocent, but for failing to achieve a single conviction on top of the time and money they spent attempting it.

    This sort of crime, “Technicality ThoughtCrime” is just a “Slam Dunk” where the action can be considered proof of guilt and because they can scream “Think of the CHILDREN!” like any witch hunt, anyone who dares speak against it is accused of being allied with or similar to the accused.

    Here is what will deter it, though…

    1. No mail, just download and use precautions.
    2. Encrypt files, like with TrueCrypt and passeges from favorite books BUT with ‘escrambling’ done in a way you can absolutely remember and never have to write down.
    3. When arrested DO NOT TALK TO THE POLICE. “I invoke the 5th. I want a lawyer.” NOTHING but that. If you are in an interrogation room for days, just keep repeating those two sentences, pretend you are else where building a house. You can NOT argue your way out of it, even if you do convince them you are “innocent”. Even if they know you are innocent, they still will try to peg you because a “Real Criminal” might well fight back and knows to do at least this. You can not be prosecuted for what you do not say, but you can be for what you do. There have been people proven innocent released from death row days before their execution who talked to the police who asked them to help, but then the police openly lied and said they admitted things and used just enough selections from what they said to convince a jury.

    Maybe you’ll luck out and they’ll clobber you big time, then you’ll very quick be free with millions, or if they (unlikely, despite possible threats they’ll make to try to get you to respond) kill you the “Justice by points” prosecutor will feed on the police to keep up his “Score” and save his ass then the police/prosecutor will be too busy fighting each other for petty abuse and all of them will get HUGE lawsuits from your relatives.

    4. Some group, like the CBLDF, should get an ideal case (only Loli, no confession) and drag it on and on and on and on. Keep attention and donations coming in, drum up the accused as a hero, ensuring some of the funds go to help him get back on his feet when he gets out. If he’s done something like a crude web comic, the new attention makes him the next “Mike Diana” and he can use/abuse that for a bunch of quick art contracts or jump start a career if he improves his skills in prison. Drag it on and on and on. Rave “ThoughtCrime is NOT Crime!” in ads everywhere and tribute comics… Vilify any relevant public officials as disgusting cowards who’d willfully let an axe murderer kill a family for more ‘points’ after he comes out of the house holding a bloody axe.

    This works. In my neck of the woods, the state went to go Hitler like and crush an “Animal Hoarder”. Good “Points” and makes them feel so powerful shooting a woman’s dogs in front of her as they slap a grotesque fine attached to a property lien, right? Well, she wasn’t a hoarder, she ran a “Puppy Mill”. One of those industrial dog kennels that cranks out tons of exactly this or that breed so the pet stores can have “Only 6 weeks left before we kill these cute puppies and the next batch comes in!” signs. Commodotized life at 1/3 the cost of a “Licensed Traditional Breeder”. They also paid the local paper to show the other side of the story, so instead of a very cruel person, she was depicted as a kooky but nice old lady, or a traditional breeder who accidentally bred more dogs just before the early recession and couldn’t sell them all in time… So the city that did the hard work, with the state running away, ended up caring for thousands of horribly inbred, seizure prone mutts that thrashed and needed constant veterinary care for about 2 years as “Corporate Lawyers” dragged it on and on and on. They settled for a light probation and a token fine and couldn’t euthanize the dogs, even paid some people to take them. Clear message, the next “Puppy Mill” just needs to keep it out of town and out of plain sight, they’ll never be touched, they can’t afford to.

    ———-

    BTW-I donated to CBLDF, you all should too if you can afford it, even a small donation. I’m sure plenty of trolls will rave I’m a Loli fan, but hey, I have good reason to be against prosecuting this guy also;

    For, if it becomes established even this “Thought Crime” is worthy of jail, what next-?

    Perhaps jailing someone for multiple car thefts, manslaughter and murder for playing “Grand Theft Auto”?

    And I’m sure the “Modern women who seek to destroy men”, the “Equality Now!” and all the other “Hyenas in Petticoats” would love to prosecute anyone who reads or owns the works of the “Great one”… (hint, my Name)

    • Even if you are not a fan of this genera of comic you should be very afraid.
      The people who do these type of witch hunts always always have ulterior motives.

      The words of Martin Niemöller should be taken as a warning that witch hunts over thought crimes never results in anything good nor stay with in bounds.

      First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a communist;
      Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist;
      Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew;
      Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak out for me.

    • I don’t care what you like. If you aren’t forcing me to view it, it is your right to be able to choose what you want to view.

      I also have the right to not view whatever you view.

      And yet, we can’t as a society seem to understand that free speech is all or nothing. They want to take away your rights, even though you are not taking away theirs.

    • Exactly right, unfortunately… though I have to say that the child pornography, statutory rape and child sexual abuse laws were NEVER truly about protecting children from FORCED sexual encounters (the only thing that we should be trying to protect them from) but about keeping them celibate by fiat of law.

      Told my children that if they were having sex with someone, to just keep it QUIET and if they were having problems with someone… come to ME and I would take care of it, don’t tell the police unless the person in question actually forcibly raped or drugged them.

  • well all things considered it could have been ALOT worse remember tht case about a guy who DL’d kiddy porn by accident and got jail time and a sex offender charge even though the file was accessed once then deleted

      • Yeah you see either extreme. I wonder if he’d reported it if it’d make a difference? I think a lot more people would report the stuff and help police to find the origin of the file and save the kids if they didn’t have to be afraid of being villainized themselves for making the discovery.

  • basicly if you live in the united states your f*cked if you have manga or ecchi pics on your computer. just remember this is the land of the free to have your rights removed at any time so please come visit us here 🙂

  • I have to wonder when the day will come that we must pull out the ammo box to restore the luster of the constitution. The jury box currently seems to be failing and the soap and ballot boxes are moot.

    • Ah, but the point is that some people can ONLY get off with loli…. they are simply only attracted to children, and there is nothing wrong with that.

      Society has only made it appear that there is something wrong with that because adults wish to think that children are ‘unable’ to make their own sexual choices (a load of crap, that is!) and are ‘inferior’ to adults.

      • Oh dear lord, I love this defense.

        No, children are not able to make their own sexual choices. Children (and I’m only talking kids under the age of 12-13 here) are not to be trusted with any kind of real responsibility, as they’re complete idiots.

        Plus, they are in no way physically or hormonally ready to be having sex, which is the reason we have laws like this in the goddamn first place.

        I have nothing against loli manga, but people who actually get off to and/or rape real children are, frankly, monsters. Monsters not because of their preferences, but because they destroy children’s lives.

        • Although i would never have a sexual relationship with a child….please stop screaming “think of the children”. If a person who has full mental retardation is giving the freedom to a sexual life, there is no reason to think of children as “idiots”. Maybe you were an idiot as a child, but i wasn’t, and was fully capable of making my own decisions by the age of 9.

        • Looks like Fire+Phanto just pwned this anon. To elaborate a little further: stop fucking telling them that their lives are ‘destroyed’. If they come up with the idea themselves then try to gently break it to them that they’re wrong: they’re still alive and in a lot of pain but they can recover. Reinforcing this ‘my life is gone forever’ shit is what motivates them to suicide and self-harm, propogating this and focusing so much on the whole sexual purity issue in our society is part of what’s damaging them.

          Rape and exploitation are bad, and we should have punishments to disincline people from doing it, no doubt about that. We need to focus though on when consent is violated, and when people actually lack informedness rather than just presuming it on biological criteria like race, sex or age. We managed to nip the first 2 in law if not in prejudice.

        • PhantomStatistic says:

          you know most adults are complete idiots as well so your argument is null. also since 18 is just a number, who’s to say who is an adult and who isn’t? I’ve met kids way more mature than a lot of the over 20 year olds i know.

        • Mother Nature would like to have a word with you.

          Thing is, it’s SOCIETY that treats a child like it’s not ready to give birth at age 12. By then, a girl has fully functioning reproductive organs and is in all biological means ready to have sex. And some children are wiser than any adult when it comes to sex.

    • No, that is NOT the moral of the story…. because a lot of the religious asshats want to make even REGULAR pornography illegal. It’s simply time to stand up and say that if something is FICTIONAL, then there is nothing wrong with it and it cannot be made illegal.

      The real issue behind this is the more people who have sexual encounters as child and like it or see lolicon and child pornography, the more people who will push for pedosexuality and having sex with children to be made… LEGAL!

  • This really has me worried for this country as an artist. How far are we from arresting an artist on the spot if he draws a naked girl of questionable age, and telling them they’ve committed a crime?

    • You’re right, the ACLU really should have gotten involved. CBLDF were consultants but I guess their consultation was ignored by the lawyer who wouldn’t see the big picture.

      Risking a longer sentence is bad but also has a greater chance of redemption and getting a pardon if it is beaten later on. Maybe the government will pay a stipend to those who are unjustly imprisoned?

  • It’s really terrible that there’s such a statute that determines it’s legal by its literary or artistic “value.” That’s completely based on opinion, values change from person to person. If these comics were drawn by artists, published, and people are willing to buy them internationally, how can you say they have no artistic or literary value?

        • Wait.. Europe and loli manga? and guns??

          Canada now defacto bans the importation/sale of any manga or anime portraying sexual participation of under eighteens. Canada requires licensing/registration for even bolt action firearms, outlaws period pretty much any airgun more powerful than a Red Ryder toy BB gun, and makes it a felony(?) for an American hunter to drive with a locked unloaded firearm in the trunk through Canada to Alaska unless it is full checked in by the Canadian government.

          What freedom are you talkin about?

        • I find it funny that they don’t arrest and convict anyone who owns a Bible. There’s no pictures, but the explicit passages about incest, bestiality, murder, and rape should fill up a few nation-sized prisons in no time.

          Oh wait….. those are accepted as normal!

          >_<

        • No, not really. In Japan right to free expression is out there ahead of most, but rights to other stuff, less so. Forget most of Europe, most of them have loli laws of sorts to say nothing of gun and privacy laws that make me cringe. Canada, forget it. We may have a lot of retards, but we have enough people trying to keep the constitution from eroding too much to come out largely on top in this area.

          Remember, land of the free means you have a right to be pants-on-head retarded if you want. XD

          The main problem here was he did not fight it. If he had, he could have beat it on appeal, probably even in SCOTUS.

  • Guy had no hope to start with.

    The whole system is already infected with senseless moralism that punishes people for what they like or think, and not based on crimes they commited.

    The photographs x depictions would absolutely make no sense if people were being arrested because of crimes commited against real children.

    But this is not the case here. The law system is so distorted that now people can be judged and imprisoned for what they think, not for what they do.

    If the objective here was to stop criminals from harming children, and punish abusers, this guy wouldn’t even be in court. There’s absolutely no proof he represents a threat to society.

    It’s not about actions anymore, it’s about fitting society. You either like what everyone else does and finds acceptable, or you go to jail.

    We’re going back to darker times, period.

    Tons of laws being discussed right now are like that.
    Justice system is trying to control what people think, or punish people for what they supposedly “could” do, not rarely without even proof or scientific evidence.

    It’s about the same for lots of cases of “suspected terrorists”.
    People are getting paranoid about everything.

    The constitution, which was built to prevent such abuses, is being raped with all the new paranoid measures from the legal system.

    • Yep…. pedosexuality is being used as the new ‘boogie man’ in order to take away people’s rights, and too many people are too outraged over the thought of Johnny or Suzie getting doinked by someone (even another child) that they are willing to give up their rights.

      Stupid asses, is what they are…. I wouldn’t have given up on this, and maybe that’s why I haven’t had problems with this……. because I make NO bones about if this happened to me, I would fight it HARD and HARSH, and get those laws thrown out, not to mention that I have hundreds of people who KNOW that I am a pedosexual who would support me!

    • The dude didn’t just get 6 months, though. He also got some probation terms for 5 years. I’m pretty sure that involves monitoring whatever he’s doing on a computer, even after his term is over. So, it’s highly likely that he’ll never even be able to dl loli again without cops/FBI/whoever knowing immediately.

      • Just think of all the resources needed to monitor an individual 24/7 for even just 5 years, let alone his entire life. What a colossal waste of money over something this stupid. It’s no wonder the US has such problems with actual child predators running wild on the loose.

        • Actually, most ‘actual child predators’ are just people who have CONSENSUAL relationships with children.

          The few child rapists/murderers are created by the sexual morality laws in the United States, by driving pedosexuals CRAZY from lack of sexual contact with someone who they are sexually compatible with.

          Basically, society is blame for things like the death of the “Megan’s Law” girl when it comes down to it, not that they would EVER admit that.

  • “…where such depictions lack literary, artistic, political, or scientific value.”

    …so are they saying there are definitive distinctions between this and lolicon smut which possesses literary, artistic, political, and/or scientific value? I would really like to see the “legal” examples just to be sure because last I checked: artistic value is relative. There are some people that think adult characters in anime are minors (to be sure, I’m not talking about characters that were originally minors prior to localization) and there are those that think gore (not the politician) is beautiful; what value does the above criteria have then?

    See, I was under the impression that despite a notoriously imbalanced judicial system, we still had a few people in the supreme court who were smart enough to know when something infringed upon ones personal freedoms. Jack Thompson already tried to use the “correlation is causation” bullshit and didn’t win a single one of his cases with that in mind. Good game, America: you’ve effectively set a precedent in which anyone who lives their lives vicariously through FICTION is a threat to society at large.

    • BINGO! Hit the nail on the head. Really, even pedosexuals who are living their dreams IN REAL LIFE aren’t really dangerous from what I have seen.

      Most of them are the most MILQUETOAST of people imaginable, who are VERY obvious about what they are, to the point where the parents of the children they ‘abuse’ should be slapped for leaving them alone with the person in question.

  • If LO isn’t loli manga, but yaoi instead then all the Iowans are members of Sea Shepherd and I’m a whale.

    This is that so very famous American “liberty” it seems. All that words means that Americans can shoot each other at designated areas they call homes.

  • “…where such depictions lack literary, artistic, political, or scientific value.”

    …so are they saying there are definitive distinctions between this and lolicon smut which possesses literary, artistic, political, and/or scientific value? I would really like to see the “legal” examples just to be sure because last I checked: artistic value is relative. There are some people that think adult characters in anime are minors (to be sure, I’m not talking about characters that were originally minors prior to localization) and there are those think gore (not the politician) is beautiful; what value does the above criteria have then?

    See, I was under the impression that despite a notoriously imbalanced judicial system, we still had a few people in the supreme court who were smart enough to know when something infringed upon ones personal freedoms. Jack Thompson already tried to use the “correlation is causation” bullshit and didn’t win a single one of his cases with that in mind. Good game, America: you’ve effectively set a precedent in which anyone who lives their lives vicariously through FICTION is a threat to society at large.

  • Overall from my subjectivity I think this is retarded to me.But in America as well other parts of the world loli will remain no different than the real thing to the basis of psychology and if that is disproven people will still be uncomfortable with loli existing and the lolicon will remain the persecuted minority.Goes to shown that it only takes a society( a group of humans) who agree to make taboos based on their morels/ethics of what is right and wrong. Only a human can deem something as a crime and humans can also amend them with greater effort of course.

    • that’s democracy for you the majority always rulez… the only way to change this is to make everyone understand the difference of loli and CP but that will take forever

      i for one hate CP but find loli acceptable

      • Yeah, I don’t think so…. I download TONS of lolicon and haven’t had any problem, and when the FBI came to my door (because they had reports from some ASSHAT who I was having an argument with about the statutory rape, child sexual abuse, etc. laws that I was downloading CP), I showed them all my lolicon and was told, flatly, that it was L E G A L!

        They just asked me if I had any real-life pictures of nude kids with their legs spread or having sex, I said no…. OVER! It’s been 7 years now since that happened.

        • My guess is that if Anon’s story is true (which I have reservations about believing..) that the FBI agents may not have known about the use of obscenity (which needs a jury to say so before it’s actually illegal) or the PROTECT changes as they relate to it, so their saying it’s legal doesn’t mean it is.

        • Nope, because I have a relative who works for the FBI now, and he said that it is legal. I was talking with him about this case last night and he was DISGUSTED because the law was being applied incorrectly and stretched to the point of breaking to apply in this case.

        • the “it’s been 7 years now” bit is the important part.
          the law that people are being tried on was signed in in april 2003. so when the fbi came knocking on your door it WAS legal. if they had showed up a few months later you would probably be in prison.

        • It’s the truth, and I was kinda surprised….. the FBI guys did tell me that some asshats at the STATE level might try to get me in trouble, but to just make the same arguments I had made online and they would have to back down unless they wanted the laws they were relying on overturned.

        • Typically you only need to rewrite once. Once is enough unless you’re worried about some disc forensics experts looking at your disc. In my case the worst that can happen is someone get access to my computer but not the disc itself. It the controller reports all zeroes there is no way to get any data back.

        • Actually, Kanye, you can. Think of it as embossing over embossed letters. It’s possible to analyze the 1s and 0s on the platter both by the relative intensity of each expressed bit, and by using their own disk heads to read the edges of the bits, which may not line up exactly, leaving a trace impression from the last write. More realistically, they’d get this by reading, rereading, and rereading like crazy and analyzing the recoverable errors on each byte. This is why it’s common for a disk wiping utility to support a minumum of three passes overwriting your data.

        • The window of time for the reboot in this attack is a matter of seconds at room temperature. Cooling to -50 C can extend this to 10+ minutes, however, the cooling has to be done while the computer is still powered on or within the few seconds after it is powered off. This essentially means the attack is only viable if you obtain access to the computer while it is still powered on.

          See: http://citp.princeton.edu/pub/coldboot.pdf

        • If the disk is not damaged, you can recover from an SSD. In fact, if you have a crypto disk mounted and power off your PC, forensic technologists can boot with a boot disk within a certain window of time, and recover your password from RAM, then use it to mount your disc – that is, assuming that your police have such a person at their disposal, and that person is seriously on the ball and ready for this (which shouldn’t be that hard actually, since it would be a pretty common occurrence.)

          Also, http://www.xkcd.com/538/

        • This still doesn’t ensure the entire file is gone. It’s possible parts of the file may have been copied during it’s lifetime, for example, as a result of disk defragmentation. In such a case only the most recent copy will be destroyed.

          Additionally there could be data left over due to damaged segments of the hard drive being remapped by the hardware and becoming inaccessible. Any data in the damaged segments prior to the remapping will remain and cannot be destroyed by software.

          A safer alternative is to use full disk encryption with a strong encryption key. This ensures that nothing is written the the disk in an unencrypted form. If you want to ensure something is gone permanently then throw away the encryption key. Optionally you may also want to overwrite the encrypted data to make it even harder to recover.

        • Not good enough. Your Windows caches shit all over the HDD. Even if you shred the files, chances are there may still be stuff laying around somewhere very unintuitive.

          The only completely safe way to keep lolis around is with whole disk encryption and a really long and random password.

          Of course, nobody is actively searching for loli dlers so if you make sure your mom doesn’t accidentally find it, you’re safe.
          Now if you have kiddie porn, then you better hide it well enough to fool st. Peter himself. Then again, I’m actually rooting for the FBI when it comes to CP.

        • Better yet, use full disk encryption and never allow files onto your computer unencrypted. Also, if your seriously worried about people monitoring what you download then use Tor. It’s not perfect but it’s better than nothing in most cases.

    • Yes, if a naturally panicky person gets hooked up to one, the damn things can easily detect “lies” that aren’t really there. This is why most nations won’t accept them as evidence.

      Except for ass-backward ones, like the USA…

      • Copy paste:
        I was convicted (plea bargained actually) on a false rape claim.

        I am a registered sex offender until some time in Oct. of 2011 when I can move to a different state and apply to get off the list.

        Funny thing is, despite the fact that the girl and I went to eat afterwords, at a sit down restaurant, it still didn’t click in to the police that something may be awry. I was the male and the male is always guilty until proven innocent.

        The polygraph test I did was bullshit too. As has been said above, they have been debunked. In my case, I told the exact truth, but was so stressed out from the entire thing that the polygraph came back saying negative. I later found out, in jail, that to pass one you need to get yourself drugged up on Valium or some other relaxant. So, yes, polygraphs are total bull that shouldn’t be used, ever, on anybody. They should be banned entirely. They only measure how uncomfortable you are with talking about a topic, not if you’re lying or not.

        I really find a lot more hope in reading your articles. It seems like I’m not the only one in the world who has been, in itself, raped of my honor (or however you would call it). The bad thing is, because I’m male, nobody cares to even see it that way. Most people, especially women, see it as “registered sex offender, EWW EWW EWW EWW”. *sigh*

        Also copy paste 2:
        Perhaps the principal reason innocent men accused of rape are not viewed as “victims” in the same sense that, for example, women who really were raped are viewed as “victims” is because of purported past injustices to women. Innocent white men, especially, are not viewed as a class deserving of sympathy or special protection, and when a false rape claim destroys the life of an innocent white man — let us be honest — some members on the extreme left react with glee and view it as a sort of twisted payback, or at the very least, necessary collateral damage to right perceived wrongs.

        Two heinous examples of this:

        From Newsweek, May 1, 2006, in a story about the alleged rape of a black woman (her name is Crystal Gail Mangum — even though some newspapers still refuse to print it) by three Duke lacrosse players, the following appears:

        “Across town, at NCCU [North Carolina Central University], the mostly black college where the alleged victim is enrolled, students seemed bitterly resigned to the players’ beating the rap. . . . Chan Hall, 22, said . . . he wanted to see the Duke students prosecuted “whether it happened or not. It would be justice for things that happened in the past.”

        (Emphasis added.)

        You see, for people like Mr. Hall, unfair stereotyping is only wrong when it’s directed at people who happen to look like him.

        It is no exaggeration to assert that when the three young lacrosse players were declared “innocent” (not just “not guilty”) by the state’s attorney general, many extreme members of the blogosphere — advocates of both African Americans’ and women’s rights — were not happy. It is not a stretch to assume they would have been happier if, in fact, Crystal Gail Mangum had actually been raped. Think about that last sentence. They would have preferred that Ms. Mangum was actually raped so that the accused white “boys” could be prosecuted. And that might be the single most twisted point about the entire tragic Duke lacrosse affair.

        But Mr. Chan Hall, quoted above, had better be careful: there are loonies galore on the far left who would have no hesitation about wanting to see him convicted as a rapist, innocent or not — not because he’s black (presumably) but because he’s male.

        To some radical feminists, it wouldn’t matter if the falsely accused male is white or black — all that matters is that he’s male, and, thus, payback is appropriate. On one radical feminist blog, the hostess proposed to make all heterosexual sex criminal if the woman decided, even retroactively, that it was rape. One especially vile commentator to this horrid proposal chimed in: “I think the central point that the dudes ‘don’t get’ is that the majority of [advocates of this bizarre proposal] genuinely don’t care if [the] proposal is ‘not fair’ to the hypothetical falsely accused rapist of the post-revolution future.”

        No commentary is necessary to underscore both the evil and inanity at work here, where innocent men and boys accused of rape are deemed acceptable collateral damage in some twisted war on the “patriarchy.” I am not linking to this vile site because it is replete with lies and hate speech directed at males. The smarmy and sarcastic hostess obviously hates anything male and is — with all due respect — an idiot. The commentator who made the comment quoted above is just plain evil, but at least she’s up front with her bigotry. Most radical feminists are not so forthcoming. They hide behind the lie that false rape claims are a “myth.” To them, innocent men and boys accused of rape are not being prosecuted or persecuted — because there are no innocent men or boys accused of rape.

      • Wrong ordinary people often will give false positives because they are nervous.
        The detector’s output is usually interpreted by some asshole who could not even cut it as a shrink or vet or he’d be doing that for a living because it pays more.

      • Sure they can. All they have to do is simply understand how the things work.

        Polygraphs just measure changes in your tension levels. If, when it comes time for you to lie, you stress out because you think the machine is going to be able to tell you’re not telling the truth, that’s how it detects your “lie” (or rather, your sudden increase in tension). As long as you know that all you have to do to beat the machine is to just stay calm, almost anyone can lie right through it.

        Be aware that part of the normal procedure for interrogators using these things is to first feed you some bullshit along the lines of “Oh, this a new, cutting edge model that can detect even the slightest change in you, don’t even THINK you can fool it!”

        Don’t buy it for a second.

    • loli manga is exactly what you think it is–IT’S MANGA WITH LOLIS.

      manga is a form of the press. in the United States we have freedom of the press guaranteed in the first amendment.taking manga away and giving a sentence because it counts as possession of child porn would be unconstitutional and unjust.

      essentially, this judge singlehandedly drove the American justice system back to 1918 when the Espionage and Sedition Acts were putting anyone in jail who even thought of saying anything negative about America.

      maybe its even been pushed back since before America even had a Constitution. congratulations, idiotic judge; I now apparently live in a colony.

      • Yes you have the right to print the material, but that doesn’t mean its not obscene. Guy knew it was not appropriate material.

        The reason he was caught was because a customs inspector went through his mail and “read” the books. I find that more disturbing than the case itself. If its not drugs or hazardous material that can easily be sniffed out by dogs or what not move it along.

        About the Espionage Act of 1917 and the Sedition Act of 1918, those were headed by Woodrow Wilson. One BIG BIG progressive S.O.B. who didn’t believe in our constitution and wanted government control over the people.

        Comparing the judge to that is a bit much.

        To sum it up, you can print, buy all the loli-sex manga you want, but that doesn’t mean its not obscene material.

        • “…you don’t burn the forest down to catch a few damn wolves.”

          You’re right. In America you “black out the sky” with B52s and napalm the entire forest (and maybe even a few hundred square miles outside it).

          That’ll teach those S.O.B wolves.

          lehnerus2000

        • Following that line of thinking, wouldn’t any pornography in publication count as “obscene”? I definitely don’t like it when they (the courts, prosecutors, etc) start loosely calling anything they don’t LIKE “obscene”. Hell, violence falls under that definition -a lot- in the U.S. (not to beat a dead horse), but you will never see someone being prosecuted over owning it.

          I’m sorry, but people crying “drawn/fictional depiction of an illegal act” is just silly. I don’t care what they say loli manga inspires people to do, you don’t burn the forest down to catch a few damn wolves.

      • Uhh…freedom of the press relates to publishing, televising, blogging, etc..

        The judge didn’t say this guy couldn’t publish loli manga (or that the publisher couldn’t…not like a US judge has any power over a foreign publisher anyway,) the judge said he couldn’t own such loli manga, or have it mailed through whoever was shipping it…which still sounds like a violation of freedom of expression

        All said, this still doesn’t sit right with me. If there was legitimate concern that this guy might be/become a sex offender then I could see the prosecution’s point more…but since I don’t think this is the case I find it hard to agree with this being criminal in any way (who has time to read all the investigation reports and court proceedings anyway?)

        • Actually, freedom of the press also equates to being able to view, draw, etc. anything you wish to, as long as you are not forcing (and even in child pornography, the definition of ‘forcing’ is being stretched’) someone else to view it.

      • *cough* Sorry mate, are you seriously attempting to argue with a straight face that free speech gives you a constitutional right to own child porn? (Whether loli manga actually counts as child porn isn’t the issue here, you SAID “giving a sentence because it counts as possession of child porn would be unconstitutional and unjust”.) And did you really attempt to claim that “manga is a form of the press”? Dude, regardless of the justice or injustice of this guy’s sentence, you just said something PHENOMENALLY stupid! Free speech is not infinite.

        I think this guy was very lucky to get off so lightly.

        • Last Anonymous realizes the point of this…. it is just someone else saying that you are ‘abnormal’, which raises the idea of…. what is ‘normal’?

          It’s time to get off the ‘normal by societies standards’ and realize that society LIES A FUCKLOAD ABOUT WHAT IS NORMAL TO THEM!

        • “And frankly, pedosexuals are only looked down upon because of the lies that feminists, psychologists (who earn money by treating child sexual abuse ‘victims’ who aren’t really victims) and police (who also make money off this!) are telling on a daily basis.”
          I love being told I’m, “mentally ill”, it’s just such a pleasant label. When children are attracted to one another, that’s “normal” enough, but what, at some age you’re just supposed to “grow out” of it? Well, sorry I didn’t grow up to properly enjoy over-sized silicone filled tits like I’m naturally supposed to.

        • don’t forget false rape accusation society anon,though some of people are starting to realize about this that one shouldn’t just believe words,but still not enough.But hey what should i think of people when they get ready to lynch anyone who is suspicious looking in their neighbourhood,just becouse a girl said she was raped and later she says she lied or did they find out she lied.Anyway society needs looking for more proof and less word believing.
          Been reading about many stuff about feminism and such false rape accusations.

        • Free speech is infinite. And frankly, pedosexuals are only looked down upon because of the lies that feminists, psychologists (who earn money by treating child sexual abuse ‘victims’ who aren’t really victims) and police (who also make money off this!) are telling on a daily basis.

          Some of them are the SAME lies that were told about homosexuals 30 years ago.

      • You are forgetting something. The key word “kiddie porn” makes all people in the US and EU turn off their brains and join the lynch mob.

        Humans are naturally faulty and the majority of people are way too scared to question what society considers “the norm”.
        Heidegger calls this “das Man”.

        • I don’t think the “norm” is the problem. The problem is just as you said ” people in the US, and EU, turn off their brains and join the lynch mob”.

          Noone ever goes “well it’s weird, but it IS just a drawing on paper”. The minute you start telling people what they can write/draw/paint, free speech becomes a joke.

      • Thinking what is okay? Owning lolimanga? Explain to me why you think that pictures and literature in the form of a comic can make you into a monster that preys on the rest of the world? Really, go ahead. I would love to hear your answer.
        If you would have read his post right, he said we should be prosecuting people who go after REAL LIVE CHILDREN.
        What the fuck is your problem? Were you not raised right? If you look at lolimanga and turn into a pedo, you were already one to begin with.

    • USA law is most ridiculous in the world.

      No one would care in TURKEY if you own loli manga, cause its art or something, but dont dare to offend ATATURK that puts you in Jail.

      And this man is not a criminal for owning mangas,
      WESTERN countries should behead the real SEX CHILD RAPER Fucktards which go out of Jail in Germany where i live.Citizens are going mad about that such people run free in the country and most of them repeat their crimes !
      Also with the FRITZl-MF from Austria who raped and imprisoned his own daughters.

      Where is the logic about it?

      • Hey, here’s an idea. Let’s get rid of the “If I were him” crap. Why don’t you go get some lolicon manga, surrender to the police, and let us all see how you fight the case to the “highest levels”?

        Oh wait, you have no balls to do that? Yeah, thought so.

        • Anonymous 1 reponding to Anonymous hits the nail on the head.

          The guy was STUPID when he had the CBLDF on his side to make a plea bargain in this case….. and the ACLU would have gotten involved on this if he had asked.

          I’ve talked with people who belong to the local ACLU, and they are getting tired of the whole pedosexual hate in the first place, because they have relatives who are that and are getting tired of having them discriminated against like the homosexuals were at one point.

        • except that the stupid faggot got railroaded and just took it at face value, he had the support of the CBLDF , and probably could have got ACLU on board for his case, but he just bent over and took it

      • The plead bargain might have been his best option. If you were in his shoes, how do you afford your legal defense against the government, which has virtually limitless resources and power. And then you would have to put up the constant harassment they throw at you. If you lose your appeal, you won’t get a lenient sentence and they are gonna lock you up for a very long time. It sucks to be him but he really didn’t have a choice there but to bend over.

        • Actually, someone could do a ‘friend of the court’ deal saying that the guy was scared shitless by the courts and therefore, wasn’t in his right mind at the time of the plea….. then, he gets to appeal if they can prove that…. hell, I would buy them if I was the court or appellate court.