Australia Bans 2D Loli – Simpsons Parody Porn Conviction
- Categories: Manga, News
- Date: Dec 11, 2008 19:06 JST
- Tags: Australia, Censorship, Courts, Doujinshi, Law, Loli, The Simpsons
A man who downloaded Simpsons 2D parody porn has been convicted for possession of pornography featuring minors.
A Supreme Court ruling against freedom of expression in the case was a landmark one, which sets a precedent banning all 2D depictions of sex which may be construed as featuring underage participants.
The man convicted was found to have erotic parody images of iconic cartoon “The Simpsons” on his computer; he was originally charged with, and convicted for, possession of (and accessing) child pornography by a local court, with a possible ten year sentence (though he received a substantial fine and probation instead).
However, he appealed, arguing that the porn could not be considered to feature actual “people”, as they “plainly and deliberately” departed from the human form.
The judge hearing his appeal at the Supreme Court disagreed, admitting that they were “markedly and deliberately different to those of any possible human being”, but holding that realism had no place in determining whether they were depictions of people.
The judge conceded that the real purpose of the law was to stop the actual acts depicted photographically, but opted to more broadly interpret the law as being intended also to prevent artistic depictions which could “fuel demand for material that does involve the abuse of children”.
His verdict was to dismiss the appeal, ordering each party to cover their own costs, due to it being “the first case dealing with this difficult issue.”
Via Stuff.
This would appear to leave very little ambiguity as to the legality of loli in Australia; in the eyes of this judge, there is near to no difference between imaginary children and real ones.
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For a country that started as a penal colony, those guys down there sure are anal with their laws.
Thus why they are so "anal"
unicef has taken australia too D:
and yet here i am.
anal? maybe not, but australia enjoys more freedoms than any other country in the world. here, if someone provokes you into hitting them, the provoker can be charged with intentionally starting a fight, while the hitter merely gets a warning. it's great, provided you can prove you got provoked.
moreover, the simpsons parody of australia is just that, a parody. everyone over here loves that episode purely cause its so far removed from the truth that its ridiculous.
sure we got some real fucked up law makers and breakers, but mean while, in america, if you suspect someone is thinking of breaking the law, you have to report it, even if they haven't stated a desire to do so, or even shown implications of doing so, or whatever. you as a citizen have to report it. i think that's a super power country thinking that it's citizens have super powers ie. telepathy.
more over, as shown on this very site, you can be arrested in japan for saying hello to a minor, or imprisoned for up to 2 years for adultery in korea.
yeah, you try telling me austrlia is anal.
tool. as an australian i can't even sit in my local park reading graphic novels i borrowed from the library not 50 meters away or listen to music without some freak thinking i'm there to prey upon children.
yes i am bearded. yes i am over 6' tall. yes i am over 110kg. and yes i do like flaunting my law breaking activities wherever i can.
but this does not make me a bad person. and yet, i get treated as a suspect person because i match ned kelly's description. because parents feel they couldn't defend their children against me should i try something at my size. because i enjoy "j" walking in front of cops.
crap. all crap. where is the freedom in the way i get treated when i have done nothing wrong. jam that firmly up your arse. the justice system here in australia is shit. you don't pay tax, you get 6 years in jail, you kill someone, you're out free in 2 weeks.
in all honesty son, i think you are a complete fool and a wanker. but what makes me really angry is that you spelt australia wrong in your last line.
Hey so stop hanging around in parks with a stupid beard, and just genreal fitting the description of child pervert... youre not an idiot, image in general is important, and by depiction of human nature, governs how we percieve the world companies government and other human beings, think about it.. if you changed youre "child predator image/ location/activites/life, you probably would have a girlfriend or wife or better job or woteva, look im not saying they are right or you are wrong but majority rules lets face it, and the only way to change is thru. exchanging ideas, and better education... but in the mean time stop putting on youre ned kelly uniform, until such time occurs dont blame the system...(even it is shit, knowing its shit and then placing yourself in a perfect position to be shitted on[intentional] makes you even shitter and potentially a maoning whining retard...
nicelydone
it's not that i'm whining or moaning about it at all. it's the fact that people have a pre-imagined view of what a predator should look like and all the slight deviations there of. i'm sure if i looked like the "blob" from the infamous 1953 film (which won best special effects that year too) of the same name, i would also be viewed as a predator.
my point being, it doesn't matter what a person looks like these days, or what your current activity, people will always look at you with suspicion if you in some way or form fit a mental image that they have of somebody who would be breaking the law. and it's not just Australia like this. it's happening all over the world. almost all catholic priests are regarded in this way, soon all cops and judges too, with doctors and teachers to follow.
shit you can't be a male teacher in Australia now unless you also have a female teacher present in the room with you at all times.
more over, why should i stop sitting in my local park, listening to music or reading comics. because of some fucking retard's opinion of me. the lady in the local toy store used to look at me weird, coming in as a guy without any kids to buy some figures. she has now accepted the fact that i like to buy them for myself and that i don't pose any threat to her or the community at large.
despite my blue eyes and clearly pale skin and italian surname, i have one guy who comes into my work, looks at my "arabic" sounding name and facial hair (which he also has) and calls me a terrorist. do you think i'm gonna quit my job because of this small minded hate mongering prick.
also, how the fuck am i supposed to change the fact that i'm over 6' tall, or my weight? if i was any skinnier i would look annorexic, people don't beleive i'm the weight i am now, and without a beard i look like my dad who really is a prick. it's hard enough retaining the distinction that he and i are two separate entities, let alone intentionally looking like him...
Now I don't know which part of Australia you're from, but what you said about a female teacher being required in the presence of a male teacher is completely false. There are hundreds of educational institutions in Sydney, and none of them abide by those claims of yours.
What the heck? That is the broadest and flimsiest interpretation I've seen/heard regarding loli law material to date. How does the judge get off conceding the fact that the law was intended for photographs and then go on to just through all art under the bus. Wow. So, by this judge's interpretation, if someone doodles a diminutive stick figure in class with small to no breasts suddenly they're liable for a maximum 10 year sentence (or a fine and probation as was the case here) because this judge does not differentiate that which "markedly" deviates from normal human forms. I know that sounds a bit hyperbolic but a good lawyer could make that case apparently if this judge was sitting. *Sigh*
Btw, almost forgot to mention...
That's the creepiest Simpsons artwork I've ever seen Artefact O_O. Especially ol' Sherri and Terri. Looks like the Shining (or Shinning ^_^), ha.
Truth be told, I think it's actually a perfect leap from the original.
I mean, it's Simpsons with an Anime style. What more can us otaku ask for?
The manganese Simpsons does work, but what the fuck is up with the Goku-ized Lisa? I'm not sure what to make of her.
I hate this country so much.
I swear im gonna move to japan.
another example of our wonderful "Child protection" laws here:
http://www.smh.com.au/news/home/technology/net-video-crime-epidemic/2008/12/11/1228584982919.html
It's just ridiculous.
Here's a news video clip about the above article. Sigh, that 'child protection' agency could be doing other 'important' things than chasing up on this crap.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=769_1228810670
im not sure i could click that link without the federal police storming my house.
Don't worry, the news company don't actually show the 'baby being abused'.
I'm disgusted by this link. Fucking stupid oversensitive Western society.
I'm not into the lolicon scene, but that's just retarded to be convicted of essentially child porn just because you had some Simpsons parody crap.
Like this guy here:
http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2008/10/24/american-faces-20-years-over-loli-manga/
When it was just a handful of his manga that was "bad". I mean, I got some Ranma 1/2 manga that sometimes feature topless 16-year-olds. I'd hate to have to trash them because of stupid shit like this.
What ended up happening with that guy? I hope he won his court case.
The case will start in February 2009.
http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2008-10-10/iowa-collector-charged-for-allegedly-obscene-manga
Speaking of Ranma 1/2. My High School library had that available for check out. Guess that means my old high school is going to be sued also. >_<
Oh since when are 2d images real people.We can't like touch them or anything or see them alive walking around the streat?
Hey, the Simpsons are not even human depiction : they only have 4 fingers on each hand !
The defence seems to have made this argument, but the judge rejected it...
"The Australian Supreme Court’s ruling against freedom of expression in the case was a landmark one, which sets a precedent banning all 2D depictions of sex which may be construed as featuring underage participants."
Err no. Any representation of a child in a sexual manner has been illegal for quite some time. Fact check plox.
Previously there had been no convictions for this sort of offence. The law is being applied in a new way which has significant implications. The judge said as much.
The judge just wants money... >_>
What the Hell?...
Each day I seem to lose more and more faith in the legal system.
It wasn't the Australian Supreme Court, only the SC of the state of New South Wales. So the rest of us are safe from stupidity, for now...
Source says only "A Supreme Court judge" - a case of "a" vs "the" I see. I presume you are correct so I will update the wording... Still, aren't these rulings able to be cited as precedent in other courts?
Simpsons? What awful taste in hentai.
Also, this makes Australia look bad.
Be cooler than that Aussies.
Shit thats scary, having to register as a sex offender because of that lol and that was the fricken simpsons.
I guess if cartoon characters are now "People" then Australia will have to put Homer (and others in the series) on trial for the many crimes they've committed.
Either that or the creators. Matt Goring had better stay out of Australia, I guess.
I used to like Australia, but this is a joke. I assume it can still be appealed, since it was just one Supreme Court justices' decision not a full court decision?
Speaking of the creators, the Simpsons movie showed Bart's naked willie. So Matt Groening can now be charged as a child pornographer.
That should be a defence too.
But unfortunately there's the issue with "nudity" and "pornography" being different.
Keep stockpiling stuff because a industrialized nation wide loli ban is coming.
When they gonna stop being stupid....? I mean, your computer is your personal belonging. How come they can sue you when you are in your legal private area? 2D considered as real human?! Simpson..?! Geeez...
Lol, Ausfailia.
Wow nice Simpsons fanart. I love Lisa and her delicious flat chest. Having said that, am I about the get raided?
damn austrailia doesnt know how to take take in creativity of art.
Lisa looks like she went Super Saiyan in the pic
Er.. yeah, anyone know how he was "caught"?
Wow, sexual hysteria is reaching new heights around the globe...
Hopefully this backlash against freedom of speech will peak soon and policies will head in the other direction. I doubt it will be within the next 20 years though. It's possible that the incoming generations will only know a world with hysterical art restrictions and they may think nothing of it because they did experience its lose.
So the law says that it's illegal to have child pron, he admits this *isn't* child porn, but "interprets" the law is meant to prevent "fueling" child porn.
Shooting people is illegal.
Ban movies with guns. It fuels crime. If you have a movie with people shooting guns, you should be arrested for murder.
Very good point there Kuro.
The same should go for people who legaly own weapons.They should be arrested for murder :P
Completely ignoring the article, I really love that picture! It's like "whoa".
While I hope this gets overturned on grounds that drawings AREN'T REAL PEOPLE... I also think the defense attorney could make a case that all the Simpsons characters are over 20 years old.
After all, they were created a long time ago.
http://www.mandalivia.com/talk/archives/2002_12.php
scroll down to the bit about rene magritte. i think the old dude really sums it up with his pipe. or rather his painting of a pipe, as the painting is not the real thing.
read more of him here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ren%C3%A9_Magritte [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/René_Magritte]
I'm not too keen on loli, so meh. However, I believe that cracking down on 2d loli is pretty pointless in stopping distribution of real child pornography. Frankly, if they don't have actual evidence showing that pedophiles "WILL" go after real children due to strong influence from 2d source material (ie. those that possess real child pornography also possess loli), then they really don't have any right to be imprisoning/charging people for having private possession of such material.
Also, if loli is so heinous, why is rape, gang bang, bdsm, S&M, and other heinous/violent material still acceptable? I mean, shouldn't they all be ruled against/banned for promoting/advocating violence against women?
In trying to frame them of being an actual threat to children is like charging someone for a crime they've "YET" to commit. They're making hasty conclusions (ie. Jumping the gun) by "ASSUMING' the person in question is an immediate threat or "WILL" be a threat to real children because they happen to be a threat to 2d children in pictures. Frankly, imo, until they find evidence of the individual having "REAL" child pornography, they really have no right to be locking the person up on such an "ASSUMPTION". I mean, just because a guy likes masturbating to rape, doesn't mean he'd condone of the act in reality.
On another note, 2d depiction is just an extension one's fantasy put forth on paper, or digitized. Unless the model they used were actual children (highly unlikely), there's really no harm in the depiction of such material, especially if it's private. There's also the argument of loli/2d material being a highly influential on the individual and will lead the individual to going after real children after he stops being satisfied with pictures; however, the argument, imho, is total bs due to the amount of logical fallacies involved.
So where are the fallacies? Well, to point out some fallacies:
1. They're post hocking by saying "A occurred before B; therefore, A caused B" (ie. They possessed 2d material before going after real children, so the possession of 2d material led to them going after real children). An exaggerated example of this fallacy would be a robber talked to a stranger on the street before going out and robbing a convenience store, so the guy who the robber talked to is directly responsible for the robber’s actions and should thus be arrested with the robber. As a certain someone above probably said, just because the material potentially influenced them, doesn't mean it forced them to do something. Regardless of how influential such material is, it's the “INDIVIDUAL” who ultimately makes the decision to commit the crime (ie. going after real children, and not just 2d pictures), and not the material. That being said, the individual are usually grown adults, who are for the most part well aware of the fact that RAPE/abusing children is ILLEGAL. The source material did not point a gun to the individual's head/brainwash them into believing such things were acceptable, so blaming the source material for the crime is ludicrous.
2. The unspoken fallacy would probably be ad hominem/guilt by association. They're pegging all pedophiles as heinous inhuman brainless retards who can't distinguish between right and wrong. In short, they're stereotyping.
Like my previous example pointed it out with other violent sex fetishes, and as someone before me pointed out with the case of violence in movies, I'd like to ask a rhetorical question, "If works of fictions are so influential for everything wrong with society, why not just ban them all?" My answer to the question would be because just because the work of fiction isn't in the wrong. Just because something is influential, doesn't mean it's directly responsible. To blame the work of fiction for the wrong doings of its audience is like asking someone for their free advice, taking it, and then blaming the person for being a retard when the advice they gave turned out to be wrong. IMO, the person who's responsible for the mistake isn't the one who handed out the advice, but the one who chose to take it.
I'm not advocating loli, I'm just saying I don't care enough for it to make a legal issue out of it. I have better things to do than waste my time trying to ban something that's merely an eyesore. I'm also just pointing out what people choose to ignore, such as the other side of the argument. Here's a hypothetical stance some of you could consider. Think of a fetish you hate, and wish erased off the face of the earth just because you hat it. For me, I hate futanari, yaoi, bestiality, guro, and scat. I wish that such fetishes be banned in all countries. However, would I actually bother protesting against such material and put forth a motion to ban it? Probably not, since it really doesn't affect me, and the material isn't exactly wrong for any real reason, nor is it doing me or anyone else any grave harm contrary to popular belief/assumptions.
That being said, imho, so long as those who have private possession of 2d material aren't abusing real children, or taking part in any *REAL* criminal activities such as actual illegal distribution of such material, it's not really any of my concern, nor is it anyone else's. What people choose to jerk off to, or fantasize about is none of my concern. So long as they don't act on their fantasies, in my books, they aren't criminals. On another note, I'd much rather have these people put their fantasies on paper, than them acting on it by going out and committing heinous crimes because of pent up desires.
This ends my tl;dr rant that probably should have been posted on a blog or summarized into 3 sentences. “Shit is harmless. I don’t care. Spend tax payer’s money on something that fucking matters.”
here here, amen, well put Rawr
Minority Report, I think, is a good food for thought. Seeing the future and arresting the person before they commit the crime? Or preventing the crime without harming anyone?
There is always someone to blame, even before something happens.
Ok seems like a real toshokan sensou(library wars anime) is happening,becouse there are a lot of bans and censorship stuff going on lately.
We need to learn how to fight back!!
I'm surprised the 2ch trolls aren't making "YOU CAN MARRY CARTOONS IN AUSTRALIA" jokes after all the whale meat research trolling by Australians.
Still one question after all post comment, no body say how government know he downloaded those pic & store in computer. There are million downloading pics every min in Australia so how to track this guy??
The descendents of rapists legislating morality. Fascinating.
That this was over something as ridiculously cartoony as the Simpsons shows that NO ONE is safe. I know there are fans out there who think "well, I like big-breasted anime characters and not lolis, so no one's going to call me a pedophile", but those fans are wrong. The moral crusaders will just make up new bullshit reasons (example: "large eyes = childlike", or "smooth wide face" = "childlike") and convict you based on that. The hysteria over pedophilia is emotional and illogical, and the ones running the movement have gone mad with power and are eager to tar as many people as possible with the pedophile label.
If we let them persecute people based on what are clearly unrealistic fantasies, then they can AND WILL go after everyone they can. Do not appease or compromise with those hysterical moralists, because they will stab you in the back as soon as they can. Either stand strong together, or die separately.
"You like butterfly fairies with ample boobage?! YOU DISGUSTING PEDO! YOU CLEARLY LUST FOR FOETUSES!"
"Do not appease or compromise with those hysterical moralists, because they will stab you in the back as soon as they can. Either stand strong together, or die separately."
This might be a necro reply, but... this. To all those that might think "Oh well, not relevant to my interests, anyway" - you should think about what this great anon has said.
These attacks on the freedom of expression leave me outraged. They attack lolicons because they are a soft target, unlikely to gain any support from the average person who doesn't take the time to understand exactly what is happening.
If this is allowed to continue it will only get worse.
They came first for the lolicons, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a lolicon.
Remind me to never go to Australia to avoid problems.
I JUST GOOGLED LOLICON, AM I GOING TO BE CAUGHT!? I DIDN'T KNOW! Halp.
I'm Australian mate, and need to admit...our legal system is just full with shit load of crap! Aside from banning loli 2D completely, there are still many other problems this bloody country need to solve:
poverty, alcohol fueled violence, discrimination against aborigin indingenous people, etc and etc.
I'm sure with global economic crisis on the tail, those politicians, legal officers and other hipocrites could use their brains to think about something to make this country better rather than trying to divert our attention to such silly subject.
Err, Where did you get the picture of the Simsons like the one shown here?
i think they just wanted to publicly humiliate him as a way of saying anyone else who does is gonna get the same
This makes me want going at an internet cafe, download a loli anime picture and starting scream "Hey, listen up, everyone! I'm a lolicon! See what I'm looking at the pc!" to see everyone's reaction. Will they ignore me? Will they say "Shut up, we're playing here!"? Will they kick me out? Will they call the police? What do you think? :P
Try! See what happens! =P
The main issue with this case is that it doesn't make clear what constitutes loli and what doesn't. If a woman were to look like she were 12, yet be over 18, it would be legal to make pornographic images of her, yet if the same images were to be rendered in 2D, it would be illegal? I smell discrimination. The automatic assumption is that 'flat chest = loli'.
The law is an arse. I hate Australia, and I intend on leaving this crappy country as soon as I can.
Something like this happening is old. The band Intense Hammer Rage got a HEAVY fine and norrowly avoided jail for having an album cover with a drawing depicting necrophilia.
one less sick fuck. fuck you japan get your retard shit out of my country
Ow, the Commonwealth is more doomed than everywhere else I guess.
I'm an Aussie and I have never heard of this incident! nor of these laws! looks like my rights are going straight down the down like what feminists are doing to people's rights in other countries.
BE PREPARED if it's happening here then it's only a matter of time before it happens elsewhere (every other country)!