Shotacon Twins Jailed “Manga Victimises Children”

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Two twins who downloaded a variety of shotacon materials have been jailed for possessing “virtual child pornography,” with the judge condemning them for “victimising” imaginary children.

The men, both 20 and residents of the Canadian province of Nova Scotia, were reported to police by a sister-in-law after she came accross “distressing” images on their computer.

Police searches soon found a substantial collection of shotacon material on their computers, saying 90% were “cartoon drawings called Japanese Anime.”

The pair, one of whom is said to be an active homosexual, were subsequently charged with possession of child pornography, both for the minority of real images and their manga collection, which under Canadian law is considered “virtual child pornography.”

The state prosecutor insists that victimising fictional children is a very serious offence:

“Every one of these images involves the victimization of children. The victimization wouldn’t happen in the first place if there weren’t people there to look at this material.”

The judge was equally scathing, saying the drawings “victimize” children:

“This is a crime that victimizes young people around the world. It creates a market which then re-victimizes the most vulnerable in society.

The images can only be regarded as disgusting and perverse.”

The judge handed down a three month prison sentence for each of the twins, ordering they be registered as sex offenders, provide DNA samples and refrain from contact with children, presumably including imaginary ones as well. A sex offenders’ treatment programme will attempt to cure them of their deviant lusts.

In a final twist to the case, the court accepted arguments that the pair, having been branded pederasts for the rest of their lives, would likely be in danger if housed amongst the general prison population. As a result they get to serve their sentence only on weekends, and in protective custody.

Although drawn imagery depicting underage sexual activity is constitutionally protected free speech in the USA, and has been upheld as such despite a variety of efforts to ban it, Canada possesses no such checks to the power of legislators, and consequently draconian laws against “virtual child pornography” are freely enforced.

Via ngnews.ca.

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380 Comments

    • Tbh, I think it was the last 10% that actually mattered. The prosecution is required by law to make a case, as in come up with every shit possible. And the fact they only received 3 month means that this is really a minor offense. They probably just pissed off the cops or judge somehow.

  • This makes me feel ashamed to be living in Canada… talk about over reacting. Seems like they’re making a bigger deal out of the manga/anime materials than the live-action stuff…

    I personally don’t like the whole loli trend going on these days, but if people wanna view loli stuff I say be my guest, so long as you don’t go around raping children.

    • Now that u mentioned it, my pvp kills are in the hundred thousands. And I tbaged about ten thousandish. Does that make me a potential necrophilic murderer? Oh shit better take a road trip to mexico

  • Oh my God, seriously? Tell me, just tell me, how am I victimizing a piece of artwork? “Oh God, the artwork, it’s feeling so bad because I’m fapping to it! HEY WAIT, I THINK SOMETHING MIGHT NOT BE RIGHT WITH THIS WHOLE CONCEPT.”

  • Just wanted to make a note that “virtual child pornography” is not entirely legal in the US. It is considered “obscenity” and is illegal to buy, sell, or disseminate it but is legal when kept inside one’s home.

    • FPSやらTPSだって散々バッシングされてるじゃない。
      EAとかドイツから出て行くハメになりそうなのに。
      何かを先に取り締まった所でエロが許容されるかと言えばそうでもないだろ。

      I’m sorry for talking in Japanese.

  • In the animated cartoon of “Ikkyu-san” of Japan, such a gag is.
    A nasty adult said, “It embarrassed because the tiger in the picture raged and root it out, please”.
    The hero”The tiger is rooted out, and put it out from the picture, please. ”

    First of all, please take out the character from two dimensions if you give human rights to the character of the game and the animated cartoon.
    Capturing the character to which sex or it is raped that the police are these boys on that decides it beforehand.
    It is appropriate that the image above captures this character due to the risque thing exhibition crime only because this character suddenly takes it off.

    It is assumed that the woman began to take it off by the reality on the road, and for instance, all members who saw it do not become the rape criminals and it means the denial or neither refusal nor the pain though it is shouted at sex, “Ah.. Oh My God Noooo”.

    The judge should step on the procedure of things more.

  • Yet another scary example of the direction we’re going in.

    We could have had a better choice of pic though, what’s with the hot nurse? Should have been some shota yaoi twincest or something, like some Ouran doujinshi or something. Appeal to the fangirls guyz.

  • Bet the government/soccer mom protestors, wouldn’t have any problems with us killing “virtual victims” if the virtual victims were homos. Remember kids, Jesus only hates two things. Violent video games, and sodomy.
    lmao

  • Since Sankaku Complex obviously weren’t telling the truth, the resulting reactions from the international anime subcultural online community are irrational and therefore, truthful only to the entire online community themselves nonetheless.

    It started with some false claims made by a blog article due to lack of online journalism ethics, which then triggered waves of dishonest, slanderous, almost borderline hateful reactions from an online community. Personally, I see them either as a bunch of immature and childish sore losers, or worst. For they could be fully matured by they meant what they said, and therefore they’re a bunch individuals with a personality trade called schizotypy. And they’re obviously not the creative type of schizoids.

  • wth, how dare someone hurt a imaginary kid,they should be ashamed…
    “Every one of these images involves the victimization of children. The victimization wouldn’t happen in the first place if there weren’t people there to look at this material.”
    this quote doesn’t make any sense, kids have been victimized long before shotacon and will continue to be even without it.

  • I notice one thing. There is a lot that doesn’t fit with this article, and the source of information.

    Why the misinformation Sankaku Complex?

    This article gives, in my opinion, a rather one-sided view of the case, with false claims on what happened even.

    Oh well, all for the hatred of those that don’t share the same interests, eh? -_-

  • Oh Canada we don’t believe in logic because our brains are frozen solid.

    Really 3 months for comics that’s even gayer then shotacon pun intended.

    Lets see court fees for prosecuting this maybe around 20K to 100K

    Keeping those two locked up for 3 months maybe $100 min a day each x 90 days or $18,000 USD whats that in loonies?
    Since Canadian Jails are just like US jails cost should be the same.
    Also assuming Canada has the same rules for hazard pay for prison guards as the US it is a hazardous job.
    This stunt to placate dumb old Christian women cost the Canadian tax payer at least $28,000 USD.
    That could have gotten several people a real doctor vs one of those candy stripers.
    The prosecutor and the ass who made the original arrest should be jailed for misappropriations of tax dollars and wrongful arrest.

    BTW people worried about safety this will make you less safe.
    Often when someone is arrested for a victimless crime a real criminal often has to be released to make room for this person.
    Prisons are not a magic bag of holding and Geneva conventions require no more then two per cell.

  • Really it is fantastically stupid to jail someone over this personally I don’t give a fuck what you fap to so long as you don’t go around raping real people.

    If anything it’s pissing away tax dollars as said person is harmless but guess what moral fags it’s going to cost $31,000 USD a year to keep them locked in prison.
    That 31K could send someone to college for a year yes surprisingly college is cheaper then jail.
    The same amount of money could feed 10 poor people for a year, or buy 64 primary school kids new text books.

    This also is enough to hire an extra cop or teacher for communities that are short.

    But they’d rather piss money away on their crusade against anything they find immoral vs helping people in real life.

  • “The state prosecutor insists that victimizing fictional children is a very serious offense:”

    I facepalmed hard….

    Though it did say they had REAL shota porn in their possession too so yeah they should goto jail for that. But come on Canada, you use to be so cool.

  • Looks like people have already gone hyper-reactionary on this one.

    The article presented here is not quite the full story. In a more comprehensive version of this same story that I read on another Web site, one of the twins specifically admitted to being “attracted to 12 year old boys.” In this day and age, that in of itself is a concern.

    Also, let’s not lose sight of the fact that, despite the emphasis on how much of the collection was anime/manga-based, there were still some live-action videos of sexual assaults on 12 (or younger!) year-old boys involved. You can say what you want about whether or not the manga/anime versions should be criminal, but the live-action stuff should NOT be tolerated. Farnkly, I think the twins got off easy.

  • One of the reasons I’m glad I live in Russia is because there’s no fucking bullshit laws like this. Well, there’s not much laws generally, lol, but duh. You can pirate any software you like, even right from the developers under your windows, you can download as much child porn as you want and you can even give a gay blowjob on the crowded street. No one cares really.

      • “I think the general idea is that if it gets spread, it will become (over time) generally accepted to look at real children that way.”

        That makes sense. Just like watching war movies turns people into killers and watching movies about bank robberies turns people into thieves, seeing some cartoon porn could easily turn people into child rapists. I don’t know why some people can’t see the very clear relationship here. Censorship – making crime impossible since…?

  • Fuck countries and people that can’t tell the difference between fantasy and reality.

    By that logic that judge should be jailed, because he has seem a fictional murder, and is obviously going to murder someone because of it.

  • 😕

    I’m actually the boyfriend of David, and I’d like to set some things straight here, okay?

    David looked at shota at one point on Forosdz.com, merely because he came across it. (This case started before they separated the shota in to its own sub-forum.) He never downloaded it, nor the real kiddy porn. His twin admitted to everything being his.

    David was questioned in the police station without a lawyer, after asking three times for one. He was denied each time, with legal aid saying “you won’t need one”, while it turned out that they just didn’t have one available, which is complete bullshit.

    Then, both of them entered a guilty plea, which was suppose to get David a sentence of the 14 days. After court yesterday, he found out that they changed it to 90 days (or 60 with good behavior).

    Is the Crown allowed to change it like that? His lawyer told him it would be 14 days if he pleaded guilty. If he pleaded innocent and got proven guilty, it would have been 90 days, he said.

    After all that happened, what was the point of putting in the plea, instead of taking our chances?

    On a final note, I’d like to remind you that you can not always believe everything you hear from the media.

    There are people’s lives at stake. I live in the US, and I was banking on him sponsoring me to become a permanent resident. Now I will need to find a job offer, and even then, it’ll suck for us to find a place we can live.

    • Were the questionings taped?

      If so, then that might be a reason as well for an appeal (next to the whole judge being prejudiced thing). He requested a barrister and was denied one, I do think that would be a violation of due process as well.

      Keep in mind though that appealing such things tend to set bad blood, even if you are in the right.

  • I’m over 18 but have an almost completely flat chest…does that mean I can’t become a pr0n star because the mere image of my young looking body would victimise all the damn 14 year olds who have breasts bigger than mine?

  • “…cartoon drawings called Japanese Anime.”
    Ah correction. That’s, I believe, what we call MANGA. Animu is ANIMATED drawings.

    Also, I may not now the full circumstances, but some actual “real” shota material was found right? The way you’re wording it sounds like they were incarcerated just for simple possession of images of shota hentai.

    …By the way, is there even anime centered around the shota hentai fetish?

  • people, lets not forget that “most” were manga, they apparently had “real” pictures of underage people, and that will get you jail time cuz they are actually “real” as it should be.

    …. Blame Canada!!!

  • If simple possession is a crime, then here’s an idea:

    send loli/shotacon to the email address of all politicians and pro-censorship folks. Use multiple email addresses. Attach as attachments in some, and hotlink in others. You’ll need to disguise the sender address, but I’m sure some of you know how (it’s fairly easy).

    What will end up happening is that all politicians, etc. will have “virtual child pornography” in their email boxes. If they use any common email management program, like Outlook, the emails will often be downloaded automatically to their computers. And so, the virtual CP would be present in their email and on their PCs.

    A further option is to print out and mail the virtual CP with a bunk return address; or maybe use a different politician’s address. Something like that. You could even include fake cover letters, like “As per your request, see the enclosed images. Have fun!” Something like that.

    Then call the cops and report them.

  • Wizard’s First Rule.

    “People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. Because people are stupid, they will believe a lie because they want to believe it’s true, or because they are afraid it might be true. People’s heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true. People are stupid; they can only rarely tell the difference between a lie and the truth, and yet they are confident they can, and so are all the easier to fool.”

  • Not surprising considering Canada has a history in cracking down on drawn salacious illustrations of minors. Then again the two were had actual ‘CP’ in their possession so they more than well deserved it. However, there have been past cases where individuals were jailed and/or fined for having only “imaginary children

    You would be extremely lucky to get away with importing manga, doujinshi or art books from Japan. If any contains any type of drawing appealing to prurient interests, Canadian Customs considers it obscene and its seized as contraband.

  • A serial rapist and a serial rapist who happens to be a pedophile in my eyes are the same (The pedophile is less of a threat, since his target is easier). They’re both RAPISTS and killers.

    That said though, a pedophile isn’t a serial rapist until he/she actually commits the crime. A pedophile is just a person who happens to be sexually attracted to kids. Are they irrational amoral monsters? Probably not. Their sexual preference is just that. A preference. No more. No less. It doesn’t detract from them as a human being. Compare it to homosexuality if you will. A homosexual isn’t any stupider amoral or senseless than your ordinary heterosexual.

    That said preemptively accusing people of being potential offenders based on what they choose to fap to or do in their recreational time is retarded. Branding people as pedophiles because they are ‘POTENTIALLY’ a threat to kids is retarded. I mean, are they so inhuman that they don’t even have the right to hide their sexual orientation? If they don’t have the intent to hurt anyone, then I don’t see the problem. It might just be a phase. Who knows. All I know is that this pedophillia thing is overblown.

  • WTF, That is BULLSHIT.

    My twin and I have lots of loli material.
    “Sexfriend” for example.

    And I believe is my right to have them.

    Whot he fuck came with the idea that manga vicitmises non-exisitng children?
    Do they even realsie how stupid that sounds?

  • Just like if you see a cartoon that is violent, it will turn you into a slobbering, raping monster with tentacles and your soul be will sold to the demons. Seriously. Saw that cartoon once, so I know it MUST REALLY HAPPEN.

    At least it does in Canada.

    • One question. On average, how many times do you level up your stupidity a day?

      As many others have pointed out, does the word ‘virtual’ or ‘imaginary’ get into your head? Talking about rights of fictional characters is plain dumb.

      It would be as if I drew a picture of a cat or a dog, tore it up, or poked holes in it, and get jailed for animal abuse. WHAT THE FUCK?

    • So.., does Canada also prosecute and punish those who slaughter virtual people in – gee, I dunno – HUNDREDS of video games?

      If masturbating to drawn pictures of little boys makes them sex offenders, then I guess I should be held in prison for several consecutive life sentences based on all the shit I did in any one game alone.

      The real pictures? Sure, they should be punished for that. I don’t argue with that judgment. However, to say fictional characters need to be given the same rights and protections as real people? That’s just fucking ridiculous and down-right moronic.

    • Ignorance is high in this one.

      I surely hope you support the extermination of violence in fiction too. Or are you that blind to your own hypocrisy? Better start crusading against GTA, Manhunt, Saw, Antichrist and all other media filled with gory goodness!

      So what’s your justification to banning it? There is a reason why media is only banned if it causes harm. If you can’t prove it or you’re going to just throw a strawman arguement, then shut up and stop the witch hunting to make yourself feel superior. You’d feel right at home in the middle ages wouldn’t you?

      • “There is a reason why media is only banned if it causes harm.”

        You have surrendered the argument to the pro-censorship crowd right there. Media NEVER causes harm, people do. Media doesn’t commit crimes or acts of violence, people do. Media isn’t responsible for people’s behavior, people themselves are.

        • There’s a big difference between “media causes harm” and “production of media causes harm”. For instance, lots of harm is done during a war, but watching war footage doesn’t do any harm. What I’m saying is that the pro-censorship people want to tell you that the media *itself* is damaging for people to see and that’s why it should be banned. Once you accept the false premise that simply *viewing* media can be harmful, then you’ve already ceded the argument to them. That’s my point.

          As for what you said about “In the context of law ’cause harm’ in regards to media includes during the production or making” the judge in this case takes a very broad view of what it means to cause harm in the production of media. From the article:

          “The images creates a market, whether anime or live images, and victimizes the people that are most vulnerable,” said Tax.”

          According to the judge, simply creating such pictures “creates a market for them” and in so doing victimizes children. I have no idea how that’s supposed to work unless you’re going to assume that simply seeing the images turns people into child rapists. You basically have to assume that the media itself causes harm to be seen or viewed, which goes right back to my original point that media itself can never be damaging. The judge seems to be presuming that the media itself (not just its production) is damaging to those who see it and that this is why it should be banned. Once you accept the faulty premise that media is damaging, only then you can get nonsense like what the judge is saying.

        • Sorry but you misunderstand. In the context of law ’cause harm’ in regards to media includes during the production or making i.e. actual rape, actual torture, murder or child molestation.

          Maybe I should have been more specific and mentioned ‘…only banned if there is harm involved during the production of said media’.

      • “So what’s your justification to banning it? There is a reason why media is only banned if it causes harm.”

        Accepting this premise is what allows the pro-censorship crowd to get off the ground in the first place. Some ideas *are* dangerous in principle and, if followed though on, will lead people to do dangerous things. Using the ’causes harm’ argument, you could then say that any expression of such ideas should be banned. It’s not hard to conjure up scenarios in which nearly any idea can be construed to be harmful in some way or another if acted on. Thus, once you’ve accepted this premise, nearly any idea is open to banishment. Real freedom of expression turns this notion of ‘harmful ideas’ on its head and says “Yes, ideas can inspire people to do dangerous things – and this is precisely why ideas must be protected.”

        If you believe in freedom of expression then you won’t accept a correlation between the expression of a given idea with harmful activity as sufficient for banning expression of the idea. Instead, you’ll say that the responsibility for the harm lies with the person who committed the act, and not with the idea or its expression. This is because the *person* is responsible for their behavior – and not the idea. It is the *person* who must accept the responsibility and the punishment for what they have done. Ideas themselves can never be blamed for what people choose to do.

        There are some, however, who would choose to blame ideas for people’s choices rather than hold people responsible for their own behavior. These people want to destroy and restrict ideas in the name of ‘protecting’ society. As has already been stated, ideas aren’t responsible for committing crimes. An idea can’t rape, murder, or steal – only a person can do this. In trying to attack ideas, the would-be censors forget this fact. In so doing, the efforts of the censors fail to combat the actual wrong doing that can only be committed by actual people, and instead simply try to make enemies out of words or even our minds. This doesn’t make us more safe, it simply makes us less free.

        This is why freedom of expression needs to be protected – even (and especially) when the ideas being expressed seem dangerous – because attacking the expression of ideas cannot make us safer, it can only diminish our freedom.

    • That’s right! We need our government to put a stop to people who are displaying dangerous or antisocial tendencies as soon as they’re brought to light. Today these people are looking at naked cartoons, tomorrow they’re out raping children. The same thing goes for violent video games – they’re just murder simulators that train kids to kill. Violent and sexual movies and books are the same way – they just desensitize society to criminality and bad behavior. Also, there have to be restrictions on people promoting hateful or extreme political views as well. Such people only stir up hatred and cause violence. Don’t give me any nonsense about ‘freedom of expression’ to justify any of this. Freedom of expression my ass.

      Freedom of expression has limits. You don’t have the freedom to turn yourself into a psychopath or to incite others to become such. For the good of public morals, society has an interest in censoring what sorts of things are allowed to be seen and said. Not all ideas are OK to express or to even think – and it’s up to government to determine which side of acceptability a given idea falls under. If your views or interests lay outside of what the government has deemed as acceptable, then what you need isn’t more ‘freedom of expression.’ Rather, what you need is time in a mental hospital or a prison until you get your mind right and can conform to what society expects of you. Civilized human beings don’t need the ‘freedom’ to deviate from good morals and public order in either thought or deed – only sociopaths want that.

      • Excuse me, but the word freedom itself implies ZERO LIMITS.

        Besides, did you honestly think that violent games and such are actually effective in “training” kids to kill or commit crimes? You think killing is something anyone can do? Bullshit. Just so you know, one reason why nobody wants to fight a war now, is ‘cos half the world’s army is impotent. No matter how well equipped, at least half of them would be puking by their 3rd kill.

        Your point on antisocial… Well, who cares if someone doesn’t want to be part of the normal society? It doesn’t harm others.

        If games are murder simulators, what about movies? Novels? All the various genres? Gore? Nudity? War? Crime? Sex? Aren’t these all “stimulating” people to strip others, fuck them, rip out their guts, and stuff them with a grenade before selling them as an art piece?

        Somehow, I get the feeling that, you’re just another feminist pig from Equality Now aren’t you?

    • yeah!! ignore the real crimes of our society! sex offenders should be freed! people who’re fond of reading doujin and other materials should be put to jail and convicted of crimes against humanity!

    • Yes, let’s protect two-dimensional young boys and girls. Let’s ignore the actual human-trafficking of women and children. In fact, screw real children. 2D ‘people’ should have more rights than real humans.

  • Though I don’t like loli/shota, this is pretty stupid. :/
    Why a sentence at all if they’re only gonn’a have to serve weekends and for so little? Or register as sex offenders, since there’s no molestation or anything?
    Silly Canadians.

  • HAY FAGS, LRN2READ.

    >>The pair, one of whom is said to be an active homosexual, were subsequently charged with possession of child pornography, both for the minority of real images and their manga collection, which under Canadian law is considered “virtual child pornography.”

    They ALSO had REAL kiddy porn. And they were reported ‘after their sister-in-law saw some “distressing” images of children “as young as two years of age”’.

    In other news today, some fucking retard let his nosy bitch of a sister-in-law poke around their computer full of kiddy porn..

  • Rule No 1: Remain an Anon
    lol but on the serious side how did these kids obtain these images, looks like they are not being supervised on what they are doing.

    if we can get arrested for virtual images that are not real we all better wipe our drives now because those kids had images some one else could have much worse wounder what they will get for video image or no real characters?

  • Kazumakaname says:

    I believe we should bring light of the massacre of civilian orcs in warcraft 3.

    Hundreds and hundreds of orc civilians are murdered every few minutes on blizzards servers.

    This modern day high tech genocide cannot continue.

    Are you against prosecution of the mass murderers because the victims are green?

    You rascist motherf!cker!

    Yes I know Sudan is important. But Orcs are humanoid too!

    • Canada that would be the Royal Canadian Mounties and no they can’t swim to there nor would enjoy the heat.
      Besides Canadians are psychrophiles or cryophiles like ice fairies,yuki-onna,penguins,polar bears and yeti they tend to avoid tropical climates like the Philippines.

  • Does this mean that the images, paintings, and sculptures of naked children found in the museums and libraries can be also penalized in Canada???

    WHAT THE HELL? Don’t they have common sense??? Applying human laws to fictional characters is ridiculous.

    Aren’t they familiar with western comics? They also contain porn, drugs, violence, etc… yeah, freedom of expression.

    • Yes, that is exactly what it means.

      The government, however, enjoys cracking down on those society considers deviant. It makes them look as though they actually have a use.

      …I kind of want to move to the States now, actually.

  • They are fictional characters, “FICTIONAL CHARACTERS”. Is any of this getting through to them? What happened to helping real children? Or are they so removed from reality that they are seeing cartoon characters every time they see a kid?

      • If you omitted the first line I would have taken you seriously. >_> Yes they did have real children on their computer,but most of what the prosecution used for their case was fictional characters(90% of the evidence was this). I would think very differently about the case if they didn’t base most of the case on fictional characters as evidence(hence my reaction).

        And yes they do deserve punishment for having pictures of real children(should they be pornographic in nature) but that really is the only evidence that deserves attention in a case like this.

  • OH GOD!!! that means I am a mass murderer. I have killed millions of virtual people in games like civilization, the sims, prototype, half-life, etc !!!

    seriously we should “eliminate” this kind of people that can’t distinguish real from fiction.

  • I don’t see the logic or sense in IMAGINARY Character rights! They AREN’T REAL, therefore CANNOT be victimized.

    If they take that route, they should ban ANY Cartoon since most have killing and other violence bestowed onto the characters. Next, Looney Tunes will be become a violation of Virtual animal rights!

    BAKA!!!!!

  • I’m fairly certain the current legislation is ripe for challenging, there isn’t any precedent in the case of virtual images. Everyone charged under the bill has simply pleaded guilty, there’s been no real test of the law. As long as these people have real images on their computer, its probably impossible for them to argue that real porn and virtual porn are different when they collect both. If they have real porn, they only lose out by trying to fight it because they’ll still be convicted under the law, there’s no benefit. Having real porn in this case also jeopardizes an appeal process cause it gives you a lot fewer arguments to use.

    • AmericanOtaku83 says:

      Hey, that’s my line, anon. But if there was REAL child porn on their computer, then yeah, they deserve to go to jail.

      But on the other hand, the judge saying drawings of fictional characters victimizes children is as about retarded as PETA boycotting NBC saying that their logo victimizes peacocks. Then again, since nobody watches NBC anymore, the boycott would be pointless.

      It also didn’t help us anime fans by generalizing anime as porn. Especially considering 99% of all anime characters are under 18, Canada might end up banning anime and manga altogether and people like Scott McNeil and Richard Ian Cox would be out of a job.

  • the_pragmatist says:

    I find it highly interesting that not one single case (that I am currently aware of, correct me if I am wrong) has been brought to fruition, be it in the USA or Canada, prosecuting someone for possession of "virtual child pornography" in the form of manga or anime. Such cases invariably include real child pornography, which involves real children.

  • the_pragmatist says:

    I find it highly interesting that not one single case (that I am currently aware of, correct me if I am wrong) has been brought to fruition, be it in the USA or Canada, prosecuting someone for possession of “virtual child pornography” in the form of manga or anime. Such cases invariably include real child pornography, which involves real children.

  • Barbarian of Gor says:

    Should we also give someone jail for real if he plays Grand Theft Auto? Should we let someone who has gone on a crime spree off easy because violent video games warped fantasy and reality?

    Thought CRIME is NOT Crime.

  • Hey Artefact, I like how you left out the part where they had REAL kiddie porn, including videos of little boys under 12 years of age getting raped by grown men.

    Kinda puts things into perspective.

    • “I like how you left out the part where they had REAL kiddie porn, including videos of little boys under 12 years of age getting raped by grown men.”

      No, that’s not what the article says. The article says this:

      “The images included “videos depicting sexual assaults of barely pubescent boys, around 12 years old, some pictures and cartoon drawings,” Botterill said. Approximately 90 per cent of the images were of cartoon drawings called Japanese Anime, while the remainder were of actual children.”

      The article doesn’t distinguish between what the real images showed and what the cartoon images showed. We know there were images showing real boys, but we don’t know what those images showed the boys doing – we don’t even know if those images were illegal in and of themselves. The article doesn’t distinguish between 2D and 3D in terms of what they depicted, so we have no way of knowing what showed what.

  • At one time, and artist in BC was tried for drawing images of nude children. He was let go though, on the grounds that banning artistic expression would be tantamount to enforcing thoughtcrime laws.

    …but these days they’ve ignored legal precedent, and marched one step deeper into an Orwellian state – it’s not just illegal to commit crimes, it’s illegal to desire the wrong things.

    It wasn’t that long ago they nailed a guy in the west too when he tried to order some hentai manga. However to this day, every case I’ve read about of a bust in Canada, they found real CP too, so the hentai charges are an added charge for a stiffer sentence. – STILL, that sets the precedent that it is illegal, and could be the sole cause of a conviction, and that is fucked up.

    Ironically, if they’d framed it and put it in a gallery it’d still be just fine. The walls of a college or university even – though not without complaints. This has put the government in the position of arbitrarily judging which art has merit, which does not, and therefore, which forms of expression are illegal.

  • i guess they are doing all they can just to put people in jail for fake stuff.

    i do believe in that one guy’s post for killing someone in GTA. so having drawn pics of anime loli’s gets you in jail but killing people in a videogame doesnt?

    way to go laws

    • From the article:

      “The images included “videos depicting sexual assaults of barely pubescent boys, around 12 years old, some pictures and cartoon drawings,” Botterill said. Approximately 90 per cent of the images were of cartoon drawings called Japanese Anime, while the remainder were of actual children.”

      There were images of real children. However, we don’t know exactly what the real images showed, since the article doesn’t distinguish between what was 2D and what was 3D. I wonder if the images of 3D boys were even illegal on their own, or if the prosecutors just threw that in there to make it seem like the twins were guilty of more than just looking at 2D pr0nz. Either way, they made it clear that the 2D stuff was highly illegal on its own. So, since the prosecution said that 90% of their evidence was 2D in nature, that’s enough for me to call this prosecution at least 90% bullshit.

  • Strawberry Suicide says:

    Heh, good thing the shota/loli issue didn't reach the Hungarian media yet – oh, God pls do not let the Dark Side rule over my country!!
    I don't get the world anymore – ppl who own VIRTUAL '( child )pornography' seem to get more negative attention than actual pedophiles and sex crime perpetrators…
    Whenever news are updated about child molestation or abuse cases the media focuses on how much 'hentai' and shota/loli material did the criminals own – yet most ppl doesn't even know what pedophilia is?!
    I'm not hoping for anything, it will become even worse with time…At least until they realize that banning such material increased crime rates…The desperate and kind of lost 2D lovers will kill themselves or go for the REAL thing…( I'm meaning the extreme cases, obsessive fans of rather non-mainstream ero, like guro or hardcore rape )
    And one more thing – those guys earn it, since they are obviously interested in underaged children the 'wrong way'…However they are more guilty of stupidity…If you have such material and your PC/laptop/whatever is available for others as well – at least burn it to CD or somethin' ><'…!! LAME!!

    • Gondolod? Haha, simán lebasznának minket ha találnának lolit/shota-t a gépünkön gondolkodás nélkül, mondhatnád hogy csak rajzolt egész nap…

      Its funny that here (Hungary) age of consent is 14, but if you have a picture of a nude 14 year old… You get my meaning.

  • Child pornography laws are ridiculous. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t support the sexualization of minors, but most countries go extremely overboard on the situation. At 16, I had naked pictures of a girl on my phone that she voluntarily sent me. If someone found out we had sex, would I get in trouble? No, we were both minors and “not old enough to have a choice in sex”. However, if they saw my phone I would have gotten in trouble for having “child pornography”. It’s ridiculous. So, I can do whatever I want, but just not take a photo of it?

    Ridiculous.

  • I can’t see why you can’t argue anime has artistic merit, educational, scientific, or medical purpose.
    “I draw to develop my artist skills”, “I use my collection to study artist skills”, “I research anime for a scientific paper I’m doing”, “A loli a day keeps the doctors away.”

    The Vague Content & Context is 100% bullshit. They forcibly put guilt+intent+imaginary+non-real or doesn’t exist+I haven’t even commit any crime = base on their whim how they feel how much guilt you deserve.

    http://www.slais.ubc.ca/PEOPLE/students/student-projects/S_Wildflower/canada.htm#Legislation

  • I heard on the radio not long back that some UK councils were pushing to have access to peoples email, usage, and the likes. Their excuse for this was so they can track down pedos and the likes better. Can you imagine if they actually went through the peoples usage? One day you’d wake up to find alot less people on the streets as half the country has just been arrested 😀

    • Well they originally used the ‘terrorist’ excuse, but of course that was just a stepping stone for further invasion of privacy and to follow up with more paranoid BS. Thank god it got rejected for obvious reasons. Even ex-MI5 dudes have openly said that the way things are now are trampling on human rights. Just recently a guy got arrested and fined for having beast porn on his phone that he recieved during high school for a laugh, but completely forgot about it for a few years.

      Take into account that UK has the Dangerous Pictures Act. Any image can be labeled offensive (thanks drama queen Liz Longhurst). Now if this recent legislation to ban drawings depicting minors gets through, I’d hate to see how many high schoolers will be arrested for sharing cartoon porn.

      There is a speck of dust of hope. Anti-censorship groups have brought up the problems of libel (defamnation) laws. A.K.A. laws made on unjustified means, baseless accusations, exaggerations, slander and clearly without substantial evidence. There is now a possibility that they may be abolished. The government has always gagged (or tried to) the media and news reports that could harm their image or show the world of their facist laws. They never publically share information of legislating new laws, and it keeps the public hidden in the dark while criminalizing them at the same time. Another reason why there is little to no debate at all with the public and logic. It’s always been ‘The government and what the government says’. That’s a problem when you have no clear Freedom of Speech act. Witch Hunts for all?

      Anyway; regarding this article. Are you kidding me?! Most of the crap spewed were merely opinions. Does anyone take Psychology seriously these days, it seems that some moralfags get into professions just to say ‘Hi, I’m a *insert academic profession* now. What I say must be true now yeah?’ Though agreed that if it was just 2D then whatever, however it seems they had some 3D. Still, the fact that they incessantly claim 2D as bad as 3D…Might aswell arrest households with toy knives and swords am I right?

  • Also forgot to mention it was their Sister-IN-Law who turned them in. Guess she found a way to get those 2 out of the house, since they were having sex with each other and had no interest in her. It was in the article.

  • I heard on the radio not long ago that some UK councils are pushing to have access to peoples email, usage and whatnot, their excuse for this was so they can track down pedophiles and the likes alot easier. Can you imagine if they went through your usage? One day you’d suddenly see alot less people on the street because half the the country has been arrested 😀

  • Fucking excuses. The law exists to protect people form violating the freedoms of other people. I find it laughable that something can be considered a crime, when nobody gets harmed in the process. Why the fuck do we need a law against something which has a no negative effect on society? They waste OUR money (well, Canadian citizens’s money) on bullshit self gratification campaigns against phantom crimes. There is nothing to be gained from jailing people for whatever disgusting fantasies they have, as long as they keep it to themselves. Or are we arresting people because they _may_ commit a crime now?

    Not that these guys don’t deserve their sentences. I consider myself pretty liberal, but even I draw the line on CP.

    Moralists: +1, Civilization: -1

  • From the article:

    “‘The images creates a market, whether anime or live images, and victimizes the people that are most vulnerable,’ said Tax”

    Yeah, because people drawing cartoons turns other people into dangerous sex criminals. Also, for someone to look at these cartoons victimizes children. WTF? Anyone else see how that makes absolutely no sense? These people are nuts.

    As an aside, the anti-porn movement has been saying the exact same sorts of things about ALL forms of porn for *years* now. Of course, their claims have been debunked time and again, but that doesn’t keep them from repeating them over and over. I wonder how long until the anti-porn people are able to push for broad bans on all kinds of porn in Canada, and not just bans on loli/shota. Glad I don’t live there.

    • Also from the article:

      “Further, psycho-somatic testing showed that when Corey was presented with visual stimuli, he indicated strong physiological preferences to pre-pubescent boys between the ages of 12 and 15 and had strong responses to sexual abuse of children as young as eight years old. Corey was placed at just below a moderate risk to re-offend.”

      They did tests on this guy to see what he was attracted to. In Canada, simply having ‘inappropriate’ attractions is now the business of the court and is evidence against you in court proceedings. It’s not just a matter of what you’ve done – it’s also a matter of what you simply *think* about. Holy shit that’s Orwellian!

      • I was thinking of possibly retiring to Canada after I save up enough money. But I certainly won’t under this kind of Orwellian dystopia.
        Western civilization takes another spin round the toilet bowl.

  • Damn, I gotta admit I am kind of surprised for this. Until now I thought Canada was superior to the US in terms of public education (K-12), and certain legal issues (Canada abolished the death penalty, yes?).

    …guess I’ll have to rethink my view of Canadians.

  • Again, the judges claim is absurd, baseless and plain stupid.
    “Every one of these images involves the victimization of children. The victimization wouldn’t happen in the first place if there weren’t people there to look at this material.”

    This doesn’t make the shotacon “material” illegal. Or we’d have to ban all types of murder, drug trafficking and all sorts of “material” involving crimes out there.

    “This is a crime that victimizes young people around the world. It creates a market which then re-victimizes the most vulnerable in society.

    The images can only be regarded as disgusting and perverse.”

    About the first paragraph, if he’s talking only about shotacon images, there’s absolutely no proof of that.
    In fact, most child abusers don’t even know about shotacon, and the fact is that people with deviant behavior CAN go after those images, and not otherwise.

    It’s a lot like violent games. It’s NOT that violent games produces more violence, but it is POSSIBLE that some violent people COULD go after those games.

    This doesn’t imply that every single FPS gamer is a potential assassin, or will eventually commit acts of violence.

    About the last sentence, that’s just the judge’s personal opinnion, and shouldn’t count on a court of law. Fetishes are something very personal, and if we are to start using the judges personal opinnions to consider people guilty or not, then we might as well get the constitution and laws and flush them all down the toilet.

    BUT, not uncommon here on Sankaku, there’s one bit of information that was left out. Part of the images that were taken from those twins were of REAL CHILD PORNOGRAPHY. And that alone justifies their jail time, period.

    Also, most of the arguments presented by the judge, if he is in fact refering to real child pornography, they make absolute sense.

    • If you really want to blame Christofags, then point to the UK. You’d be surprised at how many countries have been ‘moralized’ because of the UK. Guess why there are/were so many countries that is/was homophobic and saw them criminals? Alot of witch hunts related events originated in the UK and spread via colonisations.

    • huh? really? what’s next? you’re gonna pin the recent earthquake on americans, too? fundamental christans only exist in the USA?

      stop being so retarded please. stop acting as if all the problems in the world are all originated from USA and take responsibilities for your own shits.

  • Sometimes I question the USA but damn at least they have something right, the americans understand freedom of speech and they respect their constitution and the ideals it was built upon and I respect them for that.

    Or.
    AMERICA FUCK YEAH

  • I am a Canadian citizen. My mother is a doctor, and thus has a small library of medical textbooks. Many of these books have illustrations, including drawings that show the progression of male and female genitals through puberty.

    I wonder if that makes her a criminal according to our own laws? Maybe I should look up the criminal code and see.

    • Its directly stated in section 163.1 that those types of images are allowed. It says the victim is considered not guilty if it “has artistic merit or an educational, scientific or medical purpose.”

      • [quote]”has artistic merit or an educational, scientific or medical purpose.”[/quote]

        ‘Artistic’ or ‘Educational’ according to [i]who?[/i] The stuffed shirts in those long black robes? Or the moralfags and/or polichickens?

      • That would make this ruling against the law and a reason to call for a mistrial. Saying something has artistic merit is in the eyes of the beholder which means to the defendant those pictures might be considered to have artistic merit. They would then have to do a retrial for the real child pornography.

        PS. I’m not sure about Canadian law but I think in American law you can’t stand trial again for the same crime so if the conviction was both for the virtual and real child pornography they would be free. That may be just for an innocent decision though but I can’t remember now.

        • I’ve only heard of one other similar case here in Canada, and as this person mentioned, it was only in the case where they possessed actual Child porn in the first place.
          The charges for having the 2d stuff was added on as an afterthought.

          I’m all for banning of actual child porn, but frankly it’s a bit ridiculous that fake children are protected as well under the same law. -However- Canadian law enforcement have no means to actively stop you from downloading the content in the first place, (The only stings have been in large cases where people were distributing actual cp.) and as in this case, it was only after someone else reported them.

          We have by far the most free internet in the world (allthough we pay out the ass for it… but thats another story.) so you’re usually more than safe provided you’re not distributing it yourself (if its just 2d, I highly doubt you being suspect, at all.)

      • Seconding this, I (a Eurofag) visited Winnipeg twice a few years back, didn’t hear anyone say that. I suppose the stereotype might come from a specific part of some other province (making it pretty unreasonable to apply it to the whole of Canada).
        Before I moved to a northern city in England I thought that the “, love.” they often use for cheesy English characters was purely fictional, as my only experience before then had been with southern English cities. But there there were a significan amount of people using it, even if not all… That was so weird, and kept hitting my Uncanny Valley.