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American Guilty of Loli Manga Possession Faces 15 Years

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The trial of an American man arrested for ordering loli manga from Japan has ended after he pled guilty; he now faces a possible 15 year sentence, along with a $250,000 fine and the loss of all his precious loli manga.

The man, Iowa resident Christopher Handley, pled guilty to “possessing obscene visual representations of the sexual abuse of children and mailing obscene material,” charges stemming from postal workers rifling through his package and discovering it contained manga supposedly depicting underage sexual activity.

After lengthy and complex legal proceedings, details of which were covered in the previous article on the matter, Handley finally folded and faces a maximum sentence of 15 years and $250,000 in fines, along with forfeiture of anything the government happened to take during the trial. Sentencing is due at a later date.

The precise nature of the material he was arrested for is not clear, but Handley’s lawyer has previously insisted they were harmless yaoi comics, which suggests either that the material was rather willfully misconstrued by the authorities, or that the defence is trying to pass off shota as being “yaoi” in order to lessen the opprobrium.

His lawyer, Eric Chase, explains in comments to the media last year:

“There is explicit sex in yaoi comics, and the men are drawn in a very androgynous style, which has the effect of making them look really young. There’s a real taboo in Japan about showing pubic hair, so they’re all drawn without it, which also makes them look young. So what concerned the authorities were the depictions of children in explicit sexual situations that they believed to be obscene. But there are no actual children. It was all very crude images from a comic book.”

However, we hear from the confession that the shipment in question consisted of “obscene material, including books containing visual representations of the sexual abuse of children, specifically Japanese manga drawings of minor females being sexually abused by adult males and animals.” The US Postal Service later conducted a search of his domicile and found the rest of his collection.

The circumstances surrounding Handley’s guilty plea are distinctly unclear (see the forum), but the Comic Book Legal Defense Fund, a pro-freedom of expression group closely involved in the case, condemns the wretched coward for caving in and so potentially introducing a precedent which could be used in further prosecutions, though they are hopeful this can be mitigated:

“Naturally, we are very disappointed by this result, but understand that in a criminal case, every defendant must make the decision that they believe serves their best interest. Because the set of facts specific to this case were so unique, we hope that its importance as precedent will be minimal. However, we must also continue to be prepared for the possibility that other cases could arise in the future as a result.”

The case is legally complex, but the core issue is that loli manga remains Constitutionally protected free speech, as judges have ruled the laws banning it contravene the First Amendment right to freedom of expression.

However, a legal loophole allows the charges of possession to stand due to the material having been “moved in interstate commerce,” even though it would otherwise be Constitutionally protected art.

Those looking for more speculative details, including supposed comments from those familiar with Mr Handley alleging he was a victim of exceedingly bad legal counsel, can read more on the forums.

Strangely, the vigour with which the US has been defending the rights of fictional children has not changed the fact that the USA remains one of the least safe places to be a child in the developed world according to the UN, despite having a legislature which seems obsessed with child protection…

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591 Comments

  • What confuses me about this is that they mentioned that the postal workers were rifling around in his package. Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t that in and of itself illegal? I believe it is, because someone’s mail is their own buisness.

  • well…for all for of you, ill answer your questions simply. – why? because thats all it really takes. no this indecisve shit you guys keep posting

    – these corporate bastards and ”defense authorites” are evil. straight as that
    and while monsters like gearge bush ”senior”
    rape and molest all the kids they want, no one lifts a finger to lock them away forever or hang them high fromt he gallows, not even for giving hitler weapons or creating conspiract on a mass scale to name some crimes.

    you ALL need to stop arguing and fighting amongst yourselfs and see that the same evil son of bitches who started the crusades witch burnings coup deta’s
    of almost all other nations and defensless peoples,
    are the same ”authoritie” ( the name just reeks of bullshit) who are in ”power” today.

    they already ”arrest” people with a quatrer of a life sentence for having paper with things drawn on it. what next? them being able to go in your own home and install cameras? arrest you if you dont let them put a microchip in your skin?

    you all need to look to look out of your tiny shells
    and do whatr the russians did recently.
    their bullcrap ”officals” became too greedy and corrupt. together the people marched over towards the major heads of power, and with rocks and stones beat the police unconcious, and put everythign back int heir hands. its a unuion now.

    if you dont all take some action and help people like this man ( FOR BUYING A FUCKING COMIC BOOK!!!!!)
    if and when shit gets so bad that the U.S military murderers occupy your home and towns, and stuff like that, and you do nothing –
    youl have no one to blame but yourselves.

    you have all the power, you all have all the power to change all this. toss aside your petty things and grab sticks and stakes and torches and march to washington and force them to put someone in power whos a normal, regular good person.

      • Anonymous says:

        It’s not even a paraphilia. Need I remind that homosexuality was once called homoPHILIA!

        Pedosexuality is a normal sexuality that some people have a problem with because:

        1. They think that their imaginary god doesn’t want them to be having sex until marriage. If that was true though, we wouldn’t have genitalia until marriage!

        2. They think that children are ‘innocent’, and are actually mistaking ignorance with innocence and thinking that children who have sex as children don’t do all the other ‘normal’ things that children do (bullshit, coming from my own experiences as a child!).

        3. They are actually pedosexuals THEMSELVES who are using their ‘outrage’ against pedosexuals to cloak themselves and keep people from thinking that they are pedosexuals.

        • 1. Sorry that your parents made you go to church every Sunday. This isn’t a matter of religion (see: British priests).

          2. You’re acting as if you have the right to decide concepts like innocence and ignorance.

          3. Now you’re just acting dumb/angry. I guess you think gay people are actually straight people and straight people are actually gay, making everyone bisexual. And since some fap to /d/ material it’s only normal that everyone else does too, only without admitting it.

  • omg omg dont you just wana go fck you law damn how can the be so stupit, seriously why not sort out the kiddy rapers than people with a manga book… fffffff yes i like loli n manga see nothing wrong with it cause rl children arent kawaii *hits head of table*

    • Obviously because putting together a case that actually does some fucking good and saves children is too much work, they spend so much time on computers they get fat and lazy and frustrated so they need to get some ‘wins’ to appease their superiors so their department keeps getting funding.

      I have total respect for the ones who look at actual evidence of crimes and coordinate with international intelligence agencies to help locate children being raped and rescue them, they’re a credit, but they should stop this other shit going on giving the department a bad name by harassing thought criminals who haven’t touched anyone.

  • Any good lawyer should be able to make them drop these charges and get that guy a large sum of money.
    Several constitutional laws were broken here the USPS should be paying this guy millions.
    Item was not technically illegal so they have jack shit for a case.
    I swear sometimes is seems the US needs another civil war.

    • USPS routinely searches suspect mail. The average postal worker cannot search mail, only Postal Inspectors and customs officers if it is coming from overseas. They do have clerks whose job is to pull suspect looking mail for evaluation by the Postal Inspector.

      If mail is found to be illegal, they can do a couple of different things, one is confiscate it, two is deliver it and then work with law enforcement to arrest individual receiving the mail. They do that with drugs shipped through the mail quite often.

      If the USPS is involved in a search of a persons home, the illegal item was discovered while in the USPS possession, but delivered to the addressee.

  • The sad thing is, whenever America does get around to banning Lolicon i’d have to frag my entire hentai folder since 99.98% of the hentai out there is of characters that are under the age of 18

  • If liking loli makes you a felonious pervert, I guess I’m going to Hell.

    With all the real problems the world is facing, why are they wasting time with this crap? If you want to help the children, help the real ones. The 2D cartoon characters can take care of themselves.

    • Anonymous says:

      Perversion is in the eye of the beholder. A person who likes old women could call someone who is attracted to 20 year olds a ‘pervert’.

      It is TOO FUCKING VIEWPOINT BASED to be allowed into our laws.

  • KajunBowser says:

    One postmaster “randomly” chooses his yaoi manga package to look at, he/she “thinks” he/she sees shota yaoi, postmaster shat uber bricks over his/her morality. And the guy caved in!?!? I WANT MY DONATION BACK, MR. HANDLEY!!!!

    /rrrraage

    This is a sad time in the USSA. Looks like I’m not getting any manga via mail from Japan after this.

  • Anonymoot says:

    maybe you fags could read the article a bit closer, or do some digging into the facts around the case before barfing onto the comments page. It’s pretty clear IMHO that the lawyer is/was trying to play up the ‘yaoi’ aspect to try and turn it into a homosexual persecution case and get him off (haha). The confession states ‘specifically Japanese manga drawings of minor females being sexually abused by adult males and animals.’ That’s something entirely different to most people, even though it’s still just drawings which SHOULD be the issue here. But the final nail in his coffin of course is the fact he was stupid enough to order them by mail! Y HELO THAR INTERSTATE COMMERCE LAWS. He deserves what he gets simply for being stupid and obvious about his interests, and then rolling over and playing dead when they caught him.

  • Anonymous says:

    this is utter crap, not the case itself, but what pisses me off is since when does the US Postal Service go around checking your shit when it´s neither
    1)ticking
    or
    2)giving dog´s scent of bombs,drugs,etc

    i mean do they have loli manga sniffing dogs now or what..and to top that off they bust into his house
    isn´t that a job for like the police,fbi,etc

    seriously..postal service is shit
    this is why you should order your loli mangas through DHL,FedEx,etc

    i mean did you see castaway…he could have opened that shit up on the island but he didnt xD

  • after reading of this Comic Book Legal Defense Fund i had pictured them somehow looking like The League of Justice.

    kinda fucked up he caved. no fucking way i’m gonna think that 15 years in prison must be better than this trial going on.

    the precedent is worst. i’d watch out with the galleries on this site.

  • Anonymous says:

    Man, if this shit happened in Canada he’d have been off in a flash. The US POSTAL SERVICE fucking just looked inside his mail for no reason?…

    In Canada, that constitutes an unreasonable search, which would have infringed upon his rights in the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, section 8, Search and Seizure. “Everyone has the right to be secure against unreasonable search of seizure.”

    Following up, Section 24 of the Canadian Charter: Enforcement of Guaranteed Rights and Freedoms.
    24. (1) Anyone whose rights or freedoms, as guaranteed by this Charter, have been infringed or denied may apply to a court of competent jurisdiction to obtain such remedy as the court considers appropriate and just in the circumstances.
    (2) Where, in proceedings under subsection)1_, a court concludes that evidence was obtained in a manner that infringed or denied any rights or freedoms guaranteed by the circumstances, the admission of it in the proceedings would bring the administration of justice into disrepute.

    Summed up: His rights were infringed upon to obtain the evidence against him, the evidence would thereby be excluded, because it would bring the administration of justice into disrepute.

    Moral of the story: Live in Canada if you don’t want the post office to get you Banned for Life due to Ero-Loli.

  • Anonymous says:

    Okay call me a n00b about all of this if you would like but I would like some info please.

    Loli manga is illegal in America? Like, even if one had a censored legitimate manga from Japan. If it has children in it, and you own it, you can get arrested?

    So if I was just sitting in my house and drawing for the fuck of it, and happened to draw a loli having sex and someone saw it, I could get fucking jail time?

    Even though they are not real people in the manga. I can get jail time and fines over FUCKING DRAWINGS? I can’t accept this… it can’t be true. That goes against every single thing Free Speech and Freedom of Expression stand for. It’s fucking unamerican.

    I don’t care how obscene it is. It’s not happening to a real story. It’s a fictional character. Where do we draw the line?

    I mean, I guess we gotta go arrest Stephen King since there were children having sex in IT. Those fictional characters are far too young to be having sex. They have rights too, you know.

    Fuck that. Fuck this.
    America is fucking stupid now.

    Seriously, since when did this happen? I remember seeing a Law and Order episode that had realistic CGI girls or something and didn’t that get get away since they were not real. Or, he did get arrested but it was for constantly sending a pedo links and shit. Or maybe he got away. I dunno. Fuck it.

    This has me so fucking mad right now.

  • Honestly speaking, I’m not into that sort of thing.
    But a drawing is a drawing, regardless of what it has in it, and since no human being was involved, no one has been harmed.
    This guy was not arrested for possessing child pornography, he was arrested for owning a comic book with explicit pictures that resembled minors.
    Would the U.S. justice system have rather arrested him for buying pictures of the real thing?
    Also, whatever happened to the privacy act?
    Looking through someones mail without a warrant is a federal crime.

  • superchan says:

    well i checked today some hentai manga and an accident there was one loli manga pas away. I have check it out.
    So long its fictive and you don’t get real peoples disturb it. And the person is mental still OK. Then they should wasted time and money on it. They should get the real bad guys on the street ??

  • So the fucking guy is prosecuted for having manga, but the people who went through his mail at the post office are congratulated?

    Let’s not forget opening other people’s mail is a federal offense.

    • Anonymous says:

      I’m pretty sure the postal workers are given free reign to open mail they consider “dangerous” or “questionable”. If there had been a question of illegality regarding how the evidence against this guy was obtained in the first place, his attorney would have definitely brought it up and, in all likelihood, the whole case would have been thrown out on its ass.

      On the other hand, if Handley really did have bad representation that might just have been the case.

  • So how come he could import it to the US through a postal office if it’s actualy illegal?
    That shouldn’t be possible,if they inspected his content.They should have send it back as to protect that citizen.
    Also why don’t i hear anything from those japan artist and japan in general about this problem.
    Japan should protect him and rage at the unrespect of calling hentai drawings lolicon as cp.
    They even acuse japan for having the most cp,when it’s mostly drawn hentai lolicon,unless i am wrong since i don’t know about cp.
    I mean doesn’t a country like that feel offended by such wrong comments??

    • Anonymous says:

      Country does not give a shit. America doesn’t care when people cry about us freeing the shit out of everyone else with bombs. Japan does not give a shit out of some white guy getting called a pedo because he bought something that looks like child porn. Hell, Japan wouldn’t give a fuck period because he’s non-Japanese. Even if he was Japanese, they might go “eh” unless he’s an actual Japanese national.

      Also they would be thinking more to get rid of an undesirable person than to “send something back to protect a citizen.” Had it been drugs or bomb materials, they would have wanted to take out that possible threat. Looking like child porn does not help any.

      • I never thought of it that way…

        maybe, maybe not but who knows…

        if the CBLDF had actually convinced the judges in the case EARLIER about the act’s unconstitutionality, his sentence, even with getting guilty, may have been way lessened.

        but who knows.

  • oppaishibari says:

    what i find funny people are saying loli when artefact has quoted in article its toai men 18+ without pubes something about the law in japan (but I’ve seen hetero ero with pubic hair so dunno

    but any idea what the titles of his “obscene” manga were?

  • Random Fag says:

    Wow-hhoo! It surely sucks to live in US.
    I suppose, if I lived in US, I’d be behind the bars for… liek 20 years for all the fun I had.
    Loli-manga… in what twisted universe you can find something more innocent, than reading loli-manga?
    I wonder, if in some years, when it’s “hello again, 1929!” in US, there’ll be “la resistance” – hungry nerds with m4a1 and c4, reading loli-manga somewhere in Detroit, on the roof of former GM production facilities.
    Way too cooool.

  • Why is the world getting so damn ridiculous with all the new lawstating? I don’t see anything wrong with if it’s a drawn picture as long as no actual chilren have been involved in the process.

    FFS. It’s just a drawing. If they ban that, they could just ban all kinds of fantasy and movies where people die and the like too, seeing how “snuff” movies for example is obviously banned because they are authentic.

    As long as no one is hurt from it, I don’t see a reason to ban it. In fact I think it’s more likely it prevents some people to look for pictures involving real children.

    I will never understand how people think. >_>

  • Anonymous says:

    If this guy is guilty for the simple act of possession, then this site is fucked. Possession is nothing vs multi-state distribution of sexual images of children *loli*

    Also, I do not believe for a minute that the whole facts of this case are known. Quite simply, there has to be something more to this case then is currently available to the public.

  • “but the core issue is that loli manga remains Constitutionally protected free speech, as judges have ruled the laws banning it contravene the First Amendment right to freedom of expression.”

    I thought the case, that overturned those laws was later itself reversed, meaning the laws banning loli stand?

  • one thing interesting about this is the fact the US postal service is not a federal service and thus can not conduct a search of a private residence. So IF they had performed such a search none of the materials found would be able to be used in a court of law. It is possible the translation of the story is messed up and they meant to say police or FBI.

  • Anonymous says:

    just because otakus are a minority and the rest of the world besides japan cannot reproduce this kind of market for the otakus, the japanese culture is now being discriminated (“if we cannot produce it and reap profit from it, you are NOT ALLOWED to have it!”).

    we are given less freedom, ppl can now goto jail because they have hobbies like reading comics and into fictional stories.

  • tl;dr on the whole thread, smart people of SanCon

    i have prepared a shitload of apologetic wine and a humble pie just in case anyone wants it. i’ll be at the corner

    love knee-san

  • Anonymous says:

    AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
    If it was NOT EXPLICITLY stated that there were chidren in the manga, then forget about it. For fucks sake, I am tired of people trying to take this shit to court. I enjoy loli, and shit like that, but its a fucking drawing. Who gives a shit. This whole response was disjointed.

  • Pro-active thoughts:

    1)Spam the ACLU with emails (/b/, are you out there and bored as usual? seriously?) & letters. Definitely physical printed letters from home addresses that they would eventually get so sick of having to throw out they might actually do something useful for once.

    2)If we claim that Hentai is a valid and “important vehicle for public opinion”, which I know I’m not alone in viewing something like SanCon as (people giving their opinions on Ero subjects, even 4chan occasionally serves this purpose), then we would actually already have Supreme Court precedent that our visual media is the vehicle for our protected speech.

    This is covered by a Supreme Court decision allowing motion pictures to be anti-religious…
    Continued in the Forums

    —–

    If you’d like more details on the case at hand, try this excellent post featuring correspondence letters from Handley’s own mother, and Expert Testimony that could have turned the case around, but never showed up.

    This the most up-to-date you can get on this case.

    It was just one person failing after another that led to this…

  • For f-sake
    its just a comic, thank god that those retards don’t do this bullshit at paintings/drawings and statues …. but I’m afraid that those fucks might do so…

    btw there are laws of posting, downloading “loli” material in internet, but what if I’m the author of those works and confirm that they are all legal age no matter how child like they are?!

      • The problem is that the law is very loose on the subject. a cop can have a person arrested for a picture they took if the cop can deem the picture “erotic”. Well what is erotic? what if the child is taking a bath and its a innocent picture *literally cant see any chest or below* and the cop deems that erotic. but is it trully erotic for taking a innocent picture of our own child taking a bath? I mean what parent really hasent taken a picture of their own child naked at one time. It’s innocent with no harm in it.

        Only reason I know of these laws is because I worked in photo developement. Reporting some one for CP could land you in some severly hot water if it comes out you have no real defense. now you just went and ebaressed a entire family causing emotional and maybe even physical harm to them through a indirect action. Thats the problem with CP laws in general.

  • Do postal worker have the rights to check through every mail they receive? If the postal worker did not check through his ordering it should not be a problem.

    What’s up with loli banning? They are just drawing on a piece of paper. People who read loli manga which sometimes I do does not go out and rape children after reading because I know it not right to do so and to those who does not read loli manga will eventually rape the children.

    It’s a mad world! Those bastard who are passing the law should die and America is a free world why they are having this kind of stupid banned on loli manga?

    • Anonymous says:

      If a Postal Inspector or the Postal Inspection Service actually felt the need to search every single piece of mail be it a letter or package then yes they would be able to legally do so. Would it be feasible? No, so they use a semi-random system or check items that are “suspicious.”

  • most fucked up story
    i recently watched a show in discovery
    and they have 3 people who cooperated and killed a guy

    they were jailed for
    15 years
    15 years and
    35 years

    and that,
    possessing a [b]drawn[/b] image…
    for 15 years!

    sometimes i want to laugh at people who graduated at good school and decided what’s justice and what’s not

    rather helping that guy so that he will regret what he did in jail, it will reverse effect. he will surely go to the bad

    • Why should he even regret what he did, he looked at a fucking pic. This will just make him bitter and think “if they’ll just jail me for thinking and looking at something I may as well go do whatever I want” and them abruptly he’ll probably go track down the judge of the case and prosecutor or something.

  • I understand why people might want to live in japan, but the japanese already dislike other races already without more people moving into japan, sure I wanted to do the same thing as well.

    But if all we do is run from our home countries then we just bring our problems wherever we run too. Put it this way, if your unhappy with how your country runs then there is bound to be people who have similar complaints like you.

    But if you let corruption and stupidity destroy your country then your only feeding the machine more fuel, as soon as one country has be successfully fucked, you think it will just stop there? No because that country will be support and something to compare too for another country trying to be successfully fucked.

    By all means if you want to leave that bad, then do so, but you aren’t helping your own cause, your just making it temporarily easier on yourself until your problems catch up with you, and believe me they will.

    Sorry to bitch but it would be nice for people to stand up and fight for the things they enjoy instead of running away..

  • Heh.
    Living in America must suck.

    On another note, butthurt religious fags abound here ^^
    Not that I’m insulting anyone’s religion, its your life, decide as you will, no discrimination and all that crap.

  • This is bullshit.
    I suppose it means that any hentai manga I buy when I’m in Japan next year is coming in my carry-on bag with me, instead of being mailed to my house or put in my luggage, just in case. :/
    Fail, America. Fail.

  • Anonymous says:

    The guy should claim that the loli’s are depictions of his own imaginary children. He’ll get convicted for imaginary child porn, which will prove that his children have rights. Then, he should ask for child support for all his imaginary loli’s. He’ll be in jail for 15 years, but at least he’ll be rich when he gets out.

    We should all try to get child support for our imaginary children!

  • Anonymous says:

    This law sucks. Even from a legal prospective.

    First off, it talks about the depiction of minors, but as far as I know, there is no objective criteria for what constitutes a depiction of a minor. Is it child bearing hips? Large/Developed breasts? Pubic hair? Height? Does it include non-physical minor associated traits? Does a character wearing a sailor fuku count as a minor? Does behavior have any influence? Does the presence of non-human or fantastic traits have any effect? Does a loli cat girl count as a minor?

    As it stands, it is quite possible for one to violate the law by accident due to a difference in a opinion. If one looks at an image and decides that the character depicted is a non-minor, he in theory could be arrested, charged, and convicted under the law, if the prosecutor thinks otherwise.

    Of course on the other hand, that might make this law unenforceable if it goes the other way. Since the requirement for this law is to “knowingly” obtain the images, one could make the case since he believed the characters depicted are non-minors he did not knowingly do so, and thus did not violate the law. Of course, I have no idea if that would even hold water in court, so if anyone with more legal experitse would like to weigh in….

    And lastly, the sad truth to this story is the law here is actively hurting the very same children it supposed to be protecting. By making lolicon illegal and having the same harsh sentences as real child porn, it encourages pedophiles and child abusers to look at real child porn, because if they’re going to face the same sentences why not go for the real deal? This will increase the demand for real child porn and thus increase the production of child porn, leading to more child abuse.

  • Anonymous says:

    Prosecuting someone for possession of loli hentai?

    That’s like prosecuting some government official for war crimes because he likes drawing imaginary people getting tortured.

    Why does this country have to be so goddamned stupid sometimes.

    • i agree, its funny. i read the article and came up with a contradictory argument. if reading a manga or comic depicting a “fictional” (meaning not real)minor in an explicit sexual act is a crime, then in that same sense, playing a violent video game is a crime as well. its not real but its committing an act of murder or homicide or w/e else in the video game. its the same concept. so id imagine the governments gonna be busy for a while arresting all those people who have committed murder in violent video games.

  • thegirlguywhosaysheisagirl says:

    I find it odd that they do not prosecute women and only go after the male species in regards to this type of case. Not to mention the whole process in which this was discovered is rather irritating. Going through someone’s mail? How else is someone supposed to get the material if torrenting and the like is illegal? The government continues to push people to downloading and torrenting because it is illegal to actually buy the products. They will never be able to make it illegal though there are too many of them. They can’t afford to send all of those people to prison, it would cost too much and is too stupid a reason. Besides it is manga like this that helps keep potential real child predators from heading out into the real world.

    The guy made a huge mistake and had horrible law representation as anyone with a brain could have managed to fight against these charges. Hopefully this won’t see a surge of new cases and problems resulting from it.

    • JD in the making says:

      Just to clarify. This person wasn’t charged on the possession of obscene materials. In fact, the judge threw out the charge and ruled it unconstitutional. What they really nailed him on is the fact that he imported illegal materials from Japan(interstate commerce law). So basically they got him on a technicality. Whether you like it or not, visual representation of a minor engaging in sexual act is deemed illegal by the PROTECT Act. If you want to have it overturned you might try writing to your senators in the state of your residence. But once something is signed into law it takes close to an act of God to reverse it. I wouldn’t hold my breath.

  • Y’know… I love my country. America is great as far as being a melting pot of ideas and cultures….

    It’s the GOVERNMENT and tinshit-logic moralfag interest groups I have with a psychotic fucking hatred for.

  • This just proves how bad the postal service is…

    Why the hell was he discovered? Only way he got discovered was either he opened up what he had in public or delivery guys inspected and read the manga… After reading it and not satisfied they reported the poor guy and had him arrested…

    Either way… He paid for his manga… This is just plain wrong…

    • Idiot. Someone, somewhere, has to pay for it to begin with. How do you think people do scans? Some brave soul coughs up the money to buy it and distributes it for us unlucky souls, since its illegal for us to buy it here. Now I agree that he was idiotic for purchasing it, since he lived in US, where we all know very well, that its illegal. But don’t diss people for purchasing a product to support the original artist.

      I myself love J-Rock, and I can rock out to UVERworld anytime of the day. So naturally I would import their albums to support them.

  • Anonymous says:

    Chris’s lawyer turned out to be such a douche bag. I can’t believe he literally tricked the poor guy into such a crap wishy washy plea bargain.
    http://matt-thorn.com/wordpress/?p=318

    I’m writing letters to my reps in the Hill to complain. Not that they care…they signed these stupid shit laws to begin with… To top it off my reps are all the so called “conservatives” who supposedly believe in limited government. Unless of course it deals with moralistic bills or the Pentagon because then they’ll endlessly throw at them all the worthless paper bills the Fed can print out.

    • And yet people who download still get caught sometimes? Perhaps it from idiots such as yourself, who slanders those who try to support the original creator of the item? I believe people with an intelligence such as yours will get caught eventually even if you continue to download. Don’t attempt to avoid the “inevitable.”

      Let us not forgot the “real” reason for piracy and torrenting of imported “goods”. Surely when I go to Cons, I buy hard copies of H-manga from the artists.

    • It’s too bad we’re all forced pirate illegally because we can’t buy legally.

      It’d be nice to actually give money to the people who actually make this stuff. And have it on paper officially too.

      Seriously, if I can’t give monies to loli, shota and yaoi, I don’t want to spend on anything.

  • Anonymous says:

    What a bunch of shit. The fucking American idiots should keep their “moral ideals” to themselves. And knowing the upper echelon of Americans, the judge who ruled on the case probably went out and screwed a couple of hookers afterward as a celebration, or something equally hypocritical.

    And hey, while we’re screwing over loli fans, why don’t we start arresting people who have books with described child nudity/rape in them too!?

    It’s slowly becoming like the movie Equilibrium. Soon we’ll be banned from any sort of artistic media. Quite a future to look forward to. Yay!

  • This shit is the main reason why i really desperately want to live in Japan. Screw the low paychecks, the rascism, the high cost of living, living in a narrow house, and eating instant noodles everyday, at least i’m free of possessing loli materials, can easily just go to bookstores or stores and buy them, and don’t need to worry about busybodies checking my parcels.

    • Japan won’t be much better, if not worse. Most of the Japanese community doesn’t watch anime, let alone hentai. Lets not forgot that Japanese Otakus make up a very small population for Japan. In fact, alot of Japan is ignorant to anime in general.

      In other words, the Japanese community will look down upon just as much as any other country if not worse, since you’d be giving them a bad name. It just happens to be legal in Japan…for now at least…

      Don’t be ignorant to what’s going on behind the scenes. “The grass isn’t always greener on the other side.”

      But as they say, “Ignorance is bliss,” so have at it.

  • isn’t opening mail before it’s delivered a federal offense as well? i can understand if the package looked dangerous, but book packaging is pretty standard throughout the world. it wouldn’t have really been something they hadn’t seen before. i’d like to know if the postal workers that opened the packaging were given any kind of consequences or if they were just let off for “catching a criminal”. perhaps this is another problematic outcome from the patriot act?

    • I was wondering the same thing

      charges stemming from postal workers rifling through his package and discovering it contained manga supposedly depicting underage sexual activity.

      Any postal worker going trough your package here is going to get fired and any evidence obtained from it would be invalid afaik. If it actually was postal workers instead of customs, then gogo America and your so called freedom.

    • He imported from overseas it meaning it passes through Customs meaning they can open and check it if they want to ensure nothing illegal passes through or if it’s objectionable they’ll review it.

      They can also legally open what is considered “dead mail” (i.e. no return sender, cannot be delivered to addressee, circulated/shelved for the longest time so they open it to find clues who the sender was to return it…but that’s all digression and unrelated but I thought it would be good to let know).

      So yea…Customs.

  • Anonymous says:

    Looks like “Guilty until proven innocent” is how it works now.

    Did the defendant have a criminal history?

    Had he been convicted of a sex crime against anyone, let alone a minor?

    Was there reasonable cause for the USPO to open his mail, let alone a qualification make a determination toward the legality of it’s contents? Explosives, etc can be found without opening a parcel, so why did they open it?

    And that the material itself is protected by the first, yet a “loophole” was used to obtain a conviction?

    This man was convicted before he got to court. An example is being made of him, so that judges will have the ability to convict more people, based on this travesty.

    Rest in peace, Bill of Rights.

    • “This man was convicted before he got to court.”

      Well, he did that to himself by pleading guilty in the first place. Don’t blame the courts. Blame him.

      At the very least they could have struck a bargain for a lesser sentence possibly. Don’t know if they did.

  • Anonymous says:

    A great loss has happened today.
    I mourn for the loss of this probably great loli and yaoi comics, that will never be seen from again, the loss of the owner through being prosecuted, and the loss for lolicons and shotacon and yaoi fans in general.

  • Anonymous says:

    wow his lawyer must have been an idiot
    cause unless he ordered em from a public place
    or took them with him to public places or recieved em in a public place they arn’t considered obscene

      • Anonymous says:

        as long as he didn’t use a federal company it still counts as private

        and if it was a federal company he can sue the company
        cause opening others mail and getting caught is a federal offense
        that would mean that those items would not be allowed in court as evidence
        and the stuff in his house isn’t considered obscene so their would be no case against him

      • so as long as you don’t transport it across state lines you should be fine? not that it should be out of your house in your car lol, unless your taking it home from whereever you got it.

        I also saw that the post office searched his house(domicile)? Since when could the post office search a home? or does domicile mean workplace? if he took it to work thats another no no..

  • NotAnonymous says:

    This seriously disgusts me. Is America going to lose free speech now? And I really wanted to import some manga back home with me when I go to Japan…

    If pedophiles can’t get rid of their urges SOMEWHERE, they are just going to take it out on real children. I guess lolis getting tentacle raped are just as important as the real schoolgirls that are kidnapped and murdered.

  • Anonymous says:

    This is just WRONG! so WRONG! how can the govn’t prove that the drawings are of underage lolis? couldn’t he ask the original mangaka to explicitly say that the characters in the comics are of legal age?

    (and concerning previous related article http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2009/01/07/20-years-for-loli-manga-%e2%80%9cvictims-don%e2%80%99t-have-to-exist%e2%80%9d/)

    so this means that if i possess naruto comics, i’m going to attempt to be a ninja?!

    • I’m no legal specialist, but if you ever get people claiming what you read in comics will make you mimic the characters, there is already legal precedent to fight that with:

      A lawsuit filed against filmmaker Oliver Stone and Time Warner Entertainment alleged that the violent movie inspired two people to emulate the crime spree depicted in the movie. The suit, Byers v. Edmondson, was filed by the family of a victim of one of the crimes.

      Drawing on the principles established five decades earlier, Chief Judge Burrell Carter said the assailants’ “decision to imitate the characters of a film is more a regrettable commentary on their own culpability, than a danger of free expression requiring courts to chill such speech through civil penalties.”
      Source

      • Anonymous says:

        wrote an essay for midterms last semester on this. Two crazy fucked up teens driving across the west, doing crazy fucked up shit that two teens would do while driving across the American west. the movie was not censored i believe and i believe valid examples of disturbed childhoods protected the free speech of oliver stone(r).

  • So I heard the package was “suspicious” has anyone said how it was suspicious? I don’t import loli so I’d say I don’t have much to worry about, but I do import all sono hanabira merchandise, and one or possibly more could be considered loli.

    Thats all I’m worried about, then again I don’t live in the US. But the fact they opened his mail is just BS.

    • Hentai is allowed. Loli hentai is what is considered objectionable.

      Protected by the First Amendment? Loli hentai wouldn’t pass the Miller Test if this went to the Supreme Court. They’d mark it obscene off the bat. The fact that he entered into a guilty plea saved everyone in the US by not making a precedent. Only cases that go to trial make precedents, not plea bargains.

      Anyways…while the sentence is harsh, the US is the least of everyone’s concerns about the world cracking down on hentai.

      Australia and New Zealand ban all hentai, regardless of loli or not. New Zealand is actually creating some internet police force to enforce their laws. Canada bans it. The UK is about to ban in. Philippines bans it. Africa bans loli citing they are essentially “real” enough to warrant protection. Those are the only ones I can knock off the top of my head but yea…less focus on America. 2 peeps got nailed in New Zealand not too long ago and best of luck trying to import hentai doujin into Canada without it getting confiscated.

      • >>Australia and New Zealand ban all hentai, regardless of loli or not.

        Excuse me? I don’t know about New Zealand, but in regards to Australia that’s a load of crap. And can I point out that the one case where someone has been charged and sentence in regards to loli was fined a reasonable amount and did not go to prison at all?

        • Thanks. Seems kind of rough but then again anime hasn’t hit it big in Australia. The country/continent needs something of a transitional element to make anime more comfortable there.

          You guys need an Australian anime! Come on Japan! Make it happen!

          Fullmetal Alchemist set in Australia! Gundam set in Australia! Haruhi set in Australia! Pokemon set in Australia? (Don’t know if that would help though)

        • Don’t worry Osiris I understood =)

          Well I wouldn’t buy hentai at any commercial store to start with, a few of people would probably give you funny looks. Anime hasn’t hit Australia big like USA, you’re more likely to see someone who has seen anime but calls it a “cartoon” which drives me crazy, quite a few people also believe Anime IS Hentai. I believe probably a majority of Australia have heard the word Anime but isn’t really aware of what it means or what Anime is. The asian community here however is pretty knowledgeable about anime thankfully.

          Australia doesn’t seem to have very much hentai around, but it is there, it’ll usually be put with the anime in stores or adult videos in video rental places. It seems that only law enforcement care about lolicon and other select groups, whether the majority don’t know it exists or just don’t care I’m not 100% sure. It really depends on the type of people you communicate with. But for Hentai you may get some strange looks or made fun of by your friends but I don’t believe people will generally care much.

          Lolicon however, for some people the CP bells will sound and may report you, in some cases you may actually be charged as a child sex offender, but I’m sure you know you have to be careful who you tell what, because some people are just well… Retarded to put it simple. But I highly doubt there are many people who enjoy lolicon here, then there are the other people who would reply “eh it’s just cartoons”

          As for mistaken/accusing something of being lolicon “The Story of Little Monica” would most likely be flagged, however the first girl on “Choisuji” -may- beable to make it under the radar. Hope this all makes sense. =)

        • Thanks for the clarification Holly.

          How exactly do they treat purchasing hentai there? Frowned upon? Or borderline “I think I’m going going to call the cops on you because that girl who looks like she’s not 18 could be 18 because it’s cartoons from Japan and could be under 18 so she’s not 18 thus it’s child stuff so I want you to get screwed”?

        • Sorry Osiris but I live in australia, and that isn’t the case, lolicon is considered child porn *rolls eyes* but hentai is easy to obtain. It’s sold in a number of stores and video rental places.

          The simpsons porn was labeled as child porn because it used underage characters. Australia is just retarded about hardcore porn, fetishes and so forth, then again i’ve seen some disturbing hentai possible for purchase in australia, so I don’t know what the hell their doing anymore. The law is all fucked here.

        • “Customs National Manager Investigations, Richard Janeczko, said that it was important to understand that even cartoons or drawings such as those depicted in anime were prohibited if they contained offensive sexual content.” http://www.customs.gov.au/site/page.cfm?c=9256

          Another case here.

          http://www.smh.com.au/news/technology/simpsons-cartoon-ripoff-is-child-porn-judge/2008/12/08/1228584707575.html

          They put more emphasis on loli hentai. You – may – not go to jail for it but the fines will be shoved way up there.

    • in a sense, hentai(any kind) is protected speech in the us

      just OBSCENITY laws or whatever tend to get in the way or something

      I dunno, the law in the us is pretty controversial but nobody said about it being fully illegal

      just a lot of crappy laws tend to contradict it altogether

      • Anonymous says:

        Actually hentai, and porn, aren’t protected forms of freedom of speech because of the obscenity laws. Which is why Child Porn is considered illegal.

        “Obscenity” is typically defined as material which, to the average person, applying contemporary community standards, and taken as a whole: 1) predominantly appeals to prurient interests, 2) lacks serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value, and 3) depicts or describes nudity, sex, or excretion in a patently offensive way. Of course, what constitutes the relevant “community” in on-line environments without geographic boundaries is an open issue.

        I don’t want to get in an argument, I’m not saying I agree or disagree. Just trying to clear it up since it seems to be a common misunderstanding here.

        • Anonymous says:

          It can’t be stressed too often enough that the guy is going down for interstate trafficking of obscene materials. Obscenity is not protected speech, so although it might be legal to possess something obscene, once you cause it to cross a state line (like by having it imported into the US at an airport in a different state from the one you live in) you are liable to prosecution under Federal law. The loli/shota element of this case is not relevant to the legal process, but no doubt will be taken into account in sentencing.

        • Obscene porn is not protected. While all porn may be considered obscene, there is still that clear tagging that must be applied so that adults can still access “passable” porn and not have their right to do so infringed.

          Basically, it isn’t protected but still is to some degree. Just make sure you don’t end up in court over it…

  • As much as I hate to admit it, I’m not surprised. America is full of uptight moralfags from all walks of life and a they’re the ones in power. Remember when about a decade or so ago, anime and such were so underground and frowned upon? We may have to go underground again until people get their heads out of their asses and realize that a graphite drawing =/= real child. We’ll be frowned upon again, immediately labeled pedophiles and the like because of one fucking stupid ruling. Even regular comic book fans will be frowned upon for this. The nerds are once more the “most likely to do something evil” scapegoat.

    It’s like the Rapelay thing; instead of fighting a fictional, harmless problem, go after the IRL source and kick a real pedo’s ass. Do I support shota/loli? Yeah. Do I support IRL pedophilia? Hell no. Do I think that jacking off to pictures and games leads to peopel doing the actual crime? Hell no. The criminal had to be amazingly fucked up to begin with and this poor man does not fit the profile. He never touched a real kid or even had elaborate plans anywhere in his house. All he had were a few doujins and such. My sympathy is with him and his family.

    This is just another example of us being punished for thoughtcrimes and the like. The more this happens, the more I want to get the fuck out of here and live someplace that actually knows what it’s doing. Unfortunately, that’d leave me with very few choices to begin with.

    if any of us have money to spare, donate to the Comic Book Legal Defense Fund. We need to protect ourselves and others from bullshit like this. If we band together, we may just succeed.

    • +100
      I completely fucking agree. It feels like they pick on what they can catch. Rather than to spend money on a 2 year case, why not fucking use that money to crack down on real pedos? The ones that actually rape, harm, and violate real little girls? I mean with the case of RapeLay, I disagree with the ban, not because it’s a good game(which btw it is), but because it seems senseless to attack such things. It’s like the Rockstar/GTA debate. If kids can’t fucking sit down, play a game, kill people, steal cars, and rob stores, and not realize that doing it in real life is wrong…then something is fucking wrong with the kid.

      Perhaps they feel they can make an example out of us to the real pedophiles? But for Christ’s FUCKING SAKE, IT’S A DRAWING! The fact the no real harm was done here, pisses me off to no end. 15 years!? WTF!? I can see being fined, but 15 YEARS!? People can take a fucking life and get less than that! Are they implying that they’d rather us take a life than to FAP TO FUCKING 2D LOLIS!? What is the world fucking coming to!?!?!?!?

    • Anonymous says:

      And why do we keep pornographic materials out of reach from children if we so respect the freedom of speech? Because people are influenced by what the read. Even though you are so adamantly defending this guy, we have no idea what kind of content in the materials he possessed. I have no problem with it even if it depicts CONSENSUAL sexual acts involving minors. But it is just wrong if it contains bondage, torture, mutilation, etc. And judging by the sentencing I am inclined to say this guy might not be as innocent as you might think.

      • Anonymous says:

        You mentioned children, and then equated it with influencing people. Nice try, but influencing children and influencing people and adults are not the same.

        You’re not even being morally consistent. If even adults are easily influenced, then you should also be against depictions of consensual sexual acts involving minors, because that’s statutory rape.

        • Anonymous says:

          About giving children porn… in some countries like Denmark and I think some other European ones, porn magazines with actual porn on their covers have been on display in convenience stores at childrens’ level of height and next to the candy racks for many years now, and I’ve never heard of them having any sick problems with their kids or such things causing them to grow up into freaks. Though this freedom of where a store manager can place magazines is also changing now in Denmark (I think it already has), thanks to some feminazi and devout catholic activism (which I think came from an appeal from another country, no less).

          Unfortunately, taking the real problem is a much harder task, which is made even harder by them wasting time on the media. The real problem is at the root of nature and (in the most part) nurturing. Dysfunctional families can be the greatest of problems, as can lack of education. An unhappy, uneducated, and unhealthy child is breading ground for disaster. If only they realized that this is far more important, things would be much better. And to dig even deeper to the roots, you’d have to deal with individual cases before they arise and become something harmful to other people.

        • Anonymous says:

          You’re so naive. All those rules and regulations don’t stop the stupid people. Look at our former President, he just ignored all the rules and didn’t let it stop him. Stupid people don’t even think ahead and they certainly don’t think about rules. You can’t fix stupidity using rules, and trying to do that often just ends up making life worse for the smart people.

        • Anonymous says:

          Well it’s sad but a lot of adults in US has the IQ equivalent of a five-years old, including our former President. I would also like to think that the reason why we have so many stupid rules and regulations is because our nation has some many dumb people who would do dumb things if they are not in check. Who needs stringent laws in Switzerland?

      • Kids tend to be stupid because their minds are underdeveloped; this guy was a grown adult and wasn’t even giving his manga to kids or even going near any kids. Last I checked, bondage isn’t illegal here. I’m a huge fan of BDSM myself. Want to lock me up now, too? I might throw twine at someone!

        You’re funny.

        • “I said people MIGHT act things out.”

          So basically they’re arresting him on a hunch that he “might” do it.

          If that’s the case, they should just arrest people watching action films or playing FPS on the assumption that they MIGHT act things out.

        • >You said it yourself. You didn’t turn into a lolicon even though you were exposed to “bad ideas” from manga. Your own experience proves you’re wrong.

          Popular media of the now will always be the scapegoat for why people do stupid shit. Back in the 50s and such it was rock music. Then it was heavy metal. Now it’s video games and anime. Nevermind the fact that these people have possible previous criminal records or the police find proof of mental disturbance in the forms of things like disturbing drawings or writings the criminal created, it was the damn media’s fault for giving them the idea in the first place. Look at Columbine; they said it was the game Doom and such that contributed to the tragedy and it took forever to disprove because the common man was happy to have an explanation for their behavior beyond the fact that those two kids were demented monsters mentally. People can’t believe we are capable of committing terrible crimes without being told by god/media/your mom to do it; we have conscience and good and evil for many reasons. If someone does something fucked up, it will eb something in there already. if they claim that god/media/your mom told them to do it, they’re obviously incredibly unstable for not being able to discern a dream/a voice/fantasy from what’s actually going on.

          There’s nothing wrong with being a lolicon or shotacon at all, unless you actually DO move on to real children. If they never do, then the world is all the better for it.

          As I said, I like BDSM. Am I going to go tie people up and rape them? No, never. Yet people like you would categorize me as someone who “possible maybe could” do it because someone else did or someone in a comic did. Judge the person, not the thought or what they fap to.

          >Plus, child abuse has been around since the beginning of human history, long before manga even existed.

          So has everything else good and bad in history. It’s terrible but it won’t change anytime soon. It’s just the kind of creature we are. Morality is gray, which is why we can’t seem to agree on this at all.

          >Stop blaming bad ideas and instead blame bad actions.

          I have been. Are you even reading what I’m actually saying or just filtering out what you don’t like hearing others say to make me look like the badguy?

          Keep this up, I love a good debate.

        • Anonymous says:

          I said people MIGHT act things out. I am not saying everyone who was exposed to the idea will act it out. And I am not agreeing nor disagreeing with the sentence this guy gets since I don’t know the full details. I fully respect anybody’s freedom to view any images he/she want. And I wholeheartedly disagree with prosecuting people because of their beliefs. I don’t play a brother like that. Just don’t put words in my mouth.

        • Anonymous says:

          You said it yourself. You didn’t turn into a lolicon even though you were exposed to “bad ideas” from manga. Your own experience proves you’re wrong.

          Plus, child abuse has been around since the beginning of human history, long before manga even existed. Humans have been doing bad things all by themselves, long before they even invented the language to communicate “bad ideas” to each other. Stop blaming bad ideas and instead blame bad actions.

        • >But when you give people ideas(like from manga), you might run the risk of them acting it out.

          THOUGHTCRIME POLICE ALERT

          Seriously, what the fuck? If a person does something stupid like that, they obviously have some underlying problem to begin with. You’re all for locking us up when we have no intention of doing the crime. If the crime happens, it’s terrible indeed, but then you can arrest us.

          Most of the people who post here are as normal as can be. We just fap to a lot of fictional stuff but we’re smart enough to keep it fictional. Look at topics like this or any other one posted on this site involving any semblance of pedophilia; we will denounce IRL pedophilia until we’re blue in the face. We’re entirely harmless to real beings.

          >I myself had no idea that children can become sexual objects until I started watching animes(and no, I am not a lolicon).

          Sheltered much?

        • Anonymous says:

          No I don’t mean that;; All I am trying to say is people shouldn’t jump into conclusions that the sentencing is unjust without fully understanding the circumstances.

          Oh and whether he gave his manga to kids is beyond the point. If you don’t give people ideas, they won’t consciously think about it. But when you give people ideas(like from manga), you might run the risk of them acting it out. I myself had no idea that children can become sexual objects until I started watching animes(and no, I am not a lolicon). I don’t know. Maybe banning is a little tooharsh. But it is not something that should be encouraged.

  • Anonymous says:

    so whats the punishment for being a sex offender in the US? gotta put that sign in your yard stating your a sex offender right or sumthin along those lines? compare that to 15 yrs for having loli manga >.<

  • I spent 13 years of my life in Catholic schooling, and I can say this, nothing but a bunch of moralfag hypocrites. I remember one teacher back in 11th grade when I had to take a class on Catholic social justice. He literally said “As Catholics we have no right to judge others or interfere with their way of life, unless they are living lives that are deemed unfit by Catholic standards.”

    Seriously, God help us if Catholics gain power in this country. I’m praying for the legalization of gay marriage just because it will show the weakness of the church.

  • “The US Postal Service later conducted a search of his domicile and found the rest of his collection.”

    Does this means that this could have been avoided if he used UPS international instead? How exactly was this loli manga discovered?

  • Honestly guys… do you really have the grounds to bitch about ‘morals’ and ‘what is right’ when you are clearly getting off to children being abused? Sure it’s a manga drawing with fictional characters… but your arguments seem to have little base when you’re bitching about how the American justice system is so ‘immoral’ and ‘wrong’ … when you’re getting off to little children being sexually abused.

        • What’s there not to understand? He’s on the Anti-Censorship/Pro Freedom of Expression side and arguing independently from Anon@13:00. Anon@19:49, which I responded to, just can’t believe that someone could say something so stupid, and therefor is accusing ChonnyD of trolling – independently from Washi and Anon@13:00, but perhaps inspired by the huge amount of replies the supposed troll managed to provoke. I however, don’t think that ChonnyD was trolling and think he’s just genuinely ignorant.

          Any questions left? =P

    • Well, count the victims in thise case. I count 1: the guy who bought the loli/shota manga. He’s been persecuted, publically humiliated pretty much beyond redemption, and hasn’t actually hurt anyone. I’m not sure how you can conclude that that isn’t fundementally wrong.

      Fapping to that kind of stuff might not be ‘morally’ right, as you say, but morality is a shaky concept, heavily influenced by opressive religious guilt. Surely it makes more sense to support a principle like freedom from persecutation and freedom of expression/thought than to morally crusade against people who don’t share your moral outlook. Your thinking is very shallow.

    • Anonymous says:

      ChonnyD, you talk about morality, but are you basing them on feelings or logic? You don’t seem to be making any logical arguments, so you’re probably basing them on feelings. However, moral behavior does not always “feel” moral.

      For example, it is moral to demand that all humans have a right to a fair trial. But that doesn’t “feel” moral, because our instinctual reflexes are to be angry and vengeful. Those self-righteous feelings actually create very immoral, murderous lynch mobs. If we instead use higher logic, we get the judicial system with its rules of evidence and witnesses, which for all its faults is still much more moral than a raging lynch mob.

      Likewise, the instinct to protect children means that drawings of child abuse often “feel” wrong. But when you analyze it logically, a drawing is not reality. There is no actual abuse happening, and the drawing is only a victimless expression of thought. In fact, to criminalize such victimless drawings is to establish thought control and censorship, which actually harms real people. Therefore, the moral action is to support the freedom to make such drawings, even if it doesn’t “feel” right.

      You don’t have to like it, and I can relate to that feeling. It’s perfectly normal. But remember, any moral code worth a damn is not based on transient emotional feelings, including feelings such as “like” or “dislike”.

      After all, if moral behavior always “felt” good and right, then children would never misbehave, no one would ever hurt each other, and we wouldn’t need moral codes in the first place. However, the reality is that being moral means ignoring personal feelings when higher logic dictates otherwise.

      Sometimes you’ll get lucky and the moral action will feel good. But many other times the moral action will not feel good at all. That’s life.

    • Chonny, your arguing is like trying to connect the dots that if a butterfly farts in Peru there’ll be a torrential rainstorm in Paraguay.

      Morality is about ‘conventional’ right and wrong, and not everyone shares the same values. Doesn’t mean the others are wrong or you right.

    • the other anon says:

      I think it’s not much different from enjoying violence in films and videogames provided that one can clearly distinguish fiction from reality. If no real person or property is harmed in the process, why bother stopping them? Just because I enjoy watching Hannibal Lecter fucking around with other people doesn’t mean I keep a stock of human organs in my fridge or something.

      • Anonymous says:

        Yeah. I played video games and “killed” fictional people. But nobody said anything about it cause its not REAL! when a guy bought a manga with nekid girls inside it they go berserk and he got 15y+250k. I say both its the same thing, The same fucking ballpark. I say fuck circumstances. Those feminists/authoratah should go to the fucking games/film industry too. Where the hell all of these double standards came from!

    • Witchcraft
      – The private practice of worship.
      – Hunted down for abusing fictional demons.
      – People feared for their unborn child.
      – 90% were woman.

      Lolicraft
      – The private practice of worship.
      – Hunted down for abusing fictional loli.
      – People feared for their unborn child.
      – 90% were man.

    • Are you shitting me?! The department of Justice’s Correctional departments are BIG BUSINESS. They employ tens of thousands to ‘keep the people safe’ by locking up the bad elements of society….. which is of course, pure and utter bullshit.

      No one is completely safe. It’s proven year after year, but nobody wants to hear about it (those who are in a position to do anything about it at any rate). It’s too much like actual work.

  • LOLI KEEPER says:

    HEY!!!! i have a lot of loli manga thanks to many websites, and i fap to them eternally. so, why im still free and he ordered one, one loli manga, and he’s punished… (i know, the logic was thrash)

  • Fuck, I’ve been watching this case for some time now. What a terrible outcome.. 15 years, what the fuck. People need to learn the difference between reality and fantasy. The guy was causing no harm to anyone.

  • the other anon says:

    If a tree falls in the middle of a forest and nobody is there to hear it, will it make a sound?

    If fictional 2D loli and shota are fucked in manga and nobody is there to read it, will their chastity be kept intact?

    • It’ll make a sound regardless if anyone is around to hear it. It’s like saying if a forest was on fire, and if no one was there to see it, was it a forest fire? Well fuck yea. Logic and science will tell you this.

      I’m sorry for being a dick, its just that I hate that saying, because it makes no sense.

      • Anonymous says:

        but the saying makes a valid point in the theory of existence: if there is an atomic collision in the far reaches of space but there is no living material to analyze and understand it, then does that collision have any significance or value? So the tree quote is really a clever method of asking what is the importance of relative existence and whether existence is substantiated by recognization and not by mere existence itself.

        Lolis own.

    • /b/, more like banning rule 34 in general, lol

      “that sandwich and Diet pepsi are illustrated in obscene acts, cannot be accepted”

      I don’t blame the government or anything

      just this happens because of western society as a whole. Despite it’s popularity, manga/anime aren’t “that” mainstream here compared to the other things in the media here in the us, especially in Iowa I think (well, here in Cali, I know more people who know anime)

      all of these events basically reflects how those who haven’t heard of what manga/anime really is think of some of it’s more 18+ material and tend to discriminate/prosecute/ridicule it

      hell, even if some guy didn’t browse with any questionable crap, people around the us who haven’t heard of anime/manga or would care less of it would still judge or throw stones or assumptions at you because of your hobby

      especially around my school, anime fans are often looked at as “weird” or “social outcasts” even though I have a decent # of friends

      • Anonymous says:

        It’s notable that in the end, the only charges they could stick on Handley were obscenity-related charges. The thing about “obscenity” is that it depends entirely on “community standards”, ie: where you live. Something obscene in one place might not be obscene in another place. Iowa’s part of middle America, which is generally a pretty conservative, uptight place.

        • Anonymous says:

          i guess Iowa wants to set as an example to other states. Cuz they have one of the highest college graduate rates in the States. They’ll make themselves feel better if they make themselves look a bit more civilized than the others states. Though i doubt someone would give a damn about some goody two shoes state.

        • I wasn’t saying I wasn’t in favor of all of this

          I agree these charges are shit but as I said, a lot of these things happen more if you live in MIDDLE FUCKING AMERICA, or worse, the SOUTH

          I was saying how this type of bullshit happens is where you live

          calm down.

  • thatz ridiculous and scary. like my fellow poster concluded, these are f*cking comic books. we can’t blame the dude for bailing out, though. a two year legal battle would bankrupt almost anyone from a middle class background. i mean, the graphic sexualization of loli characters isn’t my personal cup of tea but what of all the somewhat ambiguously aged catgirls and classic anime hotties? are they next?

  • Anonymous says:

    Even the most heinous pornographic drawings and cartoons are still inherently morally superior to any pornographic photos and films.

    There’s a lot of criminal exploitation and shady pressure happening even in “legitimite” real-humans porn. Whenever real-life humans are used to sate basic carnal desires, there is always the chance that the creation of the product may have involved some form of exploitation and violation of human dignity. In contrast, the nature of fictional drawings and cartoons make such exploitation impossible.

    Now you know why some people find real-3D porn to be pig disgusting… because with real-3D porn, there’s always the chance that someone had to degrade themselves to make it.

    No matter how disgusting the drawings can be, the fake porn is always morally superior porn.

    • Anonymous says:

      Bullplop, Anonymous! The fact is that there is NO criminal exploitation (unless you are talking about underage people starring in porn, which I personally don’t have a problem with as long as they agree to it ahead of time!) and there is no ‘shady pressure’. The fact is that everyone in modern porn productions goes into those things with ‘eyes wide open’, at least for adult porn.

      For child porn? The only reason that children and teenagers are able to be ‘forced’ into that is because we have driven it underground and given it to criminal organizations like the Italian mob and Russian mafia!

      There is NO violation of human dignity in pornography…. if the person in question doesn’t want to star in pornography and is being forced, she should yell, scream and struggle for ALL SHE/HE is worth and go to the fucking police afterwards!

    • 3D porn is so widely acceptable socially that even though I tell people I rather watch 2D because in 3D porn people are actual human beings with lives and families and could as you said most probably been pressured or are poor and it prevents me from enjoying as the fantasy it’ supposed to be.

  • WTH. That means if someone sends me some anime wherein an animal is being hurt, i.e. a dog, then i’ve committed animal violence. In animes like dragonball where someone dies, if i read it or watch it then i’ve committed murder. Seriously, all this has got to fucking stop. I’d rather have a chaotic world without order than this pile of garbage.

    • Anonymous says:

      Have to agree totally…. world without ‘order’ (and order is apparently forcing the ‘morality’ of the minority on everyone else right now!) is less good than world of chaos.

      Really though….. would a world where children can be sexually propositioned OUT IN PUBLIC where society can TRULY protect them from forced sexual encounters, where lolicon could be sold OUT IN PUBLIC, where the sexual ‘morality’ is not forced on people unless they are causing physical injury to someone else without that person’s permission, etc…… really be a bad thing? Personally, I don’t think it would be!

      • Morality of the minority? Where’d you get that?

        In any case i’m fed up with people in general from all the shit i’ve seen heard and experienced first hand. People are fundamentally fucked up and that’s what makes them people. It’s not some emo shit not even weltschmerz.

  • THe MNigmatic MOondoggiebuiscuit says:

    Idiot! The reason with haing scanlators is because of this! What a moron! Insead of DL and print the thing or go to Japan himself he just ordered the thing…. AMERCANS ARE SUPER LAZY!

    • Anonymous says:

      Not low enough! Personally, I think that anyone over 3 should have the right to vote in this country, since they are living here and anything done to this country also affect them in some fashion.

      Better thing: lower the damn ‘age of consent’, if not totally get rid of it… it was NEVER meant to protect children, it was meant to protect adults from doing their damned jobs and monitoring who their children are hanging out with on a daily basis.

  • LiveByTheSword says:

    Okay, why is shouta referenced as a loli in this article. More importantly, what happened to customer privacy in mailing service. If I had birthday money in cash sent by mail, I would not want some random postal worker opening it, because he or she was curious, and taking it.

  • I wish Sumaga would be translated already…good progress though I think.

    Oh, and that’s what happens when you confess your lolism to officials. Shouldve said they were Yaoi coloring books or something.

    • Anonymous says:

      No, it doesn’t. Frankly, I told the FBI I was into lolicon stuff, and they were like “Whatever… you don’t have any real child porn with real kids in it, right?” I told them “No… though I don’t really have a problem with the stuff I’ve seen on the internet with real kids (it’s mainly just children posing nude anyway, there aren’t very many things with children actually being doinked!).”

      They asked me “Do you go searching for that stuff?” I told them “No… just comes up every now and again in a search on Google/MSN/Yahoo.”

      They left and haven’t been back in 6 years now.

  • Anonymous says:

    wow…fuck. feel really sorry for the guy and also makes me reconsider buying 1000s of loli manga over in japan this summer… so if i get caught by US customs coming back the pond- 15 years + 250K? Guess i should consider renting out in tokyo =/

  • Eh?! O.o

    So, it comes down to this now?

    GADS man, he should have ~ *stood his ground* ~ and fought it all the way.

    Hmm, it seems that there (may) have been additional pressures placed on him, outside of court.

    Once he was placed in the public eye… I am VERY sure he was harassed and fun of… and of course the (added unseen) pressures of being talked about behind his back, (plus) the reputation damaging factor…

    ~ like hauntedskin stated at the beginning of this report:

    “Now this worries me. I wish he had not caved in. Every bible thumping moralist must licking his/her chops over this…dammit!”

    I must agree…

    • Anonymous says:

      Hey, I have told people that I am into lolicon manga, and most of them once I come out say that they have seen it and neither like or dislike it.

      There was only ONE person who had a problem, and he was one of those ‘ultra religious’ idiots who everyone else there disliked intensely but wouldn’t say that to his face.

  • When I hear this kind of stuff(freedom of expression and other freedoms being attacked) is happening in the develop nations make me glad(only a little) I live in a underdeveloped country(third world countries have less money to waste on this bullshit[except China and muslim countries]).

  • Wow, this guy should have at least put up a better fight.

    not so surprised the CBLDF seems displeased with this too.

    but the CBLDF will probably be doing more shit loads of research, donations, activist movements or whatever, even after this case, just in case something else happens.

    they gained a first amendment victory in this case with having the judge rule out the act’s unconstitutional material, which dropped some of the charges, that’s a start but a long way still to go

  • woot!! 0_0!

    lucky i’m not in US… i can oder or keep as many as i can of manga loli or drawing loli picture… hahaha…

    but sometime got ridiculous law in some country… even law for heavy crime also cannot compare to this kind of law…

  • Yeah this guy caved in.

    I would have fought to the end and also
    argue about how harmless loli manga is.

    And why is he the only guy getting fucked in
    the ass with the 15 year sentencing? What
    about those who provided him with said loli
    manga?

    I feel as if the system is purposely letting
    overseas distributors welcome loli manga so
    that the authorities can move in on who is
    a possible pedophile.

    In fact i don’t recall reading that this Iowa
    guy was a real pedophile.