Epic vs Enix
- Categories: Games, News
- Date: Jan 3, 2009 03:42 JST
- Tags: Character Design, Cliff Bleszinski, Epic Games, Square Enix, Tetsuya Nomura
Veteran Final Fantasy designer Tetsuya Nomura, of Square Enix, is here pitted against veteran Gears of War designer Cliff Bleszinski, of Epic Games. Both now have careers on rather similar footings, though their design styles could not be further removed from one another.
It may be rather trite, but this definitely appears to be a case of East vs West; both styles are almost bordering on the absurd, although they do not necessarily look the worse for it.
The text accompanying each just gives their career outlines, and insists on telling us Nomura’s bloodtype…
Sorry, there are no polls available at the moment.
Gears of War is just too awesome in all aspects.
I agree.
but since this is an otaku Website
Well lets just say we know whose already gonna win
yeah sure because only otakus can distinguish between good characters designs and awesome characters designs…
give me a break, i really like gears but against Nomura’s designs they just don’t stand a chance…
this is a tough decision though i mean they’re both obviously insanely talented people.. >.< so i guess how well the game plays will sway each individual in voting… so to save my own ass so i dont cry at nite im not going to vote :P
They don’t? I see a huge error in Nomura’s designs, and that would be that THERE IS NO GENDER, everyone is androgynous. I agree with Kama. Just because it’s Final Fantasy it automatically wins.
yeah, there really isn’t much of a gender.
but I also think its a matter of taste, pretty boys vs. rugged boys (altho I give gears of war credit for its realism). But neither gives an in between, and I’d rather see them compared doing the opposite’s style before I judge
Nomura’s characters look completely girly. Gears’ soldier may look absurd, but I like them better than having some guys who look like women – or kids – as heroes.
If Nomura’s design was just a little manly, it would surpass Cliff’s in my opinion.
I have issues with both but what made my decision was strictly the character design.
Tetsuya’s are only marginally better than Cliff’s “refrigerator with a bowling ball on top” body type.
A bowling ball? I dunno, those heads are pretty square, cinder block I reckon.
Gears of war has sluggish controls. And before you say that people like me merely dislike it, you should take into account that I’ve beaten both games (GoW2 at home and GoW at a friend’s house, but we didn’t beat RAAM because we ran out of time). Otherwise, it’s a straightforward 3ps game with enough merits as it is.
I wonder if the programs they use are the same. It would be interesting to know if the same tool has something to do when it comes to conceptualizing.
Square have always used Softimage XSI, and before then Softimage 3D. As for what Enix use, I cannot answer.
They use their own middle-ware called Crystal Tools.
If only we could get something in-between.
hmmm….im sooo into RPG’s so….yeah the choice is obvious…east is a WIN for me in entertainment(games),porn(hentai),shows(anime/hentai) and etc..blah blah blah~
only thing i like about the west is barrack obama!
CliffyB is a cock.
I fucking hate Nomura. Jesus Christ look at the guy opposite Cole train.
Gears may look stupid but at least everyone knows that, some people actually take Nomura seriously as a designer. Those people are foolish.
Yeah…I mean come on, he only designed stuff for the Final Fantasy series, I mean, who ever heard of those games anyway? I mean hell, it’s not like he designed some really famous characters like Sephiroth……………….oh wait….
Popularity =/= quality, I am sorry to say. Not supporting the previous dude, but that is a poor argument. I’m sure you remember when boy bands were the shit during the late 90s, does that mean they were musical geniuses?
Anyway, despite my tendency to gravitate toward weeaboo levels, vote goes to Cliff. What pisses me off about Nomura is his male characters are always. fucking. androgynous. Give me a break, if the world looked like what Nomura apparently thinks it does, we’d never be able to tell men from women, and things would just be terribly awkward. Is he trying to create male models, or RPG hero’s?
Not to say I prefer GoW style, it’s merely the lesser of two evils. They really overdid the gritty, war-stricken characters, with giant fucking craters in their faces, but it’s an innovative attempt at making hero’s that don’t look like they squeal with girlish glee after killing some ridiculously powerful adversary that drops a sash that just matches PERFECTLY with their eyes.
I wasn’t talking about quality. I was responding to the part where he says that people shudn’t take Nomura seriosly.
They should’nt the man is a fucking hack.
Sora has zippers on his shoes. ON HIS FUCKING SHOES.
Don’t forget the zipper on Donald Duck’s hat.
Also, BELTS.
What’s wrong with zippers on those? I have zippers on my shoes. And I like how it looks.
Plus, some shoes with zippers are easier to wear.
ok yeah, seriously, i don’t see what’s wrong with zippers on shoes…
“ok yeah, seriously, i don’t see what’s wrong with zippers on shoes…”
lol
-and there we have it folks!
For fuck’s sake, you can blame that on disney. Nomura FTW!
omg ur fucking stupid
sephiroth is a blatant ripoff of Geralt of Rivia
Looking at a Geralt of Rivia, the only thing in common is the long silver hair (I guess you could say the big sword, but…4 foot compared to 10?)
Besides, games/Tv shows/movies/novels, freakin’ everything is a rip off nowadays. There can only be so many original designs, even if you come up with an idea, it has most likely already been thought of.
Anyway, they have a slight similarity at best, Sephiroth is in NO WAY a rip off.
Hardly, they have a slightly similar appearance thanks to the hair and masulcine appearance, but Sephiroth is in no way a rip off.
By the way, Geralt of Rivia is said to be a rip off of ‘Elric of Melnibone’. Just because two things are similar, doesn’t make them a rip off. There are only so many original designs/ideas, and no matter how original something is it will always be similar to something else, intended or not.
I actually prefer Akihiko Yoshida over Nomura and I only hate Nomura because of his over-favoritism with Cloud Strife, not giving other characters a savor (or even taste) of the limelight.
I’m more of a western gamer and Gears of war was indeed awesome so cliff bleszinski gets my vote. I haven’t played a Final Fantasy game and enjoyed it since IX
I believe Tetsu Nomura would win this one; just because he’s created such classical characters, and has such loyal fans. Though I do agree the last couple of Final Fantasy games aren’t upto par with his the previous games, I am a fan of his work and am super ecstatic to play FF13.
Gears of War is a typical boring western shooter. I’ve had it since it was release and I’ve played it for 10 minutes alone and 20 minutes co-op with a friend. Didn’t deserve any more of my time.
Winner is obvious.
Cliff – Dirty male nigga greased in oil with a big ugly armor.
Nomura – Hawt trappish male characters with good looking clothes.
Nomura looked pretty hawt in thumbnail view too.
1. I really hope you’re black yourself.
2. Of course they have big ugly armors and they’re greased in oil, it’s like the apocalypse.
Of course Nomura gets my vote, Kingdom Hearts, The World Ends with you, Final Fantasy, even Super Mario RPG, you can’t really deny his genius.
Do you really think that I would have used the word nigga negatively if I were “black” myself? Lol.
“Black people” in games are such a turn-off. No-one wants them there and no-one will play with them if it can be avoided, but they are included anyways because otherwise the developers risk getting attacked by some ridiculous equality organisation.
And no, it is not the apocalypse. It is just some random alien attack.
Actually, that not really the reason people don’t use black characters much. In western games, they use really annoyinf stereotypes. The black character will almost always be a big tough brute with heavy armor and a big gun, and will normally be too slow to take on the smaller characters. It gets boring. I wanna see a medium build black man, with fast movements. Anyone know aby western game like that?
In japanese shooters/rpgs/fighters, skin coloer is not used for a certain stereotype.
Also, I’m a big fan of weak looking characters that kick ass.
“I wanna see a medium build black man, with fast movements. Anyone know aby western game like that?”
NBA 2k9
What about Barret from ff7 ? He’s a black big though guy with a big gun :p
Left4Dead, but that’s all that is coming to mind.
@pedobear:……should have seen that comming :D
@Kas: Yes he is. Never said the japs don’t use the same stereotypes, just not so much
@iapfah
I believe he’s also the most educated one of the lot.
Uh….. CJ anyone?
CJ as in Carl Johnson from GTA:SA?
Mindless fangirl post is mindlessly fangirlish.
Lolz this person is so retarded
iam white i would happily play with a black character. so wtf this person stupid XD
Zack from dead or alive,he is fast and powerful
I Enjoy the shit out of both Designer’s. Gear’s of war because it’s so damn over the top. It’s every action movie and Action hero compressed into a small little package and given a healthy dose of Ammunition. But with Square . . .Shit i love about 85% of everything they put out. but mostly the story and not so much the Character’s. So i voted GoW Go Cog’s!
Wow, you hate black people even in video games. Well, that just proves you’re pretty much a sad, worthless piece of shit.
While I do prefer Nomura’s designs over human tanks, I have yet to play any JRPG that didn’t suck. They may as well drop the “RPG” and just call them JTurnbased or JBeat’emup. Those “genius” games you’ve mentioned are not worth my time.
i say Gears of War. becouse ive only ever really enjoyed one FF game.
I admittedly also only ever enjoyed one FF game to it’s fullest.
But I still spent about 15 times as much time on it than I ever did on GoW.
’sides, while I’m not a fan of the general androgynousness, Nomura at least knows what he’s doing when it comes to original clothing designs.
Blezinski looks like he took his ‘clothes’ (armor in this case) straight out of any generic gritty sci-fi shooter in existance. Poo.
I preffer Nomura For the Girls… Cole Train, Dom or Phoenix are fine but, look the dissidia characters.. there are awesome…
altho if they altered the sexes of the males, i do say that would be interesting… (not really, but that’s a lot of pretty boy faces that would work on girls)
Nomura’s char design is much more varied than the neanderthaler design of Gears of War. I never played FF but I enjoy GoW.
bleszinski phails because he dont have any hot chicks
if your a gamer you don’t need (HOT CHICKS) anyways FF always have giant breast, a loli, or too many belts that they really don’t need.
Don`t like Cliffy so much, so the other guy wins by default.
i got an asian’s bias and i don’t really play fps too much so my vote is for the guy on the right
Cliff since he makes real manly characters.
I agree. The GoW characters look like they can stop a truck with their bodies and they wouldn’t be afraid to either.
the others look like they wouldn’t try for fear of breaking a nail
I find them personally VERY unmanly, they are so unhuman a human can become in the end, and I’m not just referring to the loo, I’m referring to how they act and behave as well. Sure I can see why you think big and kick ass is nice, but it’s as far as reality as it gets, Epix make the most and biggest stereotype mashosts on the market.
The game is also just OK, way to repeative, at leas the first game was nothing more then take shelter and shot, was no variation from start to end, I cannot talk about teh second game but after the first gigantic fiasco I doubht the second game is much different.
HOLD IT!
Cliff Bleszinski is a Game Designer, and NOT a character designer. Nomura, while being a character designer (not for all Final Fantasies btw!!!), does also function as a Lead Game Designer/Game Director.
So if we’re comparing their game designs then this is a valid comparison. But if we’re comparing art styles, then this is completely wrong. Cliff is not visual/character designer/artist! Most western devs work with vis teams, and while there is always a Lead Visual/Concept Designer, it’s rare for them to take full credit for character designs.
I like pretty boys better as game characters… more appealing
Agreed.
I don’t like my men on steroids.
agreed..
pretty boys are easy when it comes to expressing themselves such as being funny, cheerful, sad, etc..
while masculine man can only do one expression: rage.. -_-
Have you played Gears 2? No? Then you have no idea. There’s one scene with one of the characters and his wife that is more emotional then any of the utter tripe that has spewed from the final fantasy series in years.
most of you are mixing characters designs with the games itself, characters designs means visuals,
personality, etc, it has nothing to do with the games… -_-
this comparison is a joke…
Comparing these two is at best, pure stupidity, so i couldnt agree more on that part.
Gamers, whether they be asian or a bleach-haired california punk, has their own preferences in games.
just my 2 cents.
Joke indeed. I think both designs suck, but if I had to choose I’d go with Nomura. I haven’t played a single FF ever and have played through Gears 1 and 2 many many times, so I’m not doing this out of fanboyism. To look like the guys in GOW you would almost HAVE to be on steroids. The designs just really cater to the pre-teen boys who have major self-esteem issues.
nice and clean VS bulky and dirtyish~
or Gar vs girly?
Nomura wins by default for providing me 98 hours of entertainment in Dissida so far.
Nomura was only responsible for character designs in Dissidia. He was not a game designer or director for that project.
The character designs were what kept me interested :D
Excessively manly vs. excessively girly…..you know what…I dunno
since when mainly means arms bigger than your head?
and wouldn’t say excessively girly, probably more excessively gayish…
How’s it not manly lol
WTF! Epic is losing… I have to say I like what Tetsuya Nomura does, but I really prefer my GOW.
The Programs are as far removed from one another as you can get, you have the unreal engine which is an epic original vs whatever the enix/insert random name engies since there are like 15 of them.
One is probaly the greatest user/player/corporation type engine ever created since every computer/console type system wants to have and want to be like it
vs
the tried and test and much loved enix system. again its all in context.
The second FF character face… The guy on the far left in the group pic… His face reminds me of the Blue Link crossplayer.
http://www.dsfanboy.com/2008/03/04/female-duo-sets-the-standard-for-link-cosplay/2
fuck, that’s why I hate these comparisons
THEY’RE NOT EVEN IN THE SAME GENRE OR CREATED FOR THE SAME PURPOSE. STOP COMPARING THEM YOU IDIOTS.
and whoever said they have Dissidia, damn you, damn you to hell.
Who cares – put those pictures side by side and compare away…
Compare what exactly?
The suggestion of this article is to compare character designs or maybe even visual design as whole, but the poll options only make sense if we’re comparing Bleszinski and Nomura’s skills and experience in game design.
No, it suggest what style we like better.
I’m just going to throw my hands up in the air and say that Nomura is a more attractive guy than CliffyB.
Artefact: well, sure, you can do that to anything, I just can’t shake off the frustration that this is another one of those West versus East shitty comparisons, that’s all. To be honest in real life either would pretty out of place, but it’s not like either’s so fucking ridiculous (well, the muscles…maybe, but I’ve seen guys with nearly that much muscle). There’s really nothing to compare with because neither is IN reality, so I just think it’s stupid to compare the two because they don’t even relate.
Sigh, you guys are really spoiling the fun when you point out too much details.
You don’t even need to get serious about such trivial things. Geez~
This was not a comparison. This was a blatant slaughter for the satisfaction of the Otaku fanbase residing here.
Let us understand the simple rules of arithmetic within this Complex:
Anything Eastern > Anything Western
One side looks like alcoholic bar thugs.
The other looks like a boy band.
Hard to choose.
Gackt + belt and zippan + generic bishie vs Y M I SO BALD + unappropriate muscle mass + generic west game character design
Whoever wins, we lose.
I like both Final Fantasy and Gears of War, but being the heterosexual male that I am, I’m going to have to side with Cliffy B. I’m just not into pretty boy characters who often have effeminate personalities. Did Nomura design Tidus from FFX? I liked the game but Tidus was about as gay as it gets.
Square Enix is a fucking joke.
The games they made are a stinking pile of good looking mess and has been for a decade now…
Glad i turned to the PC to kill time… & N00bs in FPS games.. X’D
It’s more like a pile of shit that tries to look good. Square died when they took on Enix. When they hired Nomura.
eeeee… how do you run with that huge armor?
Get real man, u r sitting duck goin to war like that LOL
Not when the bad guy’s are just as big and beefy as you.
Due to the nature of this site I think we all know who’ll win.
Being honest with myself though, Cliffy B all the way. Not only did Gears set the bar in terms of next-gen graphics, but the gameplay also turned out to spot on.
As for character designs, not really all that fussed but I’d much rather a gritted war veteran that looks the part rather than a bunch of gay-looking guys.
On that note, Square Enix needs to sort that part of their games out. If they’re going to appeal to the west, ditch the gay-looking guys that only appeal to the female Japanese audience.
SAME FACES, MORE BELTS AND ZIPPERS.
In all seriousness, Nomura’s designs seriously lack creativity. It’s not like I really like Gears design any better but I’m getting sick of seeing Nomura’s character designs.
I play GoW and FF games, and i think every design has its purpose in the game.
I pitty those who dont play games based on the character design. like some i know who dont play Valkyria Chronicles because of its Anime Design and other who dont play western based RPG’s because they are so absorbed in their bishounen and bishoujo world and arent able to enjoy a well written story or a fantastc gameplay anymore…
Wait… whats the point of comparing these two artists again?
Its like comparing apples and oranges.
“Apples are way better, they are red, you can pick one up and bite into it, the peel doesn’t lessen the taste!”
“No way you idiot! Oranges are way better! You can peel them with your hand, the slices divide up evenly without a knife, they don’t have a core to get in the way! Oranges ftw, yo”
Completely pointless comparison and discussion.
Some people prefer apples to oranges and vice versa.
both are of totally different styles. it is quite obvious.
in a way that if u talk about enix’ their design for characters are always..characters that move faster, sleeker design and a less rugged appearance. U can say thats the thing for them.
while on cliff’s side, his design is generally the opposite? they look heavy, rugged, has huge firepower and generally looks like they move slow.
i mean u’re comparing 2 designs from ppl who are from a totally different culture. Whats cool on one side is lame on the other, and generally everyone has their own idea of whats cool and not.
this isn’t a comparison =/ its which style u like better and why lol
I hate them both. Their both silly looking in my eyes. I could relate more to Blezinski’s designs being a thick necked muscular guy but it’s still silly caricaturization . As for Nomura more zippers plz.
I hate that all Japanese Males in games and in TV look like hosto fags. When in japan seeing them crawl the streets looking for desperate women, its kinda sickening, then to see them idolized in games. I hate That particular part of Japanese culture and when I see these guys in person with their eyebrows waxed and spending more time on their hair than women do, I just wanna punch em in the face…
I’ve been in Japan for a while and while I have seen such men you are talking about they were very very very rare. Unless if you’re deliberately hunting for them. You got some problems bro.
You obviously haven’t spent much time in the trendy parts of town. Host boy wannabes are a dime a freakin’ dozen.
Like you said they only gather at a certain part of town, those Host boy wannabes.
Only people that are looking for them or prostitute would find them frequently anyway.
While other would be save from seeing them.
Cliff, just because I fucking hate Tesuya “Belts n’ Zippers” Nomura and his yaoibait character designs.
Exactly.
I refuse to vote. Can’t decide. Too many unanswered questions. Which one’s better in bed? Which one’s the gay one? What if they were both gay? Or not gay?
Both are pretty awesome.
i’d vote for neither if it was an option, because i cant stand cliff’s HAMPEOPLE or nomura’s BELTS AND ZIPPERS
Sometimes you feel like being pretty, sometimes you feel like being manly.
the design of gears 2 is just amazing. i’ll go with cliffb
cole train wins this one by himself
but seriously though, i can’t choose, they’re both good designers for the games they make
“…though their art styles could not be further removed from one another.”
That’s Chris Pena’s art style. Not CliffyB.
Wording changed.
Ya know, theres really no point at all to this poll. I mean, both games are aimed at different audiences and different genres. Both character designs fit their purpose, and do it damn well might i add, and to pit them against each other… well it just creates fanboy rage and war from the people at each side, and won’t really show anything, except maybe what kind of people frequent this site (im voting on Rpg’ers maself)
Tetsuya Nomura, just because he looks sooooooooooooo moe ^____^
to begin with, I’ll say that in gameplay-wise there so much different that there’s no real comparasion there, & design, well, Gears Of War is not a bad game, I enjoy it but i just hate the designs they look like rescue heroes, in my opinion, so my choice its pretty obvious, I never ever have like the ”big muscle bad ass american hero” look, so anything that looks like that is a lose for me
didn’t really liked both…
Cliff’s is too bulky, and Tetsuya’s are just young slim boys ready to defy any physics… (yes, I know it’s fantasy, but…)
While browsing a few websites, i came across this article at 1up.com.
And CLEARLY explains in depth the great divide between Easter and Western gamers and their habits, preferences and cultural traits.
The title of the article: CLash of the Cultures.
http://www.1up.com/do/feature?pager.offset=6&cId=3155815
READ the artcle. Seriously.
It seems to trot out a lot of East-West stereotypes and not much evidence to support them… Borderline orientalism.
Neither of the above, as for Sqeeeenix I would rather stick to Y.Amano, I’m kinda tired of watching same old Tifa getting a little revamp each game since 7, same as cloud and well most of the cast that Nomura does.
In one side, wrestler’ish men, and on the other, yaoi type guys… For a game i prefer wrestler’ish guys :p
LOL! It’s like GAR VS Bishounen.
Indeed, and I side with Epic since I’m a straight male. Not that there’s any question of who will end up winning.
Both are shallow.
Bleszinski’s are stereotypical manly western character design to the point of being bloated and absurd.
Nomura’s are stereotypical pretty eastern character design to the point of being bloated and absurd.
This is one of those cases in which the adage “moderation on everything” absolutely works.
This is the most sensible comment out of the whole bunch.
Though I’d rather sum it up as “They’re both twats.”
THEY ARE BOTH THE CANCER KILLING VIDEO GAMES
goddammit why did Epic have to ruin UT3 so hard ;_;
Does anyone know what game/movie the Nomura designs are from…?
While I love prettyboy designs in Japanese games as much as the next person, those closeup pics are absolutely horrid. They’re deformed beyond belief; it’s not pretty, it’s comical. And not in a “funny ha ha” way.
I agree with many people here who said that both design serve their purpose. I am not a fan of FF so I won’t comment on that, but CliffB said himself that they only have bulky soldier because the locust kill everyone who are not that big. I mean, if you ask me, I agree that only the guys who are THAT tough will survive in that world.
Nomura hasn’t ever designed a decent looking character. It’s either over-complication with his designs or the same thing over and over.
Give me Yoshida and be fucking done with it.
Nomura’s designs = Win.
Square’s animation of his designs: *groan*
I’ll pay 1,000 dollars to anyone who teaches Squenix that you must animate both the mouth AND the eyes to portray emotions (i.e. eyes squint when smiling, cheek muscles pull upward, etc.). Until then these designs are going to be wasted on models with all of the emotional appeal of androgynous fuck-dolls.
As for Cliffy B: bitch has a serious hard-on for steroid-choked linebackers, I cannot deny this. They’re ugly as sin, admittedly, but at least they don’t appear to be mildly retarded (see ridiculous expression 1,2 and 3 from Nomura’s side).
“i.e. eyes squint when smiling, cheek muscles pull upward, etc.)”
Sounds Asian.
My vote goes to Cliffy B. He wears pimp suits to E3 because he can.
Dude Huge, please =p
Bleszinski makes too manly, I like traps.
It has to be Cliff Blezinski. But the other gay got more votes but it doesn’t matter because this comparison is, not, how do you say… right.
over the years, i started to notice how “cookie cutter” Enix’s designs are. practically all the characters look the same, they just have different hair.
Yeah and like GoW designs arn’t just Unreal Tournament and Warhammer 40,000 designs, right?
only voted for cliff out of protest.
i find bishounen of the recent final fantasy variant utterly boring, even disgusting.
Thank you.
Fucking Tetsuya Nomura.
He’s a freakin’ genius.
And you’re fucking retarded.
I choose tetsuya.
cuz I’m a weaboo!
i figure out Nomura likes beautiful men.
you guys are gays, really.
I just think that Cliff Bleszinski is a wacko.
Then again, so is Numora.
If the gears dudes more resembled the more ‘believably’ lean warriors in the 300 movie… [aka genuinely fit fighters vs. over abused steroid pushers]
I vote gears. I’d rather have manly men save the world over ambiguously designed, she-men…
Then again, to us, that’s normal, but to Japanese people, being manly makes you gay? erm…
Holy fuck.
Nomura is just as pretty as his art LOL.
I’ve never wanted a third option more than before now :|
It’s amazing how the majority of popular games from either side of the world are full with dull and typical character designs.
Examples of character designs I do like from either side of the world: Nintendo and EA Big.
What’s the name of the game on the picture by Tetsuya’s Side? :O
Looks vs. Muscle?
definitely the looks XD
All I can see is 4 excellent gay couples… Honestly, it’s like the 4 right exist to “receive” from the 4 on the left if-you-know-what-i-mean… ¬_¬
I like how not only the Japanese characters, but even the Japanese developer looks female.