Minister: “Who Cares If Freedom of Speech is Curtailed”

beako-loli-ban

Japan’s Minister of Internal Affairs and Communications, 鳩山 邦夫 / Kuni Hatoyama, has expressed his contempt for such inconsequential matters as freedom of expression if they get in the way of protecting the children.

Speaking in favour of even harsher laws against underage porn, he had this to say:

“It must all be banned. Compared to the benefits of freedom of expression, preventing the human rights violations caused by underage porn is far more important – who cares if freedom of expression is massively curtailed.”

His statements are consistent with his political record, where he has long pressed for a western style lolicon witch-hunt.

The statement was made personally in response to a question posed in the Diet, though this is hardly reassuring considering his post (he has also previously been Justice Minister).

For such a senior political figure to show such ignorance of the essential principle underlying all liberal societies seems to indicate the extreme lack of approval Rozen Aso and his cabinet enjoys may not be unwarranted…

Even more disturbingly, he has long been a strident voice for the revision of Japan’s Constitution, on the basis that it is an American “imposition”. Doubtless Japan would find itself with a very different constitution were he the writer.

He might also be recalled as the politician responsible for imposing fingerprinting on non-Japanese entering Japan, when he made a curious statement claiming “a friend of a friend” knew an Al-Qaida terrorist involved with the slaughter at Bali, and had been warned off going there.

Via Asahi.

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115 Comments

  • Banitol 455mg.

    When shit hits the fan, and you can’t just waive it all, BANITOL.

    Recommended in the treatment of head-demanding angry pedophobic or feminist mobs, severe and prolonged exposure to foreign cultures.

    Dosage:
    1.83 mg/kg Child (1 – 14yrs)
    5.90 mg/kg Adult

    And remember kids, 15 will get you 20.
    WINRARS DON’T DO DRUGS! (They usually become inFamous as an heroes, before having discovered drugs).

  • Anonymous says:

    Under current law it is an offence to possess indecent photographs (including videos) and pseudo-photographs of children. However, it is not an offence to possess non-photographic visual depictions of child sexual abuse. The police and children’s welfare groups report a growing increase in interest in these images, including an increase in websites advertising this sort of explicit material.

    Police and children’s welfare groups are concerned that these images could fuel the abuse of real children by reinforcing abusers’ inappropriate feelings towards children. These images, particularly as they are often in a cartoon or fantasy style format, could be used in ‘grooming’ or preparing children for sexual abuse.

  • So when people say lolicon keeps pederasts on a leash, they are saying they are pederasts that won’t doubt on raping a child if lolicon is banned?
    Sick.

    And then they dare say lolicon harms nobody. lol.

    • Distorting the statements of others won’t prove your point, but what you’re saying makes no sense anyway. If people who like lolicon are dangerous but don’t touch real children, and suddenly start doing it when lolicon is banned, then what harm has lolicon ever done?

      a … people who like lolicon are dangerous
      b … people who like lolicon rape a child
      c … lolicon is available
      d … lolicon is dangerous

      Your axioms:
      a ^ c -> !b
      a ^ !c -> b

      Your claim:
      |= (a ^ c -> !b) ^ (a ^ !c -> b) => d

      This can be proven wrong by simply providing an interpretation (assigning logical values to logical variables) that is not a model for this formula:

      a=1, b=1, c=0, d=0

      (1 ^ 0 -> !1) ^ (1 ^ !0 -> 1) => 0
      (0 -> 0) ^ (1 ^ 1 -> 1) => 0
      (0 -> 0) ^ (1 -> 1) => 0
      1 ^ 1 => 0
      1 => 0
      0

      As you can see, your claim cannot be derived from your axioms. In other words, you’re drawing false conclusions. Simple as that.

      Oh wait, I forgot. Moralfags don’t care about science.

      • Anonymous says:

        I was ASKING if that is what they mean BECAUSE I’ve read people saying that sort of things.

        Don’t get all ad hominem against me.
        I’m not a moralfag or whatever.
        Thanks a lot for the mathematic bullshit, like real life worked that way.
        I WAS ASKING, and judging from your personal defensiveness, I already got my answer. THNXBAI.

        • Look, you made it sound like people who say that lolicon prevents pedophiles from touching real children would not hesitate raping a child should lolicon ever be banned. You put this as a question, but it sounded to me like you were already convinced of this, and still does even after re-reading your post several times.

          But oh well, to give you an answer: No, I don’t think anyone meant to imply that. I don’t know how you even got this idea. Neither here nor anywhere else have I ever read something that would suggest such an interpretation.

          But even if there are people out there who think this way, my point still stands: In no way does this make lolicon dangerous. It’s the people who are dangerous, not lolicon.

          On a purely scientific note: Of course real life doesn’t work that way. But that’s only because no one can provide a system of axioms that accurately models real life. If this was possible, all we’d have to do to find answers for, well, everything is to query a computer with logic software installed. I merely used logic because I was bored and to point out that your argumentation (or what I misunderstood to be an argumentation) is flawed, not to prove that lolicon is harmless.

  • I don’t see why ban 2d lolis in japan,i mean it’s their culture of drawing XD.
    Normaly every country would ban 3d real lolis.As sometimes you can also have computer generated unreal 3d lolis.
    And country like japan should have their own opinions about laws and stuff and not try to pick them up from others.

    Anyway i do like how spain acts with everything about sex,porn,hentai and all there XD.
    Hope you don’t have 2d lolis banned there

  • Kuni Hatoyama…I heard of the guy through research reports on govt. but never thought he’d make a remark on this issue. The whole lolicon thing isn’t the matter that kinda ticks me off, more or less, it’s his remark about Freedom of Expression in GENERAL. Not to mention I’ve read he’s got some bad reputation around him in some cases, like snapping to a reporter who called him “Grim reaper” after an execution issue in japan. Yup, he ain’t lasting long.

    • I don’t know if I’d call this particular remark worse, but I agree. Seeing how things are in Japan politically right now, I’d expect him to resign or get kicked out in a couple of weeks anyway. Even Mr. Dollfag Prime Minister probably won’t last past this year, if that.

  • “Compared to the benefits of freedom of expression, preventing the human rights violations caused by underage porn is far more important – who cares if freedom of expression is massively curtailed”

    When did freedom of expression stop being a fundamental human right?

  • Disagree: The lolicon thing…he’s way too puritanical…almost like a Canadian…

    Agree: Everything else I kinda agree with. They should break free from the BS the Americans forced them into…and more importantly…racial PURITY is actually a good thing…

    If a country becomes TOO diverse, like Hong Kong, or other countries that started accepting filthy foreigners…the country’s atmosphere, and more importantly, it’s identity will start breaking apart…

    Of course, extreme xenophobia isn’t exactly a good thing either…but in Japan’s case right now, its complicated…they should seriously restrict the amount of foreigners coming in…but at the same time not be too…well just look at their relationship with China and Korea.

      • good job voting for those politicians…well maybe you didn’t…but good job to the canadians who gave the conservatives enough votes to win again…and by that, I mean 30% of the small % of canadians who even bothered voting this time….

    • Speaking as a filthy foreigner hoping to spend a few years of his life living in Japan one day, I happen to like most Japanese people being so accepting of our strange foreign ways, and letting me stay in places other than Dejima. Also, apart from a genetic standpoint perhaps, the Japanese people are far less all-alike than most nationalist “wareware nihonjin” rhetoric spouting politicians would have you think.

    • It’s funny, though – some of the European states are relying on the “filthy foreigners” coming in to avoid negative population growth. Well, it’s a somewhat similar case here in the States, where the Latino part of the population is the fastest growing by far, so much so that people are saying Spanish is going to be equal to English in importance here in thirty years or so.

      • Hmmm…I dont know where you live…but people who lived all of their life in North America (as in, Canada and USA)wouldn’t be able to understand…

        I’m not saying racial purity in the sense of what KKK is going for, no, that would be racial…supremacy. It’s very hard to explain…and most people would brand it as racist in the west…damn political correctness. On the other hand…explaining why Racial IMpurity is a bad thing is easier. Just look at the ****ed up mess that CANADA is. We have this race spewing crap about that race. This race of cops beating up that race of civilians. This race’s church being burned by that race, and that race’s church advocating burning down that race’s holy building etc…

        Anyways…it IS a bad thing for a country to lose it’s identity…anybody with HALF a brain can easily identify why…this post is already too long, but I shouldnt have to explain why…
        But if you STILL can’t figure it out…well, google Planet of Hats.

        • I’m from Canada–Toronto, specifically, so… uhh… the most multicultural city in the world, so I hear.

          Anyway, we… don’t have a lot of problems here, racially speaking.

          Like, ok, I don’t know what you were talking about before but most of the crimes here are not racially motivated.

          And, well, any country’s identity is transient because, well, the identity is based on the values of the people and those, like enemies and allies, change over time and… uhhh other Metal Gear Solid 3 sociological life lessons.

        • Are you (Planet of Hats mentioning anon) suggesting that loss of national identity means turning the entire human race into interchangeable generic carbon-based lifeform units? Your example of interracial conflicts in Canada sounds like a symptom of racial identity being valued too highly in a de-jure multicultural society, rather than a case of “oh noes, who let all this riff-raff into our place”. Oddly enough, when I lived in London I never saw much of that sort of thing. Muggers were far too busy checking out how much people’s pockets were bulging to bother looking at their skin colour.

        • opps…let me add in one more thing, despite the fact that it’s too hard to fix now…but foreigners visiting a country equals to…

          inreased chance of MISSIONARIES arriving…spreading the word of what ever BS they believe in…seriously, there werent so many goddamn churches 8 years ago…but dammnit, those douchebags came along with the other foreigners…

    • Yea, that is the problem evident in New Zealand: our national and the Maori identity are getting swamped here.

      Biggest city in NZ (Auckland)often seems to have more chinese (no offense or racism meant) than any other race. Our national holiday (waitangi day) is a joke. No-one cares about it, out identify is so… muddled now.

  • If this is, once again, about 2D lolis, it’s the same old story.

    It’s a dangerous combination: fanatical moralism, prejudice, taking decisions over assumptions and personal opinnions, avoiding further discussions and studies due to the subject being tabboo.

    First of all, we have the public opinnion, which assumes that only because you like 2D lolis, this automagically implies that someday you’ll try to abuse a real child.

    Prejudice.

    Added to the fact that nowadays, it’s not considered “normal” to be sexually aroused by minors… it’s like you need an ID check first to say “this girl is hot”.

    Fanatical Moralism.

    Then organizations and politicians states officially that people who like lolis could turn up to be pedophiles, and stuff like manga leading to it too, while they have absolutely no scientific proof or even statistical data to say so.

    After hearing of one or another case of an arrested pedophile that also had loli manga, they start thinking that this is the case of all pedophiles.

    Assumptions.

    With all that in mind, and being disgusted by pedophiles, and also fearing for their own children, they decide to make a political move without thinking straight, without having hard evidence, without considering that might be some people that likes 2D lolis but never in their life considered abusing a real child.

    Prejudice and judgement based on personal opinnions alone.

    Finally, considering that the public opinnion or their own baseless opinnion is enough to create laws that might put innocent people in jail, or even fearing that they might be wrong, they also end up refusing further studies and statistic data to know what’s really happening.
    Case of the UNICEF lady saying that Manga is poisoning the world, when it’s a broadly known fact that Japan has the lowest rates of child abuse cases in the world.

    Tabboo.

    This is a sensitive matter. Most people try to avoid it, but when they do approach it, it’s mostly to be against the minority. Which are lolicons.

    It’ll take long, if ever, for a public figure to admit being a lolicon and defending his/her rights.

    At most, people will be for freedom of speech or freedom of expression… which ends up being a defense not as effective as the attack, which is focused on the issue.

    We’ve seen it happen with tons of stuff.
    Most fetiches went that way, sexuality as a whole also went through this process some decades ago. Not to mention rock music, violent movies, games, violent games, erotic books, nudity in art, japanese animation on western society, and just about anything that wasn’t “the norm” in that specific period of time.

    We just have to remember that some people burned because they believed the Earth wasn’t the center of the universe, or were demoralized because they said the Earth is round, not flat.

    I’m not saying that lolicons will change the world, or make a revolution, but suffer the same type of prejudice. Just like nazis assuming the jewish people were inferior, non-lolicon are accusing lolicons of being, or tending to be criminals, without any proof of that.

    It’s like Minority Report. Only the lolicon precrime is child abuse, and instead of some psychics… precogs predicting the future, they have.. nothing.

    • Just to expand your comments some, just google the term, “Sexting crime” where these minors are being charged with possessing, manufacturing, and distributing child porn because they are taking nude pics of themselves (manufacturing), storing it on their cellphones (possessing), and sending it to their boyfriends (distributing). The boys at the other end are being hit with simple possession. If convicted the girls can face between 5 to 20 years in prison, the boys 3 to 5. All will be considered dangerous sex offenders and will stay on the list for the rest of their lives.

      The last serious case was a 13-year old boy being charged with possessing child pornography because he had a semi-nude (not totally nude) pic on his cell of his 13-year old GF.

      They are all dangerous sex offenders and in a few more years they will snatch your kids and do terrible things to them.

      /sarcasm

      That’s the US for you.

  • I think he is referring to the 2D stuff, and as a spanish speaker, the amount of lolicon sites (in spanish of course) is just mind blowing.

    Also, I’m a bit jealous for not having 1TB worth of lolis (yet).

    And yeah, what happened to the random avatars???
    It almost feels like being a mini-Artifact, not that matter, but it takes away your uniqueness (IMO).

    • “I’m a bit jealous for not having 1TB worth of lolis (yet).”

      1TB de lolicon siempre con un doujin xD , I started my collection with Sakura Card Captor (The Queen of Lolicon) and I’m a bit jealous for not having 3TB of lolis like one guy from Panama called “Lord Byegone”.
      me gustaria compartir lo que tengo, pero probablemente terminaria como “KK3K”
      http://hmanga-kk3k.blogspot.com/

  • Lack of freedom of expression = Lack of democracy.

    And he says he do all of this in order to prevent the human rights violations. Excuse meeeeeeeeeee! Freedom of expression is one of the basic human rights. How can you say you care for human rights? YOU IDIOT!!! It’s like these villains in anime which say “For the sake of humanity I will kill all people in the planet”.

    • “Lack of freedom of expression = Lack of democracy.”
      No. Not really.
      Democracy exists in many different forms other than “US democracy ©”

      “And he says he do all of this in order to prevent the human rights violations. Excuse meeeeeeeeeee! Freedom of expression is one of the basic human rights.”
      No. Food, life protection, those may be basic human rights but that doesn’t mean there are homeless people.

      “It’s like these villains in anime which say “For the sake of humanity I will kill all people in the planet”.”
      LOL. See? That’s why they want to ban lolicon. Some people just can’t see a difference between real life and anime.
      If you honestly cared about human rights, you’d worry and complain about restrictions in Saudi Arabia, not about lolicon.

  • I am from the third world and I find news about lolicon fun because they not affect me at all.
    In fact, my computer has almost 1 Terabyte of lolicon images and I can sleep peacefully.

    En pocas palabras, yo le digo a la party van
    JODETE!! xD

  • wow… they have the time to give attention & protection to things which doesn’t exist and target those who are actually not doing any harm and put the blame on people and citizens who has lower civil status by simply saying they’re the root of all the problem…

    is this their idea of what “security” should be? not letting a tiny problem be as long as its visible? clean the tiny stain on the front and ignore the blood splattered right at the back. they can’t even stop those real big time criminals, terrorists, rich people who rob those who are having financial problems without a care just to make themselves richer, people who actually kidnap innocent children, mercilessly taking their organ for black marketing.

    some idea on how to fix the global economic crisis huh? …or just some bastard who wants to win the popularity contest… sick f*ck

  • This eerily reminds me of an article I just read at Wired magazine that says the US may try to keep a record of activity from every IP for up to two years!

    How it works is like when a government agency can track someone’s calls, see how long they called, to whom, when, how many times, etc, but this legislation would be the equivalent to listening in on the call too. O_O;

  • ”He might also be recalled as the politician responsible for imposing fingerprinting on non-Japanese entering Japan”

    So this is the asshole that did that. Nothing good can come from people like him.

    • George W Bush gave us the Patriot Act and Homeland Security and all the abuses of power which came with it, but that didn’t stop people from re-electing him again for another four years ><.

      Fucking sheep. They’ll follow anyone who promises to keep them safe (even IF it’s an illusion of safety), even if that person/group abridges their Freedoms to do so. Never comprehending that THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A SAFE PLACE (in practice).

  • Actually this may make him quite popular among certain groups. Unicef (the idiots who care more about fake porn than actually saving the lives of children by sending food and what have you.) is probably one such group that will jump on board with this. What I find ironic is that by putting these restrictions on people the people will rise up. Considering what these people will rise up for (pun intended) it may actually cause more problems than actual good.

    This minister is a complete moron or an asshole at the very least. Look at his comments about the death penalty and the bali bombing. He does not seem that bright either and seems to resemble religious extremists.

    The biggest fear is the fact he wishes to get rid of freedom of speech and expression. If this is gone the crime rate will soar because people can’t get their jollies in any other form, people will be pissed in general and some sort of big event would occur in the near future which would screw up a lot of productive things that has come out of Japan. Not to mention there economy would become even worse because this would mean a restriction on hentai, games and anime and a large source of income would be gone. Someone has to fight it over there if push comes to shove. I’d do it in a heartbeat over here and if the guy in Iowa(?) gets convicted then the people in the U.S. should as well. When government controls the thoughts and actions of the people it’s time to get a new government.

    • The thing is, it’s really kind of hard for someone to come out in public in support of this kind of material, even if it should reasonably be considered legal according to the current laws. If this stuff ends up getting banned, I honestly can’t see too many people marching in the streets protesting over it. Well, maybe in Akihabara, but that’s it.

  • How the fuck is lolicon causing human rights violations? Who is getting hurt?

    I’m raging so much. Curtailing freedom of speech for what must be 100s of 1000s of fans isn’t something to take lightly.

    People like this must think that suppressing one little thing is no big deal… which is true. But there’s a massive difference between nothing, and just a tiny bit because it paves the way for even more censorship.

    Anyway, I still want to know HOW LOLICON IS CAUSING HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS. DETAILED ANSWER PLZ, NOTHING VAGUE.

    • HOW LOLICON IS CAUSING HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS you ask? It’s NOT. There no way to answer your question. Yes, real child pornography should be banned, and the makers/sellers hunted down and thrown in a dungeon for the rest if their lives. But noooooooo. They go after IMAGINARY child porn insted of making an effort and helping the real children who need saving. I ball bullshit on this.

  • If anime/cartoon characters get human rights we better start suing them too, there are endless amount of series featuring murder, killing, raping etc. The artists should also be hold responsible for letting it happen. It is gonna be an easy case thought, there is always shitload of witnesses and you can go to the comicstore and buy the evidence.

  • When the hell did people start confusing drawn images with tangible, real things? It’s pretty dangerous to tell a people that you can’t write about something, can’t draw something, can’t even THINK about something, because you think it is wrong.

    I think we call all agree that actually doing sexual things with a living, breathing child is wrong. But drawing a picture?

      • Well, while I spit on his anti-lolicon opinions, the other things mentioned is quite likeable.

        It is about time that Japan rewrites the constitution that was forced on them during the occupation by the Americans. About time that they force out all the Amercian military too, and demolishes their disgusting military bases.

        The finger-printing is brilliant too, helps to keep the trash out of the country. Japan is one of the most clean countries in the world after all, both in the matter of material trash and human trash. 98,5% native Japanese in the country, beautiful numbers.

        • And I think it’s disgusting that Narcissist describes 98% of Japan being Japanese as “beautiful numbers”.

          I’ll always love America because we aren’t nearly as close-minded and xenophobic, and allow people to live here if they put fourth the effort to. In Japan, there’s “no non-Japanese” signs on bars and they’re far from accepting non-yellow people.

        • Narcissist is one of the typical disgusting xenophobic Asians that thinks having slit eyes = better.

          JAPAN IS SO GREAT! WE HAVE NO PROBLEMS AT ALL UNLIKE AMERICA AND WE’RE A CLEAN COUNTRY AND AND AND

        • Narcissist its because of the American Constitution that your allowed to speak your mind. Without it the Internet and all forms of media would be different. The American Constitution is the main template for many democratic countries. The right to free speech is the whole basis of our society.

          There are many countries that have free speech but its so curtailed that its hard to say if it is free speech.

          Its wacko liberals like you who say one thing yet expect and want another. “oh I hate america but please dont take my lolis Japan” I bet you if they rewrite the constitution all Genere of Anime will be heavily scrutinized and the stuff that we’ve enjoyed will cease to exist due to ‘prohibition’ on all forms of anime.

          Just remember…. if America could not stop its dependence on booze through the ‘prohibition’ where the American populous outcries to force a change. No way that the Japanese Constitution will change as long as there’s enough young to mid aged people that will outcry to overturn and keep the Constitution intact.

          About the bases without America there as a looming threat. S.Korea would be a huge crater in the ground and Japan may be under communistic rule as there’s not enough raw materials to create a massive fleet for defense nor enough personnel that will be willing to serve their own country.

          Besides why kick out free security. We put our own men and women in harms way and Japan and the rest of the countries we have bases in dont have to put their personnel in harms way.. IF we pull out there will be a overwhelming outcry from governments to have us come back begging for US troops to be stationed because all it takes is one country to start invading and you’ll hear the line “HELP US AMERICA WERE SORRY FOR KICKING YOU OUT” (express crying)

        • >It is about time that Japan rewrites the constitution that was forced on them during the occupation by the Americans.

          Canada tried to re-write it’s constitution in 1982, and we’ve been f*cked ever since. We’ve almost had to go to war with ourselves over it. If you want to make an important change to your constitution, make an important change to it. That’s the beauty of democracy. Don’t just declare open season on your most important document.

          >About time that they force out all the Amercian military too, and demolishes their disgusting military bases.

          Cry moar dirty hippie.

          >The finger-printing is brilliant too, helps to keep the trash out of the country.

          Racism goes both ways.

        • iragedsohard says:

          @Narcissist
          I may not like your extremism, but you do have some very good points and intelligent answers.

          Anyway, I…I-.. gu-… guess I couldn’t have said it better myself. Don’t get the wrong idea Narcissist i-… it’s not like I li-… like you or anything, stupid.

        • Of course, as long as the military bases are there they serve as free protection. Japan would have to increase their defense a lot if they kicked them out.

          It is just like in Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei where they make fun of Japan and other countries which have the mind-set “America will save us!”.
          It is always like that. As soon as there is unrest people go “Save us America please please!”, but when everything is safe and sound they go “I hate Bush that bastard crycrycry”. This applies mainly to the disgusting left-wing people that I hate so very passionately.

          And the finger-printing might not help with native terrorists, but it will for example when they have G8 meetings and such. I read about a lot of people who were denied entry to the country during the last one.
          Like that person who lifted to Japan from Putinland (read: Russia), or some other east-Europe country, with various tankers and such to protest against the G8 meeting. When he arrived he was denied entry and was forced to stay on the tanker until it turned back lol…
          It is always during these cases I remember how much love Japanese politics. The system is a bit crude but they have strong opinions that many other countries wouldn’t dare to have.

        • Won’t happen though. They actually pay the Americans to maintain their bases there.

          The fingerprinting also won’t do anything to protect them from Japanese terrorists like the Aum Shinrikyo who used the sarin gas in Tokyo. That organization still exists even today:

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aum_Shinrikyo#After_1995

          Honestly, I pity the Japanese. They were very kind to a foreigner like myself and I think a lot of them really do mean well. They’ve got a rapidly aging population and look like they’re going to have to rely on an increase in immigration to combat it. But of course the increase of foreigners is something they are ill-prepared for. It’s going to be a very different country in a few decades.

        • Couldn’t have said it better myself. Until people who like lolicon start going after real children there is no problem. And there is no proof that sex with underage children and lolicon are even remotely linked.